Salt Lake City: Official Development News Thread - Part 5

[airhero]

Originally Posted by jubguy3

Does anyone have renderings for the milagro apartments / AC hotel, and also the Morton on 250S 200E

Oh I forgot about the Morton. Those renderings are all on downtownrising. They aren't great quality though.

[delts145]

The large list of cities for Amazon HQ2 will be narrowed down at some point. While the chances of Salt Lake City getting the headquarters are slim, it would be cool if it does make a finals cut list of say 5 finalists. I hope they do have a finalist list before the ultimate decision.

[jubguy3]

I like developments like the Morton. It's a shame when developers grab onto hundreds of feet of street fronts and turn the entire thing into apartments w/no street engagement (liberty Wells, 400S 700E comes to mind...) It's hideous. Hopefully more will take advantage of SLC's long plots w/ narrow street fronts. Some more right-sized developments that fine to mind are the Lotus on South Temple and Providence place on 100 S (though it is a corner lot).

[Always Sunny in SLC]

Originally Posted by jubguy3

I like developments like the Morton. It's a shame when developers grab onto hundreds of feet of street fronts and turn the entire thing into apartments w/no street engagement (liberty Wells, 400S 700E comes to mind...) It's hideous. Hopefully more will take advantage of SLC's long plots w/ narrow street fronts. Some more right-sized developments that fine to mind are the Lotus on South Temple and Providence place on 100 S (though it is a corner lot).

I am also hopeful that as the city's density increases you will see many of these apartments with gyms or offices for the apartment management converted to retail spaces. I don't think that is a long shot considering that would certainly increase their revenue per square. I think many are hesitant now because there isn't enough local traffic to make it real compelling.

[airhero]

I just realized something. I feel stupid for not thinking of it sooner. The Holding family owns the entire block the Little America and Grand America are on (at least I am assuming they still do). The Holding family has strong local ties. I was thinking the Sheraton lot would be a possibility for expansion in the future, but since the owners probably don't have strong local ties, I'm guessing they won't be terribly easy to work with.

Clearly, no part of the Grand America is going anywhere, but the Little America is different. It's comprised of both a main tower portion and the rest is motel-like. The motel portion occupies slightly more than 7 acres. I'm thinking the Holdings could work out a deal with Amazon. They'll continue to operate the Little America as is until the time comes when Amazon would need to expand beyond the 400 S Main block, and Amazon could then build on the motel portion of the Little America block. The main tower portion would stay. This Amazon development would be an incredible boon to both the America hotels, so I can't see the Holdings being against this.

Developing to the south of 400 S Main would also tie in well to the Patrinely development at 600 South Main.

Also, the portion of the county lot that hasn't been developed on yet is bigger than I thought. It's almost 1 acre. The main CCRI lot that would be offered is 10 acres. That brings the total acreage to 18 acres, or almost 800,000 sq ft, which is possibly enough room for the entire square footage needed.

That makes 3 owners, all who would have an extremely vested interest in bringing Amazon to the southern end of downtown.

Hopefully the city, county, LDS Church, and Holding family are already talking to each other about this but I have a fear that they are not.

Here's a map of the parcels. Sheraton lot is in red, but I'm not including that in my fantasy anymore since it's not ideal. CCRI and empty county lots in green, Little America motel portion in blue, and of course the parking lot directly south of Little America is where the Patrinely development would go:



As you can see, Amazon would own over 300 feet of frontage on both sides of Main Street where Courthouse Station is.

[RC14]

I never realized how much underdeveloped land there is on the Little America block. It looks like they could build three more towers on that block.

[Always Sunny in SLC]

Originally Posted by airhero

I just realized something. I feel stupid for not thinking of it sooner. The Holding family owns the entire block the Little America and Grand America are on (at least I am assuming they still do). The Holding family has strong local ties. I was thinking the Sheraton lot would be a possibility for expansion in the future, but since the owners probably don't have strong local ties, I'm guessing they won't be terribly easy to work with.

Clearly, no part of the Grand America is going anywhere, but the Little America is different. It's comprised of both a main tower portion and the rest is motel-like. The motel portion occupies slightly more than 7 acres. I'm thinking the Holdings could work out a deal with Amazon. They'll continue to operate the Little America as is until the time comes when Amazon would need to expand beyond the 400 S Main block, and Amazon could then build on the motel portion of the Little America block. The main tower portion would stay. This Amazon development would be an incredible boon to both the America hotels, so I can't see the Holdings being against this.

Developing to the south of 400 S Main would also tie in well to the Patrinely development at 600 South Main.

Also, the portion of the county lot that hasn't been developed on yet is bigger than I thought. It's almost 1 acre. The main CCRI lot that would be offered is 10 acres. That brings the total acreage to 18 acres, or almost 800,000 sq ft, which is possibly enough room for the entire square footage needed.

That makes 3 owners, all who would have an extremely vested interest in bringing Amazon to the southern end of downtown.

Hopefully the city, county, LDS Church, and Holding family are already talking to each other about this but I have a fear that they are not.

Here's a map of the parcels. Sheraton lot is in red, but I'm not including that in my fantasy anymore since it's not ideal. CCRI and empty county lots in green, Little America motel portion in blue, and of course the parking lot directly south of Little America is where the Patrinely development would go:



As you can see, Amazon would own over 300 feet of frontage on both sides of Main Street where Courthouse Station is.

This is a great idea. I keep ready headlines of people thinking Amazon already has the area in mind and is just using this as a way to extract the most out of that city without knowing it. If that is true, it is a smart idea, although I am not sure I buy it. Regardless, these companies have got to be careful because there may eventually be a lot of blow back for always trying to get as much corporate welfare as possible.

[Utah_Dave]

I like the idea of corporations working with State governments to make a project happen but I don't like the states seemingly having no limits on subsidies for economic development. I don't pretend to know how the process works but I would like to see projects above a certain dollar value be voted on or perhaps a budget approved by the voters every other year to keep things in check by the tax payer. I heard Wisconsin gave some big concessions recently. I think there could be a better way to do it without the states giving away the bank to land a mega deal like this.

Furthermore Amazon is having difficulty filling all the job openings in Seattle and I'm concerned that they see Salt Lake as perhaps too small a market to fill the void. I would point out that our projected growth and population growth is second to none in the US and could be an excellent selling point. I really hope we have good people on this that can work well with all the parties that need to be involved on an Amazon sized project. If they do start to narrow down the potential list it will be interesting to see where Salt Lake falls on the list.

[airhero]

Originally Posted by RC14

I never realized how much underdeveloped land there is on the Little America block. It looks like they could build three more towers on that block.

At least 3. You could probably fit five buildings ranging from 200 to 400 feet without getting too crammed.

Also everyone keep in mind that although the rfp mentions they would like potential for 8 million as ft and 50,000 employees, it's pretty unlikely that will happen in just one city, even over 15 years. The rfp is for the first 500,000 square feet, with potential for expansion.

[airhero]

Also I did get an email back from Spencer Cox's assistant, who had the following to say:

Thank you very much for your message. I will be with Lt. Governor Cox all day today and will make sure that he sees it and takes it into consideration. As you may imagine, Lt. Gov. Cox, Gov. Herbert and many others here at the Capitol and in other Utah state agencies are very aware of this opportunity and are doing everything they can to show Amazon that Utah is the best place for this expansion. The location you outlined on 400 South Main Street is one of several locations that are being considered for Utah's bid and the information you provided is useful. We all hope that we can make this happen for our state. It is a huge deal and very exciting.

Thank you once again for sharing your thoughts and helpful details on this opportunity with Lt. Governor Cox and his team. Please continue to share with us anything you think we need to know and anything that you think would be helpful.


Kind of generic response but at least it seems that 400 S Main is a consideration and possibilities are being explored for it.

[Always Sunny in SLC]

Originally Posted by airhero

Also I did get an email back from Spencer Cox's assistant, who had the following to say:

Thank you very much for your message. I will be with Lt. Governor Cox all day today and will make sure that he sees it and takes it into consideration. As you may imagine, Lt. Gov. Cox, Gov. Herbert and many others here at the Capitol and in other Utah state agencies are very aware of this opportunity and are doing everything they can to show Amazon that Utah is the best place for this expansion. The location you outlined on 400 South Main Street is one of several locations that are being considered for Utah's bid and the information you provided is useful. We all hope that we can make this happen for our state. It is a huge deal and very exciting.

Thank you once again for sharing your thoughts and helpful details on this opportunity with Lt. Governor Cox and his team. Please continue to share with us anything you think we need to know and anything that you think would be helpful.


Kind of generic response but at least it seems that 400 S Main is a consideration and possibilities are being explored for it.

Actually I don't think you got a generic response. I am impressed with the response from an assistant. I get the impression you were taken seriously.

[airhero]

Originally Posted by Always Sunny in SLC

Actually I don't think you got a generic response. I am impressed with the response from an assistant. I get the impression you were taken seriously.

At the very least it was read, considered, and responded to, so actually I agree with you.

[airhero]

19 buildings with 8 million square feet of office space in south DT!

In what I'm sure many of you hope is my last post on Amazon HQ2, I will share some sketchup work to show what 8 million square feet could look like on the aforementioned parcels if terrible architects/planners were involved. The campus, if actually built, would certainly make more sense than what I'm showing here. Also, because of a glitch, all the buildings are levitating 50-75 feet above the ground, so the rooflines are consequently that much higher than they should be. I left a lot of open space and assumed all parking would be underground.

Looking at it really makes me doubt SLC could handle something like this, but if Amazon ended up building roughly half of what they are saying they will(which is entirely possible), then SLC could probably support it.

But nonetheless here is 8 million:







Since it looked awkward, I added in the already built 111 and pretty much every proposal we've heard any specifics about (CCH, Held Properties, Ritchie Group, Cascade, 151, Regent Street Hotel) and two extras on the Carl's Jr lot and State Street and 400 S, because those have to be developed in the next 15 years:

[Always Sunny in SLC]

That would have a tremendous impact on the skyline and I can imagine on the downtown infrastructure.

[StevenF]

First off, Airhero I have no issues with you going nuts with posts about Amazon speculation as its much better discussion than what was going on before it.

Originally Posted by Always Sunny in SLC

That would have a tremendous impact on the skyline and I can imagine on the downtown infrastructure.

It would look awesome!! I would also hope SLC will focus heavily on the downtown circular for TRAX soon to help solidify this deal. Having the Black line running would make things much easier getting to and from the airport for Amazon Execs.

[Hatman]

Originally Posted by airhero

At the very least it was read, considered, and responded to, so actually I agree with you.

It is extremely cool that you reached out to Spencer Cox. You win the Awesomeness Award for the day. But even cooler than that is that he responded with what is clearly more than a copy/paste response, and that they are taking that location seriously.

It really is the best place for a corporate headquarters. The Draper Prison site is bad bad bad, sooo bad.

I think that if the 400 South site is submitted SLC stands a chance of getting at least some corporate jobs from Amazon. I think the best case scenario for us is that Amazon decides to break up their 'headquarters 2' into a bunch of smaller satellite offices spread around the country. I don't think we could support an Amazon full-build-out, but we could definitely handle a phase 1. Perhaps that is Amazon's scheme all along - to get many cities involved and have so many tax-incentive deals offered that they will be better of by selecting many of them, rather than only one.

Thanks airhero. You are doing the Lord's Work.

[StevenF]

Thing is that shows ~8 million sq ft of just office space. We all know having this kind of development would also draw others downtown as well in the form of more office space as well as retail and housing. Something like this could potentially add in 20,000+ more residents into Salt Lake City. If Salt Lake was to get this I would hope developers take note and can get the financing to build housing before housing is a larger issue than it is today.

[San Diego-Honolulu]

http://money.cnn.com/2017/09/11/tech...ies/index.html

Atlanta, Boston, Austin, Pittsburgh, Dallas, Washington DC, San Jose, and Toronto. No mention of Salt Lake City. The eight cities listed are all great options.

I think it will come down to Austin or Atlanta. I know Delta Air Lines has a corporate contract with Amazon and with Delta having a hub in Seattle and its largest hub in Atlanta, I think that definitely helps Atlanta. Also like Seattle, Atlanta has a ton of Fortune 500 companies in the area already.

[asies1981]

Update on the Violin School Commons. It should go before the planning commission in the next month or two.

[asies1981]

Originally Posted by San Diego-Honolulu

http://money.cnn.com/2017/09/11/tech...ies/index.html

Atlanta, Boston, Austin, Pittsburgh, Dallas, Washington DC, San Jose, and Toronto. No mention of Salt Lake City. The eight cities listed are all great options.

I think it will come down to Austin or Atlanta. I know Delta Air Lines has a corporate contract with Amazon and with Delta having a hub in Seattle and its largest hub in Atlanta, I think that definitely helps Atlanta. Also like Seattle, Atlanta has a ton of Fortune 500 companies in the area already.

Of the cities listed, Austin has the most limited public transit network. That could eliminate it from consideration.