NHL heading to Winnipeg!!!

[Joshy]

Originally Posted by trueviking

the moose will likely be heading to Saskatchewan......they will be close to winnipeg at any rate.

It's been officially announced that the Moose are moving to St. John's.

http://www.thetelegram.com/News/Loca...for-St-Johns/1

[CorbeauNoir]

Originally Posted by DrJoe

Sorry if this has been asked already but what is going on with the MTS Centre? Even at 100% capacity Winnipeg would have ranked 24th in attendance this year.

Maybe they intend on gouging people to make up the difference but long term how sustainable is that?

-Raw attendance is an overrated stat, what's more important is how much money you're making per seat. 15000 people all paying for their tickets/food/beer/merch is always going to be better than 18000 people with half of them attending with giveaway tickets and concession discounts.
-Expanding the MTS makes little financial sense. It would severely disrupt any team/event at the arena (I can't possibly imagine such a massive expansion being completed during the offseason being feasable). They'd be the cheapest seats in the house, so even if they did pop the roof and add extra seats the cost of constructing and maintaining that extra seating isn't going to be compensated by the earnings from those seats - certainly not to any degree that would make it worthwhile
-TNSE have abundant sources of alternate revenue at their disposal. Even without an NHL team MTS is a very busy arena, and the developing entertainment district downtown will be feeding off an NHL tennant. A Winnipeg team would not be operating in an economic vacuum, there are strategies in place that compensate for the lack of a few thousand cheap seats.

Both TNSE and the NHL have repeatedly stated that the arena is perfectly fine for NHL hockey - if they didn't there'd be no chance of a team returning to Manitoba in the first place. Nobody is looking for Winnipeg to become a pseudo-Maple Leafs economic juggernaut for the NHL (though I've seen cynics draft up seating price charts that if actually implemented would easily surpass Toronto's per-game attendance revenue). A team in Winnipeg would offer middle-of-the-road stability and trustworthy, reliable owners who actually know what they're doing - which is exactly what the NHL needs in the wake of these franchise crises.

[reidjr]

Originally Posted by CorbeauNoir

-Raw attendance is an overrated stat, what's more important is how much money you're making per seat. 15000 people all paying for their tickets/food/beer/merch is always going to be better than 18000 people with half of them attending with giveaway tickets and concession discounts.
-Expanding the MTS makes little financial sense. It would severely disrupt any team/event at the arena (I can't possibly imagine such a massive expansion being completed during the offseason being feasable). They'd be the cheapest seats in the house, so even if they did pop the roof and add extra seats the cost of constructing and maintaining that extra seating isn't going to be compensated by the earnings from those seats - certainly not to any degree that would make it worthwhile
-TNSE have abundant sources of alternate revenue at their disposal. Even without an NHL team MTS is a very busy arena, and the developing entertainment district downtown will be feeding off an NHL tennant. A Winnipeg team would not be operating in an economic vacuum, there are strategies in place that compensate for the lack of a few thousand cheap seats.

Both TNSE and the NHL have repeatedly stated that the arena is perfectly fine for NHL hockey - if they didn't there'd be no chance of a team returning to Manitoba in the first place. Nobody is looking for Winnipeg to become a pseudo-Maple Leafs economic juggernaut for the NHL (though I've seen cynics draft up seating price charts that if actually implemented would easily surpass Toronto's per-game attendance revenue). A team in Winnipeg would offer middle-of-the-road stability and trustworthy, reliable owners who actually know what they're doing - which is exactly what the NHL needs in the wake of these franchise crises.

The key for winnipeg is to limit cheap tickets and give aways and if they do that they will be just fine.

[CorbeauNoir]

Originally Posted by reidjr

The key for winnipeg is to limit cheap tickets and give aways and if they do that they will be just fine.

Exactly. There's certainly a little bit less room for error than there might be in larger cities, but success or failure of a new team in Winnipeg isn't going to hinge on the existence of 2000 nosebleed seats.

[roccerfeller]

re: financial discussion, yeah freeweed posted a nice comparison of how even at Moose AHL prices, they'd still be making more money (when looking solely at tickets)



People can mark this post, but in a year I think how much money Winnipeg's NHL team makes will surprise people.

Likely, it will be 4th in revenue out of the (soon to be) 7 Canadian teams, and not just for the first year (yes, ahead of Cal, Edm, Ott)

Why? because people are really looking way too much into attendance numbers.

Don't focus on the small picture.

This ownership group, TNSE, is key. Wouldn't be possible without them. They have a huge business plan.

[PoscStudent]

The Winnipeg Jets and the St. John's Jets.

[ZeDgE]

Is this for sure yet? If so congrats to Winnipeg! I can see the standing ovations at each Canadian arena for their first games in each city.

[roccerfeller]

Originally Posted by ZeDgE

Is this for sure yet? If so congrats to Winnipeg! I can see the standing ovations at each Canadian arena for their first games in each city.

its done

just waiting on official announcement is all

stephen brunt is right

[freeweed]

Originally Posted by SpikePhanta

But I thought that Dominos will be the one supporting the new Winnipeg team

Is this a subtle pun about how Winnipeg is just the first domino to fall, and once that happens several more dominoes will fall (ie: more teams will be moving north)?

[freeweed]

Originally Posted by ZeDgE

Is this for sure yet? If so congrats to Winnipeg! I can see the standing ovations at each Canadian arena for their first games in each city.

Absolutely. I'm a Flames STH (boo! hiss! I so can't wait to have more of the 'peggers in the NHL season threads here!) and I've already had 5 separate requests for tix for a "Jets" game since Thursday. People are excited about this across the entire country.

Edit: this was post 10,000 for me. Goddamnit, too much time here.

[Only The Lonely..]

Originally Posted by PoscStudent

The Winnipeg Jets and the St. John's Jets.

Even better if the St. John's Jets become our farm team.

It would be nice to have an Atlantic Canada connection again like we had with the Moncton Hawks.

[Ayreonaut]

Originally Posted by Only The Lonely..

Even better if the St. John's Jets become our farm team.

It would be nice to have an Atlantic Canada connection again like we had with the Moncton Hawks.

That would be cool for me too. It would be tough to support a team with ties to the Canucks.

[Only The Lonely..]

Originally Posted by freeweed

Absolutely. I'm a Flames STH (boo! hiss! I so can't wait to have more of the 'peggers in the NHL season threads here!) and I've already had 5 separate requests for tix for a "Jets" game since Thursday. People are excited about this across the entire country.

Edit: this was post 10,000 for me. Goddamnit, too much time here.

10,000 posts congratulations man! Based on your many hours on this forum, it looks like you took the oath of celibacy for skyscraperpage.com.

[Bassic Lab]

Originally Posted by roccerfeller

re: financial discussion, yeah freeweed posted a nice comparison of how even at Moose AHL prices, they'd still be making more money (when looking solely at tickets)



People can mark this post, but in a year I think how much money Winnipeg's NHL team makes will surprise people.

Likely, it will be 4th in revenue out of the (soon to be) 7 Canadian teams, and not just for the first year (yes, ahead of Cal, Edm, Ott)

Why? because people are really looking way too much into attendance numbers.

Don't focus on the small picture.

This ownership group, TNSE, is key. Wouldn't be possible without them. They have a huge business plan.

That is really stretching it. TNSE's vaguely related developments might make their outfit more profitable but they cannot be considered team revenue. By that logic the Leafs' revenue is through the roof because of Cadillac Fairview's malls.

Winnipeg will likely not be able to raise as much revenue at the gate, through local television contracts, or via advertising as the other Canadian teams. That is pretty well all of the team revenue that is not centrally generated by the league and thus the same for every team. That said, those three numbers should still be quite a bit larger than the league average. I have little doubt that Winnipeg will prove to be a viable market, much more so than cities where hockey simply isn't popular, simply because it is in Canada but I doubt it will do better than larger cities with larger arenas and the same culturally attuned kind of fans.

[Andy6]

Originally Posted by Bassic Lab

That is really stretching it. TNSE's vaguely related developments might make their outfit more profitable but they cannot be considered team revenue. By that logic the Leafs' revenue is through the roof because of Cadillac Fairview's malls.

Not really. The TNSE developments are contingent on having the Jets (or whatever they're to be called). So it might not make sense as an apples-to-apples comparison with other teams, but for TNSE, the question is how much can you make from the entire operation -- hotel, bars, arena, hockey club (the linchpin), office complex and parking. That's what they're looking at. It's synergies, to use the buzzword.

[Bassic Lab]

Originally Posted by Andy6

Not really. The TNSE developments are contingent on having the Jets (or whatever they're to be called). So it might not make sense as an apples-to-apples comparison with other teams, but for TNSE, the question is how much can you make from the entire operation -- hotel, bars, arena, hockey club (the linchpin), office complex and parking. That's what they're looking at. It's synergies, to use the buzzword.

Well a line must be drawn somewhere between the team and the other business interests of the various owners. There will undoubtedly be some kind of connections between those ventures, whether it be MLSE's condo developments near the ACC or the Molson's strange mix of beer, hockey, and nationalism, but I tend to think that the team is the team and only its revenue counts. The confabulation of the different ventures can lead to Phoenix type situations where creating a mall/downtown on the edge of a metro is seen as a hockey team's raison d'être.

[roccerfeller]

Originally Posted by Bassic Lab

That is really stretching it. TNSE's vaguely related developments might make their outfit more profitable but they cannot be considered team revenue. By that logic the Leafs' revenue is through the roof because of Cadillac Fairview's malls.

Winnipeg will likely not be able to raise as much revenue at the gate, through local television contracts, or via advertising as the other Canadian teams. That is pretty well all of the team revenue that is not centrally generated by the league and thus the same for every team. That said, those three numbers should still be quite a bit larger than the league average. I have little doubt that Winnipeg will prove to be a viable market, much more so than cities where hockey simply isn't popular, simply because it is in Canada but I doubt it will do better than larger cities with larger arenas and the same culturally attuned kind of fans.

Get back at me in 5 yrs

all im gonna say on this point. its all speculation on either side, but informed speculation on mine.

trust me, if other NHL cities have the type of system TNSE will have, they will be making amounts of money that people can't believe...Calgary could be a top 5 revenue team easily with a similar set up for the city.

you have permission to rub it in my face 5 yrs from now if my claims are proven unsubstantiated

[PoscStudent]

Originally Posted by Only The Lonely..

Even better if the St. John's Jets become our farm team.

It would be nice to have an Atlantic Canada connection again like we had with the Moncton Hawks.

St. John's is going to be Winnipeg's farm team. Here's more information.
http://www.thetelegram.com/News/Loca...%26rsquo%3Bs/1

[freeweed]

Originally Posted by Only The Lonely..

10,000 posts congratulations man! Based on your many hours on this forum, it looks like you took the oath of celibacy for skyscraperpage.com.

Sadly no, it's just an indication of how quickly I type. Plus I have a lenient at-work Internet policy.

[freeweed]

Originally Posted by roccerfeller

trust me, if other NHL cities have the type of system TNSE will have, they will be making amounts of money that people can't believe...Calgary could be a top 5 revenue team easily with a similar set up for the city.

Yeah, Calgary is a good comparison. I'm not privy to exactly how the money flows, but the Saddledome is not owned by the Flames. They do not have access to all sorts of revenue streams, yet they manage to turn a profit most years.

Granted, Calgary and Winnipeg are polar opposites economically, but TNSE has their shit together. And if not, let them lose money. I don't see why people are so down on the whole thing. For fuck's sake, hundreds of people closed the city's busiest intersection ON A RUMOUR. If that doesn't show insane passion for the game, nothing does.