LOS ANGELES | Downtown Project Rundown 4.0

[alki]

Originally Posted by 202_Cyclist

One of the slides shows the new urban district connected to the LA river. Perhaps I just enjoy these multi-use trails but if downtown is connected to the LA River and the proposed 52-mile bike path, this will be a very significant improvement.

I don't remember what's in that area right next to the river.......except Amtrak runs right along it.......but it would be nice to see a residential area develop next to it. I remember it being 10-15 blocks east of Spring St so its a bit of a jaunt but if the river and the adjacent park becomes a desirable attraction/anchor, people might want to live nearby....esp if they work DT.

[alki]

Originally Posted by bmfarley

I really like the potential. Who doesn't like parks.... Except homeless haters.

Anyway, for the large park to have legs, a plan for the railroads needs to occur. No plan for them means.... No park.

Anyone have $2 billion available, because that's what it will likely cost to relocate and rebuild the RR in a place that makes sense to them.

Where would you relocate the railroad? I don't see why you can't build around it.

[Wilcal]

Originally Posted by alki

Definitely hyper-speed.......most cities don't move as fast. And yes, I understand the frustration of Hunter K and others. They want the finished product. Understandable. But that's not going to happen any time soon so why not enjoy the process.

Amen. Shouldn't this be the last word on the topic (at least for a while), ladies and gentlemen?

[brudy]

Originally Posted by alki

Definitely hyper-speed.......most cities don't move as fast. And yes, I understand the frustration of Hunter K and others. They want the finished product. Understandable. But that's not going to happen any time soon so why not enjoy the process.

It's certainly exciting to live in downtown with so much going on in terms of development. That's one of the reasons I choose to live here. And I am enjoying the process in some ways more than others. It's cool to see these buildings go up. Despite the Broad museum being close by I often watch the webcam. But there are still practical issues with living downtown that can make it difficult. And it's frustrating that people attack me just because I'm voicing some of those difficulties.

Most people here on this forum don't want a balanced, realistic view of downtown. I guess I can accept that, but I don't understand it. There's nothing wrong with the current state of downtown. It's going in the right direction. So what's wrong with being realistic about its current state? And it is years and years away from being even close to fully realized and the elongated timelines are a seriously issue. 7 years for the downtown connector (1.9 miles of subway)? 3 years for a 2 acre park? Those timelines seem like fair discussion points, but people here think that's all fine and dandy just because those projects are announced and started. It's like many forumers are just playing SimCity while residents are actually living it and experiencing it and dealing with it.

[Valyrian Steel]

Originally Posted by brudy

Who the hell is saying anybody hates it? There is a serious lack of nuance and understanding on this board. Just because I don't think everything is great about downtown doesn't mean I hate LA.

Don't you have a lawn to cut or a bbq to go to?

That wasn't directed at you. Hunter was beginning to talk about LA as a whole and he has named other cities previously as being better.

I don't have lawns to cut, unless you wanna hire me. But I'm not sure your building has any grass.

I understand being disappointed at what's currently available ... or not available downtown. But why move there in the first place if you're not happy with what it has to offer? Why move in to a neighborhood that has suffered decades of neglect and is just recovering if you're not willing to deal with the negatives?

[alki]

Originally Posted by brudy

It's certainly exciting to live in downtown with so much going on in terms of development. That's one of the reasons I choose to live here. And I am enjoying the process in some ways more than others. It's cool to see these buildings go up. Despite the Broad museum being close by I often watch the webcam. But there are still practical issues with living downtown that can make it difficult. And it's frustrating that people attack me just because I'm voicing some of those difficulties.

Most people here on this forum don't want a balanced, realistic view of downtown. I guess I can accept that, but I don't understand it. There's nothing wrong with the current state of downtown. It's going in the right direction. So what's wrong with being realistic about its current state? And it is years and years away from being even close to fully realized and the elongated timelines are a seriously issue. 7 years for the downtown connector (1.9 miles of subway)? 3 years for a 2 acre park? Those timelines seem like fair discussion points, but people here think that's all fine and dandy just because those projects are announced and started. It's like many forumers are just playing SimCity while residents are actually living it and experiencing it and dealing with it.

I don't think its that they don't want a balanced view. Its the anger that comes with pointing out the negatives.....esp with Hunter. Its as if DT is intentionally thwarting people who live DT so they will be miserable. And its getting to the point where its almost petty.

Look I know exactly what you're going through. I lived in Highland Park BEFORE it got discovered. Frankly it was a piss hole.....literally. People would stop and pee along the street. You talk about garlic.........I couldn't buy a decent head of lettuce within miles of my house. I had to go to Pasadena or S. Pas for groceries. On Cinco de Mayo, we slept downstairs for fear that a bullet would come through the roof and kill us.

When you are a pioneer, there are some serious frustrations and drawbacks whether founding a colony in Jamestown or settling in the Wild West or moving into Highland Park or DTLA........and in the case of the first two examples, you may end up losing your life.

I think what Eclipse pointed out is pretty accurate. If its too much, then maybe you need to get out. After 8 years in Highland Park, I realized I had to get out.....the place had finally gotten to me. Nothing wrong with admitting I wasn't into it anymore. Maybe that's where you are at......again nothing wrong with it.

If not, I think the key is learning to enjoy the process while downplaying as much as possible the negatives. With Highland Park circa 1998, there wasn't much improvement going on. With DTLA circa 2013, its a very different story. There is a lot happening to offset those negatives. FWIW.

Edit. Let me add.......I very much appreciate your posts........I think you have some very good insights into what makes cities work. And because of my HP experience, I am not bothered all that much by the negative comments. I think I understand the frustration behind them. Again.....FWIW.

[bobcat]

Yeah, it's true that the pace of development can be excruciatingly slow in LA, but the speed at which DTLA is evolving is really something else. It's hard to think of any neighborhood that has transitioned from low end to high end as quickly as what's occurring in DTLA at the moment.

Fifteen years ago DTLA was just an empty shell, most residents living either on the streets or in SROs. And while the neighborhood is still patchy, we now have a Ritz Carlton, luxury boutiques, and soon a Whole Foods. The new owners of Macy's Plaza are renovating the place and actively seeking luxury retailers. The food court at the nearby 7th and Fig is amazing!

And despite all this TJ's still hasn't moved into the area yet. Crazy!

[bmfarley]

Originally Posted by alki

Where would you relocate the railroad? I don't see why you can't build around it.

The large park in the image included ball fields and such. A large railroad operation sits there. I don't see how it would be feasible to have recreational fields in the that location. Someone would need to go. If the RR goes.... Someone would need to pay for that, and, that will not be cheap. Billions of $.

http://archpaper.com/uploads/piggyback_yards_05.jpg

[Eightball]

Originally Posted by alki

When you are a pioneer, there are some serious frustrations and drawbacks whether founding a colony in Jamestown or settling in the Wild West or moving into Highland Park or DTLA...

Whaaat... failing to see the similarities there!

[sopas ej]

Originally Posted by chris08876

Whole Foods is Coming to Downtown

Time to start moving out, early-adopting Downtowners, 'cause gentrification is complete: Whole Foods has just announced it'll be moving into the enormous Eighth & Grand mixed-user when it's built. You'll have a while to apartment-shop, though, because the project has barely begun--the 42,000-square-foot store is set to open in 2015. Downtowners have been dying for a Whole Foods for years, and a rep says "We've been looking for the right space for close to 10 years as we know that access to natural and organic foods in this neighborhood has been challenging. It makes us very happy to know that we will be filling this need. And, we look forward to working closely with the local community as well as Councilmember Huizar's office as we develop a store that delivers exactly what the community wants and needs." Downtown, which for years offered only a Ralphs, has seen a grocery store boom lately, with a CityTarget, Smart & Final, and Urban Radish all opening recently.

=============
Adrian Glick Kudler, 2013, http://la.curbed.com/archives/2013/07/holy_shit_whole_foods_is_coming_to_downtown.php

2015? Seriously? The building that it's going into isn't even built yet. Isn't that a bit optimistic? As it is, we're almost already into 2014.

[sopas ej]

Originally Posted by brudy

Here are some bad iphone shots of that victorian facade that will be saved as part of this low income housing project at 4th and Main.

Though I'm glad the façades will be saved, these buildings are essentially being demolished on the inside, the façades becoming mere shells, which somehow saddens me. It's similar to what's been done to some of the buildings in Old Pasadena; the One Colorado complex comes to mind. Incidentally, I thought I remember reading somewhere years ago that because of what was done to some of the buildings at the One Colorado complex, those buildings lost their status as being part of the National Register of Historic Places.

[Illithid Dude]

Was there even anything on the interior to salvage? Those low-income housing projects don't often fair well on the inside.

[ConstructDTLA]

Originally Posted by Illithid Dude

Was there even anything on the interior to salvage? Those low-income housing projects don't often fair well on the inside.

The interior was likely butchered decades ago. Still, LA is completely shooting itself in the foot (again) by lining Main with low income housing. 5 years from now I wonder how many low income buildings there will be on just Spring, Main, and Los Angeles.

[LosAngelesSportsFan]

Originally Posted by sopas ej

2015? Seriously? The building that it's going into isn't even built yet. Isn't that a bit optimistic? As it is, we're almost already into 2014.

why? its an 8 story building thats under construction. early to mid 2015 sounds about right

[Illithid Dude]

Originally Posted by HunterK

The interior was likely butchered decades ago. Still, LA is completely shooting itself in the foot (again) by lining Main with low income housing. 5 years from now I wonder how many low income buildings there will be on just Spring, Main, and Los Angeles.

Yeah. My biggest issue with downtown is that they are clumping all the low income housing in one area. I don't think there is anything on Spring, though, besides the Alexandria.

[citywatch]

Originally Posted by alki

Let me add.......I very much appreciate your posts........I think you have some very good insights into what makes cities work. And because of my HP experience, I am not bothered all that much by the negative comments. I think I understand the frustration behind them.

I second that. Any forumer who actually lives in dt, or spends lots of time there, automatically gets more of my attention and curiosity. Although I often hope their reactions will be more positive than not, if they're witnessing things in the hood from a close up angle & are less than thrilled, then I take their opinions to heart.....assuming they're not excessively dissatisfied.

someone like me, in comparison, is an armchair urbanist or sort of a backseat driver. for instance, I personally haven't dealt with a crime associated with the rough spots in LA, or have to look over my shoulder with concern about being a victim of such crime on a regular basis....or haven't had to deal with aggressive panhandlers...or haven't had to live near very rundown places 24/7, or places where lots of troublemaking occurs. If I did, I'd perceive dt differently compared with someone who....as is true in my case....lives miles away.

The biggest debbie downers or negative nancies in this forum imho are the ones who nitpick or gripe about what I'd consider as rather minor or obscure aspects of a new proj in dtla....particularly complaints about a bldg's height or an architectural design that in their eyes is not superb or totally wonderful.

[citywatch]

Originally Posted by sopas ej

Though I'm glad the façades will be saved, these buildings are essentially being demolished on the inside, the façades becoming mere shells, which somehow saddens me.

fwiw, one of the most famous historic bldgs in the US, the White House, was gutted back in the 1950s & its interior completely rebuilt. So America's most well known residence, in effect, actually is only about 60 years old.

btw, thanks for the pics, brudy. Why you...or as colemonkee has done in the past....feel the need to apologize about the quality of your photos baffles me. They look perfectly fine to me, & there can never be too many pics here showing the ongoing changes to dt. Plus such pics help keep this thread alive & do offset moods of pessimism or impatience that I sometimes will feel about the hood.

[inSaeculaSaeculorum]

I wonder if any other city threads on the city compilation subforum have the amount of urban identity crisis and infighting as the LA one does

[edluva]

Originally Posted by inSaeculaSaeculorum

I wonder if any other city threads on the city compilation subforum have the amount of urban identity crisis and infighting as the LA one does

kinda says a lot about the city in question doesn't it?

[blackcat23]

Delete