Salt Lake:Official development news thread

[smartdev]

Interesting article in the SL Tribune today...

Higher power?
LDS tower tallest, but there's no law against topping it
By Heather May
The Salt Lake Tribune
Article Last Updated: 02/02/2007 06:10:44 AM MST


The LDS Church, as an institution, towers over everything else in Utah. But, contrary to popular myth, it doesn't insist that its tallest building do the same.
Sure, it owns the state's tallest skyscraper, the 435-foot-tall Church Office Building (COB). And no builder has reached loftier heights (though a famed architect aims to try). After all, it would be sacrilegious - and against city code - to aspire higher.
Or so goes the urban legend.
Thing is, it's a myth, one church officials debunked during the 2002 Winter Olympics and one Salt Lake City planner Doug Dansie frequently encounters.
"There's no maximum height" downtown, he said.
City regulations do dictate buildings on corners be no taller than 375 feet, but they also offer developers ways to get around the rule.
If someone wants to build a 50-story sky-rise, Dansie said, "there's nothing legally preventing him from doing that. There's a process to go through."
So if architect Frank Gehry wanted to erect the 450-foot-high hotel he has planned for Lehi in Salt Lake City instead, he could do so.
But why hasn't someone already tried to top the COB? Dansie offers a guess: humility.
"If you look at other cities, part of the marketing of a building is for corporate bragging rights. It's a great corporate tool to have
the Sears building [in Chicago] be the world's tallest, for a while. Salt Lake's not a big corporate-headquarters town. There's no ego driving it."
And if the biggest corporations deserve the biggest buildings, preserving the 28-story COB's status makes sense. "One could argue the LDS Church is the biggest corporate headquarters that we have," Dansie said.
The church - which stated Thursday it takes "no position" on city building heights - won't be eclipsing itself when it puts up new towers downtown as part of City Creek Center. The tallest on the drawing board, a condo high-rise on 100 South between West Temple and Main, scrapes the sky at 415 feet.
Jake Boyer, president of The Boyer Co., has heard the folklore. But that wasn't what stunted his 24-story One Utah Center on the corner of 200 South and Main.
"I don't think that's the height that it is necessarily because of the Church Office Building," Boyer said. "It's based on market conditions and the size the market would permit. If we had a tenant that wanted to take 40 stories, I don't think we'd really hesitate."
John Dahlstrom, executive vice president of Wasatch Property Management, pays the myth no mind. His company is headquartered at the Wells Fargo Building, the city's second-tallest at 440 feet, but only because of a 37-foot radio tower, according to company figures.
His company has tentative plans for a building that could surpass the COB. Preliminary drawings call for a 33-story tower on the corner of 400 South and State.
"People have said the church doesn't want anything built higher than the Church Office Building," Dahlstrom said. "I always thought the zoning laws drive it more than what the church wants."
Even so, the COB may forever appear taller. It does, after all, boast an exalted place, about 95 feet higher than land on 400 South.
"The Church Office Building has an inherent advantage," Dansie said. "It's on higher ground."
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[Makid]

I have sent emails to both Wasatch Property and the SLC Chamber asking for information. Wasatch was asked about the property at 4th and State. I asked the Chamber for info about the WTC. Hopefully they will both be quick to answer so that we can get some information.

We should also be hearing about the Cowboy Partners towers in the next couple of months or so.

[Makid]

I have heard back from the Chamber regarding the WTC building.

They have submitted the papers yesterday for request for license and construction agreements.

They haven't picked a location yet.

Looks like total space that will be taken up with state agencies is close to 350,000 sq feet and they are wanting equal space to be for WTC complimentary companies.

The 350,000 state agencies requirement is from 2 of the forms that they sent, 255,000 on one and 100,000 on another. Plus they want to put in space for the University of Utah.

I got the response from the President of the Utah WTC. He sent a lengthy PDF file with all the information that they had to go through and the papers that they had to sign to get the process going from here.

So by the response that I got from them. It looks like Wasatch Partners tower is seperate from the WTC at this time.

And it does look like the WTC wants at least 700,000sq feet for thier building. Now to have it nice and thin...not WFB big but more of Gateway Tower West thin.

[wrendog]

how big is 700k sq ft in comparison to other downtown towers? thanks for the responses.. so it really could mean we could have FIVE new towers over 25 stories in the next couple of years.. sweet

[Makid]

I think that the HP tower at 21 stories is supposed to be 450,000sq feet. If that number is correct, a 700,000sq ft tower using the same dimensions would be 33 to 35 stories.

[SLC Projects]

Sweet is right...

The highrises just keep on coming...

Last week we got word on "City Creek Center Tower II" at 32 stories

Then this week there was that "Frank Gehry Hotel Tower" at 45 stories

And now the 33 story office building on 4th and state.

Wow.

In fact that reminds me I was driving down state in downtown and as I was driving by 400 south I did notice a For lease sign on that parking lot on the coner of 4th and State.

Things are happening in downtown for sure.

[SLC Projects]

oh and also I went by the Gateway mall today after work and it looks like crews have broken ground on the 5 Gateway Building on the south end of the gateway.

[gbb]

I don't think that the 222 South Main building is too far away from breaking ground. I don't know of a timeline, but I do know of the local architectural firm that is preparing the construction documents for the tower. So, things should be happening soon...

[wrendog]

for real? I sure hope so.. comrade here on the board has said that it is off indefinitely.. with all these proposals, I would love to start seeing some start breaking ground..

[SLC Projects]

Originally Posted by gbb

I don't think that the 222 South Main building is too far away from breaking ground. I don't know of a timeline, but I do know of the local architectural firm that is preparing the construction documents for the tower. So, things should be happening soon...

I hope your right. HP should of broken ground like five years ago. LOL. But I still think this is the year for them to get this project started.

[jedikermit]

Originally Posted by SLC Projects

oh and also I went by the Gateway mall today after work and it looks like crews have broken ground on the 5 Gateway Building on the south end of the gateway.

If the Gateway "towers" actually WERE towers, I'd be more excited about them. As they are, they're just another office park to me--an office park that's drawing long-standing downtown/Main Street businesses away from the core. Not too FAR away, granted, but I think Main Street really lost something when the Salt Lake Tribune offices moved from 143 South Main Street and to Gateway.

[gbb]

I would be pretty surprised if nothing happened with 222 South Main this year.

And I agree, it is too bad that the SLTrib moved over to The Gateway. They did get some added visibility with their name being seen from the freeway, but still...

[jedikermit]

Originally Posted by gbb

And I agree, it is too bad that the SLTrib moved over to The Gateway. They did get some added visibility with their name being seen from the freeway, but still...

Yeah. And believe me, I know they needed an updated building of some kind for the Tribune--I worked in the Tribune Building for seven years. But moving over to that generic building tucked in among all the other generic midrises just hurts a bit.

[Viperlord]

I think the gateway should be able to build up to the 200' height limit. That would still allow it to not take away from the core that much. Cause the way that the gateway is starting to look is horrible. You have 3-4 blocks of all these buildings that look the same, plus they are only 125' tall or less. Its a giant low rise mass. Its starting to look horrible.

[gbb]

Originally Posted by Viperlord

Cause the way that the gateway is starting to look is horrible. You have 3-4 blocks of all these buildings that look the same, plus they are only 125' tall or less. Its a giant low rise mass. Its starting to look horrible.

So, I take it you don't appreciate one large, monochromatic mass of buildings? I mean, isn't it affectionately called 'The Beigeway'?

I think it has been successful, and for that I do appreciate it. but I do wish they would venture a little bit farther away from their current color pallette. It could still appear unified as a development while allowing for at least some variations in styles and colors.

[SLC Projects]

Originally Posted by Viperlord

I think the gateway should be able to build up to the 200' height limit. That would still allow it to not take away from the core that much. Cause the way that the gateway is starting to look is horrible. You have 3-4 blocks of all these buildings that look the same, plus they are only 125' tall or less. Its a giant low rise mass. Its starting to look horrible.

I do agree that Gateway seems to have a limit of building colors and design. These Gateway office buildings are called "Towers" Not sure why, but they are. "1 Gateway Tower 2 Gateway Tower all the way up to 4 now. And 5 has now broken ground. But this one is going to be the shortest one at only five stories. I think it is weak that it's not even that tall. But for that part of town it will add a little density. We got to remember that Gateway use to just be a train yard with empty one or two story warehouses. It has come along ways since late 1999 when ground was broken.
But Gateway now is big. Taking up 3 to 4 blocks. I think the boyer company should think about building UP with some of their plan office buildings.
Word is they are planning on building TWO more 8 story buildings on the North end where that big parking lot is now. It would be nice to see these buildings taller, but I think there is a hight limit to that part of downtown.

[N2I.F.]

From SmilingBob, "Church Office Building (COB) still has a height advantage."

From the Tribune:

Even so, the COB may forever appear taller. It does, after all, boast an exalted place, about 95 feet higher than land on 400 South.

"The Church Office Building has an inherent advantage," Dansie said. "It's on higher ground."

SmilingBob - Where is your Shelley sign? Am I the only one to notice you want Gilligan instead of a sign about Shelley to be associated with your name?

If I hadn't seen the same sign and known where it is I probably wouldn't have noticed your change. Are you trying to tell the world you went to high school where the Russets are the mascot? If so, shoot me a PM. We may have some to talk about, depite me not being from District #60.

[delts145]

Also posted on the Gehry Thread.

Demand high for downtown housing!!!



By Dave Anderton
Deseret Morning News
Carl Warren has lived in Paris, Singapore and New York City, but the former senior executive at IBM decided Salt Lake City was the best place to spend his retirement years.


Laura Seitz, Deseret Morning News
Carl Warren, a retired executive, and his wife, Laura, live in downtown Salt Lake City. The number of people age 65 and older is expected to rise dramatically in Utah over the next 20 years. Carl Warren says the rush of proposed downtown housing could lure many people to Utah.

Warren is not alone in choosing Salt Lake as a residential destination.
Over the next 20 years, Utah will witness a 140 percent increase in the number of people ages 65 and older, according to a November report by the Brookings Institute. This "age-wave," according to the report, will have profound effects on America's cities, shaping how and where baby boomers and seniors live.
Those changes will be felt strongly in Salt Lake City, where a rush of new residential housing is planned.
The city already has roughly 3,400 residential units in the central business district, providing housing to 6,000 people, according to James Wood, director of the University of Utah's Bureau of Economic and Business Research.
Over the next five years, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints' estimated $1.5 billion City Creek Center project in downtown Salt Lake City will add five new residential towers to the skyline, with about 430 new residential housing units.
But if market conditions and demand are strong, the number of residential units in the project could be as high as 700, according to Dale Bills, spokesman for City Creek Center.
According to Wood, the demand for owning a piece of the City Creek Center is already beginning to outstrip what is planned.
About 500 people have expressed interest in the towers, according to Mark Gibbons, president of the church's real-estate arm, Property Reserve Inc. And Gibbons has noted that units will not go on sale for at least another two years.
"I've had people call me and ask, 'How do I get on the list?"' Wood said. "If you're a real devout Mormon, to have that sort of address and location is very appealing. There's not many of those around."


Zimmer Gunsul Frasca
An artist's depiction of housing units at the planned City Creek Center in downtown Salt Lake City. About 430 units are set for the huge development, but demand could push that to 700.

Wood calls the church's plans "the most significant transformation" the city has ever seen in downtown Salt Lake City.
"There certainly are a lot more people that would like that address than there is going to be available units," Wood said. "I'm sure that some of those units will be in the same family for generations."
Had the City Creek Center been finished in 2005, when Warren and his wife, Laura, were looking to buy, the couple today likely would be living in a suite overlooking Temple Square. The proposed residential towers, Warren said, could be a catalyst to get his out-of-state friends to move to Salt Lake City.
"We have a lot of close friends in the New York City and the Washington, D.C., areas," Warren said. "Most of them, when they get to retirement age, they head back here. The ones that will be coming will look very, very seriously at those apartments."
Jaren L. Davis, broker at Coldwell Banker Residential Brokerage in Sandy, said today's homebuyers are looking not only at location when purchasing a home, but also at lifestyle. Downtown's proximity and convenience to cultural and entertainment attractions, Davis said, is appealing to a new set of buyers.
"People are thinking more in terms of, 'How do I allow myself in my time off from work to be out recreating?' And it isn't in the back yard cutting the lawn," Davis said. "It used to be that the developer would look to that product as being for an empty nester, but we could see families moving down there."
Even without the City Creek Center, interest in living downtown remains strong.
At the American Towers condominiums, located at 48 W. 300 South in downtown Salt Lake City, only nine of the towers' 357 units are currently for sale on the Multiple Listing Service, according to Davis. Smaller units are selling for $240,000 for 927 square feet of space. Larger units are listed at more than $500,000. Two units in the tower are currently under contract in the $350,000 to $430,000 range.
Gibbons said the City Creek Center's condominiums will be offered at a wide range of prices. One of the towers, called Tower 2, is planned to rise 415 feet above the ground, which would make it the third tallest building in Salt Lake City, behind the Wells Fargo Center (422 feet) and LDS Church Office Building (420 feet), according to Emporis.com.
"Right now there is interest and demand for downtown, not just with the LDS Church. There are other tremendous projects that are being announced and built," Davis said. "Yeah, there is probably going to be some overbuilding, but developers will go into that appreciating that and probably make efforts to avoid competing."
At the Metro Condominiums, currently under construction at 350 S. 200 East, 200 people last year put down $2,500 each to get on a waiting list to buy one of the project's 117 units, priced at $120,000 to $510,000. The units will be completed in early 2008. In addition to the reservation holders, another 1,400 people signed a list expressing interest in the Metro Condominiums.
Andrew Pratt, branch broker and director of sales and marketing for the Metro, said people from as far away as Australia are on the reservation list.
"It's mostly local," Pratt said. "Our biggest out-of-state buyers are certainly from California. But we draw from New York. We draw from Washington, D.C."

[jedikermit]

Good to know--the demand is definitely there, for both residential and office space...and there are enough "old, rich Mormons" who'd pony up the $$$ to live there. The condos just north of the Conference Center (about ten stories, brown and white, ugly things) always have a waiting list to get in there...

In fact, if my parents weren't so anti-condo, I could see them being ideal candidates for these things. They're at either the symphony, ballet or opera at least twice a month--they might as well live downtown...

[SLC Projects]

Crazy-Goat.
Downtown Strip Club Out of Business
February 5th, 2007 @ 12:56pm

SALT LAKE CITY (AP) -- A strip club at the center of a legal dispute with The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints has closed, ending exotic dancing in the downtown business district.

The Crazy Goat Saloon -- formerly the Dead Goat -- went out of business in December, city records show. No club can take its place because changes in zoning laws ban strip clubs near Temple Square, the headquarters of the Mormon church.

The church sued the city in 2003 to prevent the club's opening. Lawyers argued the club with seminude dancers would pose a public nuisance and interfere with plans for redevelopment of the downtown malls. A 3rd District Court judge rejected those arguments and ruled in the city's favor. Church lawyers appealed the decision to the Utah Supreme Court, but now say the case is moot.

"It's closed, and the Dead Goat has relinquished the (sexually oriented business) license," said Alan Sullivan, an attorney for the church. "So far as we're concerned, the case is over."

City leaders regretted granting club owner Daniel Darger a sexually oriented business license and voted to change city ordinances in 2004. Exotic dancing clubs are now restricted to the city's west-side industrial zones.

The Crazy Goat was the last remaining business in the Arrow Press Square building on West Temple. A brokerage firm spokesman said the building is now under contract for sale.

The location is considered prime downtown real estate, sitting across the street from the Salt Palace convention center and near the Crossroads Plaza mall, which is being demolished to make way for the $1 billion City Creek Center development that will include retail shops, commercial space and housing.