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  #8941  
Old Posted Jul 20, 2013, 9:53 PM
Wilcal Wilcal is offline
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I found a link to an article which explains why it is so difficult (and expensive) to develop in downtown Los Angeles

http://djcoregon.com/news/2012/04/11/loc...ay-developing-in-la-is-more-complicated/
     
     
  #8942  
Old Posted Jul 20, 2013, 10:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Illithid Dude View Post
He may convert buildings, but he does so in the worst possible way, with no actual respect to the building. For example, look how he destroyed the lovely building on Spring and Sixth by painting it an atrocious shade of teal and haphazardly cutting out windows on what was once a beautiful marble facade. Or look how hideous ducts and vents spew out of the bottom floor of all his building. Or look how the signage he uses is so low quality that it rusts after a year, smearing the facades, and that he doesn't care enough to repaint them.
Let me add........I doubt he has financing lined up for three major bldgs this late in the apt cycle. The guy sounds like a showboat.
     
     
  #8943  
Old Posted Jul 20, 2013, 10:13 PM
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Too much red tape. They need to be friendlier for development. Growth is very important and affects everyone one way or another (Jobs,retail,parks,ect.).
     
     
  #8944  
Old Posted Jul 20, 2013, 10:15 PM
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Originally Posted by citywatch View Post
I think that best sums up LA today compared with the past.

Ppl who troll message boards will happily disagree, & armchair urbanists who tend to over analyze why things work or don't work will debate until they're blue in the face no matter what, but all things considered....all things being equal....I think the city today is better than the city you left behind.
Definitely. I still can't get over how much things have changed in the last 15 years. Not only that but the stronger DT gets the more improvement we'll see in the neighborhoods adjacent to DT.
     
     
  #8945  
Old Posted Jul 20, 2013, 10:19 PM
Wilcal Wilcal is offline
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Originally Posted by Illithid Dude View Post
He may convert buildings, but he does so in the worst possible way, with no actual respect to the building. For example, look how he destroyed the lovely building on Spring and Sixth by painting it an atrocious shade of teal and haphazardly cutting out windows on what was once a beautiful marble facade. Or look how hideous ducts and vents spew out of the bottom floor of all his building. Or look how the signage he uses is so low quality that it rusts after a year, smearing the facades, and that he doesn't care enough to repaint them.
I checked it out on Google earth. I think that that building was the old BofA built in the late fifties right after the city's height limit was repealed. I also think that it is one of Claude Beelman's last works. The color is weird, why paint marble which can be such a beautiful and expensive stone? And yes, the protruding vents do look curious. Hasn't this man also had legal troubles with his tenants? If he is serious about building I hope that he finds a quality architecture/design firm. So far he seems very much like Geoff Palmer using either some in-house or very low scale firm, you know the one Merde Architectural Designs Inc.
     
     
  #8946  
Old Posted Jul 21, 2013, 2:58 AM
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Today:

Olympic & Hill


IMG_0004 by Nightsky Emperor, on Flickr


IMG_0005 by Nightsky Emperor, on Flickr

9th & Olive


IMG_0002 by Nightsky Emperor, on Flickr


IMG_0006 by Nightsky Emperor, on Flickr


IMG_0007 by Nightsky Emperor, on Flickr
     
     
  #8947  
Old Posted Jul 21, 2013, 6:09 AM
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StethJeff StethJeff is offline
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Originally Posted by SoCalKid View Post
Why does everyone hate on Barry Shy? I mean that as a legitimate question, I'm unfamiliar with the issues that people have with him. From my understanding he has converted a number of beautiful historic vacant buildings into apartments with ground floor retail. Isn't that exactly what we want?
Just read the Yelp reviews from his former and current tenants.
     
     
  #8948  
Old Posted Jul 21, 2013, 3:59 PM
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Is the earthwork which wraps around the Chase bank building part of the 32 story tower or part of Onni's second project (tower) for the site? From my understanding of the project the tower under construction incorporates all parking below and above ground, so why the additional excavation?

Last edited by Wilcal; Jul 22, 2013 at 1:36 AM. Reason: correct word
     
     
  #8949  
Old Posted Jul 21, 2013, 5:24 PM
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Originally Posted by StethJeff View Post
Just read the Yelp reviews from his former and current tenants.
I'm a former tenant in SB Tower. My experience living there was ok, but getting our full security deposit back was a pain in the ass. But our deposit was not that big in the first place (we moved in when they were still trying to entice people to move in and fill the building up), and we only lost a couple hundred bucks in the end, but I know some people that put larger deposits down that lost a couple thousand. That's how Barry Shy does business. The plan from the outset is to do whatever is necessary to get as much of the deposit as possible, and to stonewall if tenants are wise to California's laws and ask for all the documentation for the expenses. Its a total abuse of the security deposit system, and I'm sure it'll catch up with him eventually when someone decides to pursue a class action lawsuit against him.

His renovations are also done on the cheap. SB Tower was supposed to be his luxury building, but if you look at the way things are constructed, its awful. I know a couple of former tenants and one of the current retail tenants that had big problems with chunks of their ceiling crumbling and falling to the floor, damaging their property in the process. I believe it was leaky water pipes. And of course, management did their best to not pay for the tenants damaged property until threatened with legal action.
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  #8950  
Old Posted Jul 21, 2013, 10:51 PM
Wilcal Wilcal is offline
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Originally Posted by DistrictDirt View Post
I'm a former tenant in SB Tower. My experience living there was ok, but getting our full security deposit back was a pain in the ass. But our deposit was not that big in the first place (we moved in when they were still trying to entice people to move in and fill the building up), and we only lost a couple hundred bucks in the end, but I know some people that put larger deposits down that lost a couple thousand. That's how Barry Shy does business. The plan from the outset is to do whatever is necessary to get as much of the deposit as possible, and to stonewall if tenants are wise to California's laws and ask for all the documentation for the expenses. Its a total abuse of the security deposit system, and I'm sure it'll catch up with him eventually when someone decides to pursue a class action lawsuit against him.

His renovations are also done on the cheap. SB Tower was supposed to be his luxury building, but if you look at the way things are constructed, its awful. I know a couple of former tenants and one of the current retail tenants that had big problems with chunks of their ceiling crumbling and falling to the floor, damaging their property in the process. I believe it was leaky water pipes. And of course, management did their best to not pay for the tenants damaged property until threatened with legal action.
It's a shame to hear stories like this. And to think, he could be just as wealthy, just as influential, and just as admired if he provided a good product and treated people fairly.
     
     
  #8951  
Old Posted Jul 22, 2013, 1:35 AM
Wilcal Wilcal is offline
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Fellow forumers,
I have been following skyscraper page and skyscraper city for a good number of years and now only recently joining each forum and actively participating in dialogue. One thing that I have observed to be a very important issue is that of the planned development of South Park, specifically the subject of residential density. For the most part the contributors of this forum favor high density, which in itself is unusual compared to other neighborhoods of Los Angeles in which NIMBY-ism is most pronounced. Another observation I made concerned the comments of some formers is about the availability of open land (e.g. parking lots) and developable land available in South Park. Comments such as “lots and lots of land available" struck me as odd because when walking and driving around the neighborhood that just seems to be untrue. Therefore, I decided to conduct an unscientific assessment of available land in the South Park region of downtown Los Angeles, as well as available land for development in both the financial district, and old core (e.g. bank district, Broadway, Hill Street, etc.). It should be noted that much of the land in these latter two areas is not zoned for residential use (it is zoned for commercial use), but variances are obviously granted.

SURVEY
I will be the first to admit that my methods of surveying were rather crude; however, after comparing measured values to known acreage I believe that the figures are reasonably accurate with a margin of error of perhaps plus or minus 5%. I also conducted the survey twice using the same method, and got very close to the first survey’s values. Using the aerial views Google Earth along with measuring tools (both straight line and path) I was able to calculate all parking lot square acreage within the boundaries of the 110 Freeway on the West, the Santa Monica Freeway on the south, Main Street on the East, and the 101 freeway as a northern border. My calculations did not include any parking lots in Bunker Hill, Chinatown, Little Tokyo, or the Arts district. The area described in my analysis consists of very large assembled parking acreage, as well as smaller lots which adjoined structures. I tried to avoid including acreage which was part of a business’ employee or customer parking. I also did not include acreage which has been purchased and actively being developed (e.g. actual digging). Thus projects such as Wood Partners 8th and Hope and Onni’s 9th and Olive were not included, but the Metropolis property and Astani’s development on Grand and Olympic were because their plans can change.
Also note that I included acreage which I considered to buildable, that is acreage gained by the demolition of structures for a higher and better use. This inclusion of acreage was completely subjective on my part They properties in question may be obsolete, underutilized, irrelevant to current surrounding uses, or just no longer economically viable. They include many of the single story brick and or concrete structures which serve(d) as factories, warehouses, or commercial use. Those of you who know the area are familiar with the structures that I am talking about, especially those structures which are within the blocks north of the 10 freeway and parallel to Broadway and Main up to the old core. Some of the structures in this area are “total unadulterated crap” and are “ripe for the wrecking ball,” while other structures in South Park are quite charming and my someday make for valuable retail, commercial, or residential uses. For example, I predict that soon those thirteen story “gems” near 11th and Broadway will be converted to housing and or creative office use. The potential for the area is unlimited.
But, suffice it to say, for the moment economics and demand for residential use will determine what survives and what gets built. A good example of this is the Hill and Olympic project. I’m sure Hanover Development wanted its development to span the entire half block from Olympic to 9th Street (if it had it could have added more than a hundred units to the project based upon a density of 197 du/ac). But the cost or availability of the three structures north of their project prevented them from doing so. Thus, the figure provided by my survey of developable land is very raw and tentative. It does not represent what will actually be built.

DATA

Parking lot acreage in area: 101.56 acres

Buildable acreage in area: 166.33 acres

NEW RESIDENTIAL POPULATION
Depending upon the developer and the investment made to increase developable residential density, in South Park and areas of downtown densities have ranged from a low of about 197 du/ac (for example Hanover’s Olympic and Hill), to Wood Partners 8th and Hope (350 du/ac). Thus, given a hypothetical average of 230 dwelling units per acre, the 101 acres of (parking lot) land could translate to 23,230 units, or approximately 39,329 new residents (at 1.65 residents per unit). Considering a full hypothetical build-out of all buildable acreage (161 acres), using the same formula as before, 37,030 units could be built to house 61,099 new residents.

DENSITY
When concerning the issue of density, I am an advocate for higher density. This is especially true for downtown which I consider to be the most logical place in the entire city for high density. Consider the transportation networks that converge in downtown, consider the density of employment, consider the density of commercial and retail functions, and consider the density of cultural and recreational functions. Mind you, all of these functions that are most accessible now will be more so with the future given the new streetcar and regional connector.
In downtown Los Angeles land (especially the most economically desirable) is a finite resource. It is a precious resource which has economic, social, cultural, and historic implications. It cannot be squandered by the land use practices of the past which included low density sprawl perpetrated by indifference, incompetence, or sheer stupidity on the part of Los Angeles planners and or politicians, these attributes which I believe are rife in the city’s current administration. On a gentler note, I truly believe that Garcetti’s influence will change things. However, I can think of so many more reasons for my argument, yet I think with most of you in this forum I am preaching to the choir. On a last note, I’ll paraphrase some forumers who retort to those who desire more density by saying “it doesn’t matter if developments are short or tall what we need are more feet on the ground.” I agree, but “I want the most feet on the ground.”

I encourage everyone in this forum interested in this subject to look at both articles recently posted on the subject of planning, and development. They both give very brief but very valuable insight into the actual functioning of the Los Angeles city planning department.

Go to: http://cityplanning.lacity.org/complan/central/PDF/ccyplanmap.pdf to view current city planning zoning policy for Downtown Los Angeles. It is ostensibly being updated. Actually this should have been done more than ten years ago during the first residential housing boom.

Also check out, http://djcoregon.com/news/2012/04/11...e-complicated/
And http://www.ladowntownnews.com/news/is-do...e5f97ec-eb52-11e2-a694-0019bb2963f4.html
     
     
  #8952  
Old Posted Jul 22, 2013, 8:35 PM
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So fencing has appeared along the plaza at the base of Angel's Flight (next to the metro stop) and completely closed it off. It looks almost like permanent fencing with the posts drilled into the concrete. The same fencing has blocked off the entrances to the Knoll at the top. The security guard had no idea what was up or how long it would be closed.

Anybody have any idea what this is about? Does the city even own this? I though it was somehow owned by the California Plaza people...
     
     
  #8953  
Old Posted Jul 22, 2013, 8:59 PM
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Originally Posted by brudy View Post
So fencing has appeared along the plaza at the base of Angel's Flight (next to the metro stop) and completely closed it off. It looks almost like permanent fencing with the posts drilled into the concrete. The same fencing has blocked off the entrances to the Knoll at the top. The security guard had no idea what was up or how long it would be closed.

Anybody have any idea what this is about? Does the city even own this? I though it was somehow owned by the California Plaza people...
Cal Plaza 3 construction starting?



Sorry, I couldn't resist.
     
     
  #8954  
Old Posted Jul 22, 2013, 9:52 PM
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Originally Posted by steve2726 View Post
cal plaza 3 construction starting?



Sorry, i couldn't resist.
you gave me goosebumps!
     
     
  #8955  
Old Posted Jul 22, 2013, 10:10 PM
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Office tower? Not gonna happen.
     
     
  #8956  
Old Posted Jul 22, 2013, 10:28 PM
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I do recall reading that Angels Knoll was intended to only serve as a park temporarily until somene decides to develop the Cal Plaza 3 parcel. Although as Mr. Floyd just mentioned, an office building isn't happening in current conditions.

Maybe they're doing some maintenance work on the park/plaza?
     
     
  #8957  
Old Posted Jul 23, 2013, 4:19 AM
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So I found that the page of the landscape architecture firm (AHBE) that did the plaza: http://www.ahbe.com/portfolio/angels-knoll-plaza

It sounds like the CRA did this as a temporary measure until a tower was built (as Blackcat suggested). But what about the grassy park at the top? That's a different deal I think (and hope). There could be maintenance going on, but the fencing is beyond just green construction fencing, it looks way more permanent.
     
     
  #8958  
Old Posted Jul 23, 2013, 4:54 AM
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^ since the CRA no longer exists, I'm not sure how their land is being handled right now. I believe the city has to go through a legal process of selling off property formerly controlled by that agency, but I'm not sure how that will or will not affect areas like the plaza next to angel's flight. or where the 3rd bldg of Cal plaza was supposed to go up.

Could the new fence be in response to the problem of...or complaints about....ppl camping out in that area?

as for one of the newest businesses in dt, I saw this rather blurry pic of Terroni....in the NCT bldg at 8th & Spring st....& want to post it here since it shows a nice turnout.



Mark T., yelp.com

what worries me is another newer restaurant not too far away, figaro on broadway. Reviews still indicate it's a touch & go situation there, with ppl often saying how few customers are in the place. I hope the owners can survive through the rough times, until most of broadway is finally cleaned up.
     
     
  #8959  
Old Posted Jul 23, 2013, 4:56 AM
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The latest Palmer junk on Temple has a crane up and foundation looks almost done, at least what I can see from the 101.
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  #8960  
Old Posted Jul 23, 2013, 5:33 AM
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Originally Posted by citywatch View Post
what worries me is another newer restaurant not too far away, figaro on broadway. Reviews still indicate it's a touch & go situation there, with ppl often saying how few customers are in the place. I hope the owners can survive through the rough times, until most of broadway is finally cleaned up.
Both Figaro and LABC worry me because of their size. I don't know how either expects to keep that amount of space filled with patrons. At least Figaro has good customer service and friendly staff. LABC somehow manages to survive despite employing several unhappy douchebag bartenders.
     
     
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