Public Disorder & the Decline of Vancouver's Livability

[hollywoodnorth]

Toronto to deter encampments by contracting private security guards to patrol some parks 24/7

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/t...uards-patrol-parks-encampments-1.6449169



we really need to do the same here.

[Klazu]

Originally Posted by hollywoodnorth

Toronto to deter encampments by contracting private security guards to patrol some parks 24/7

Atira and BC Housing CEOs be like:

[Migrant_Coconut]

Contracted security guards are expected to act as the city's eyes and ears in the six parks they patrol and will not be involved in enforcement.

Then what the hell's the point? Even VPL guards have the authority to evict or detain a suspect.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by hollywoodnorth

we really need to do the same here.

If we did you'd complain about the tax increase required.

[CivicBlues]

Originally Posted by Klazu

Atira and BC Housing CEOs be like:

I...I don't think you understand how this meme works.

[whatnext]

Jeez, this Supreme Court ruling today sets a terrible precedent for those seeking justice from attackers in Vancouver and across the country:

Supreme Court restores Calgary man's acquittal for attacking woman while high on magic mushrooms

In a unanimous decision, the country's top court has restored the acquittal for a Calgary man who, while naked and high on mushrooms, attacked a professor with a broom handle after breaking into her home.

Former Mount Royal University student Matthew Brown was charged with break-and-enter and aggravated assault after a 2018 incident that left Janet Hamnett with broken bones in her hands.

Brown's is one of three cases the Supreme Court of Canada (SCC) ruled on on Friday that deal with whether the defence of extreme intoxication to the point of automatism — a term describing unconscious, involuntary behaviour — is available to those who chose to take drugs and then end up committing acts of violence.

The court has deemed the section of the Criminal Code preventing the use of the defence to be unconstitutional....

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/s...oms-extreme-intoxication-brown-1.6451012

[FarmerHaight]

Originally Posted by whatnext

Jeez, this Supreme Court ruling today sets a terrible precedent for those seeking justice from attackers in Vancouver and across the country

Automatism has been a big question in the courts for a number of years, and it isn't just because of stranger-on-stranger attacks. See R. v. Stone (1999) and R. v. S.H. (2014) and R. v. Luedecke (2008). This doesn't set a precedent, it follows precedent.

[Phil McAvity]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

If anybody wanted them to die, we can just shut down all the shelters and let the winter finish them off - that's "letting them rot." Or we can find a middle ground that allows them to get help.

We've been talking about the hardcore criminals this entire time: quote, "we are talking about people who create problems for other good folks here." Non-offenders only need a safe place to live and get back on their feet.

What you don't seem to understand is there's tons of help for them from treatment centers to soup kitchens to recovery programs to food banks to government programs to counselling to 12 step programs to churchs, the problem is, they're not interested, they would rather be anti-social criminals. Were it not for so many bleeding heart lefties these days, they would all be shipped out of town in cattle cars to await their fate like the Jews were in Germany

[Vin]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

If we did you'd complain about the tax increase required.

Not really. Safer city centres encourage businesses to move in and thrive. The City receives an increased tax base, and hence individual tax decreases. Think please.

Originally Posted by hollywoodnorth

Toronto to deter encampments by contracting private security guards to patrol some parks 24/7

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/t...uards-patrol-parks-encampments-1.6449169

we really need to do the same here.

It's Toronto: they run their place like a big city. I don't think villagers here understand.

[Vin]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

If anybody wanted them to die, we can just shut down all the shelters and let the winter finish them off - that's "letting them rot." Or we can find a middle ground that allows them to get help.

We've been talking about the hardcore criminals this entire time: quote, "we are talking about people who create problems for other good folks here." Non-offenders only need a safe place to live and get back on their feet.

Correction: the labour camp is for hardcore criminals, and the latest topic isn't about that, so I implore you to stop bringing that in, kapish?

Cold turkey shelters can save addicts, and even if all the shelters are shut in the winter, they will still live. Addicts can still shoot up and die even with the shelters opened, and you seem to be OK with that.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by Vin

Not really. Safer city centres encourage businesses to move in and thrive. The City receives an increased tax base, and hence individual tax decreases. Think please.

It's Toronto: they run their place like a big city. I don't think villagers here understand.

If you're kicking people out of parks, where do you think they will go?

LOL Toronto. Please move there and let us know in 8 years.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by Vin

Cold turkey shelters can save addicts, and even if all the shelters are shut in the winter, they will still live. Addicts can still shoot up and die even with the shelters opened, and you seem to be OK with that.

Why don't you set up a recovery organization? You seem to have all of the ideas. I bet you could clean this whole city up!

[Vin]

My own experience on the craziness of this city:

This morning on the way to work, I saw a drugged-out guy jay-walking across Nelson Street with full oncoming traffic. A couple of cars had to switch lanes to avoid hitting him. In the middle of the last lane before reaching the curb, he suddenly blacked out and fell, hitting his head on the road in the process. He just slumped over in the middle of the lane, like someone shot dead by a snipper. A guy ran over and began standing over him to make sure no traffic came his way. I ran over and made a 911 emergency call. The addict was turning ghost-white pale, he tried to wake up but blacked out once again, with his body convulsing and twitching. As the 911 dispatcher and I chatted, this other guy constantly talked to him, while I stood to direct traffic. After a while, the guy looked dead, and he did not seem to be breathing much. Miraculously, after a few minutes, two Outreach nurses came over and administered him: one gave him CPR while the other jabbed him with Naloxone. After the paramedics arrived, I took off. Needless to say, I was a little late for work.

I've had this thought all day that if this guy were to pass out anywhere where no one could see him, he would be with the Maker this instant. However, with the lack of oxygen going into his head while OD-ing, I can imagine how much damage his brain is receiving. No wonder so many folks here are considered mentally compromised.

[Vin]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

If you're kicking people out of parks, where do you think they will go?

LOL Toronto. Please move there and let us know in 8 years.

Sorry, I don't need to follow the advice of someone who is triggered in the wrong way.

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Why don't you set up a recovery organization? You seem to have all of the ideas. I bet you could clean this whole city up!

I suppose you haven't seen this piece of news?

B.C. considering real-time monitoring and forced treatment programs for repeat offenders
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/b-c-repeat-offenders-1.6443379

If I have my way, I would've done this like a decade ago, and we wouldn't be in this mess today.

[Phil McAvity]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Why don't you set up a recovery organization? You seem to have all of the ideas. I bet you could clean this whole city up!

As I said, there is plenty of support for people now, however there's also a contingent of the homeless that rack up the lion's share of crime and they should be shipped out of town in cattle cars and they would be if not for all the lefties insisting we try and help them instead, except they're resistant to help and that's the problem

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by Phil McAvity

As I said, there is plenty of support for people now, however there's also a contingent of the homeless that rack up the lion's share of crime and they should be shipped out of town in cattle cars and they would be if not for all the lefties insisting we try and help them instead, except they're resistant to help and that's the problem

Cattle cars? To where exactly?

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by Vin

If I have my way, I would've done this like a decade ago, and we wouldn't be in this mess today.

I'm pretty sure that report won't have gulags as a recommended solution.

[Phil McAvity]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

Funny, because other friends say he was the ringleader. I'll check out the NYT one once I have a free article.

If I post links, you start nitpicking over tiny minutiae because the source itself proves my point. If I don't post links, that means I'm uncooperative. Face it - you're just looking to continue a fight that you can't win; by your own logic, you've already conceded to me long ago that the DTES is the result of a housing shortage and not PTSD or lack of church, which is what everybody's already been saying.

I haven't nitpicked anything you've posted my disagreement has been germane to the topic however I think you've been smoking the devil's lettuce yourself because i'm not the one who's claimed that the housing shortage is responsible for the opioid epidemic/homelessness, you are, so you're clearly confused about my position, which is that the main factors driving the opiod epidemic/homelessness is the breakdown of the nuclear family which results in mental health problems and addiction. Falling church attendance is also a factor but the main problem are single-parents. The housing shortage is not a big factor in opioid addiction/homelessness which has been your claim. Another way I know housing has little to do with it is because when I lived in an SRO in the DTES at one point I had two jobs so housing was no impediment

[Migrant_Coconut]

Originally Posted by Phil McAvity

What you don't seem to understand is there's tons of help for them from treatment centers to soup kitchens to recovery programs to food banks to government programs to counselling to 12 step programs to churchs, the problem is, they're not interested, they would rather be anti-social criminals. Were it not for so many bleeding heart lefties these days, they would all be shipped out of town in cattle cars to await their fate like the Jews were in Germany

And that help is more than enough for the 80% that aren’t problem cases. The other 20% need other measures.

Originally Posted by Vin

Correction: the labour camp is for hardcore criminals, and the latest topic isn't about that, so I implore you to stop bringing that in, kapish?

Cold turkey shelters can save addicts, and even if all the shelters are shut in the winter, they will still live. Addicts can still shoot up and die even with the shelters opened, and you seem to be OK with that.

Hey, you’re the one moving the goalposts, go ahead. And it’s “capiche.”

Because they can't possibly die in a cold-turkey shelter, which is somehow open when all the others are closed in this scenario? We've got safe injection sites and a detox centre (and a future replacement centre) for junkies to clean themselves up.

[Migrant_Coconut]

Originally Posted by Phil McAvity

I haven't nitpicked anything you've posted my disagreement has been germane to the topic however I think you've been smoking the devil's lettuce yourself because i'm not the one who's claimed that the housing shortage is responsible for the opioid epidemic/homelessness, you are, so you're clearly confused about my position, which is that the main factors driving the opiod epidemic/homelessness is the breakdown of the nuclear family which results in mental health problems and addiction. Falling church attendance is also a factor but the main problem are single-parents. The housing shortage is not a big factor in opioid addiction/homelessness which has been your claim. Another way I know housing has little to do with it is because when I lived in an SRO in the DTES at one point I had two jobs so housing was no impediment

Gave you two studies you asked for, you decided that academic achievement and social status didn't meet your definition of "faring better." Oh well.

No, lack of housing is my argument. That's my point: you had a shelter; many don't, or got one too late. Most employers won't hire people without a fixed address. No job, no home, perfect target for dealers.