Stadiums & Arenas of Canada, Part 3

[northernlights99]

Why would an Open air venue be worse than it is now ?

Everyone talks about saving money. My idea saves money.

The cost of replacing the technical ring equals the cost of covering the opening.

Having another fabric roof doesn't solve the current problem, a fabric roof will continue to tear more and more as the years go by.

How is that a long term solution ?

It's not just snow load that ruins the roof, wind will cause tears also.

The Als and the soccer team hardly played in there while there was a torn roof above, so how would the Stadium being Open air be worse than it is now ?

Look how many games can be played there during summer.

From the standpoint of Premier Lego and his Cabinet, leaving Olympic as an Open air venue is less risky as the cost will be less. That will save him face in the public opinion.

The sound system can be upgraded, as well as lighting. 56,000 new seats can be installed as was done with BC Place. Those upgrades can be done at reasonable cost.

Quote me where in all of the announcements from the Quebec government that said that there would be NO interior upgrades.

Who said there will be no interior upgrades ?

Performers would prefer to play in an Open air venue, there will be less echo.

My idea also solves the acoustics problem. Baffles can also be hung or placed on walls to reduce reverberation time.

Allowing sound to pass through the opening will make the stadium more attractive for show performers.

Pink Floyd performed in Open air in 1978 in front of 78,000 fans, a record to this day. Ask any of those fans that attended that show if not having a torn roof hanging over them detracted from their enjoyment of the show.

I counted all the times Taylor Swift played in Rain in all of her shows worldwide on all of her past tours.

I counted TWO Rain events and one Cancellation due to lightning in Argentina. And the show still went on including extreme heat in Rio that killed one fan.

The rain events were in Foxborough and Nashville, the worst that happened is the water caused her piano to start playing by itself.

The fans won't get wet, the overhang will remain to keep fans dry. Those sitting around the stage, well I guess bring a poncho.

I would say there is a very low risk of a shower during one of her summer shows at Olympic Stadium with no roof.

All you have to do is organize more scheduled events during the good weather months.

You save money and improve acoustics.

Two rain events in 14 years of touring. Make Olympic an Open air venue.

Lego said he wants to bring the stadium back to its "former glory". That should be a hint.

from google:

American singer-songwriter Taylor Swift has headlined SIX (6) concert tours and FOUR (4) one-off concerts, and performed in TWENTY ONE (21) music festivals and TWO HUNDRED THIRTEEN (213) live events.

she has had TWO rain events across 213 live events ? Why would you not want to have an Open air concept for your Stadium if the option is available as is for Olympic ?

[Djeffery]

I thought it was cute once, but are you intentionally calling the Premier "Lego" or do you think that's actually his name?

[elly63]

Originally Posted by Djeffery

I thought it was cute once, but are you intentionally calling the Premier "Lego" or do you think that's actually his name?

I'd believe anything coming from what I hope isn't an adult male with a Taylor Swift obsession.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by northernlights99

The Als and the soccer team hardly played in there while there was a torn roof above, so how would the Stadium being Open air be worse than it is now ?

Tell me this, why would either team want to play there when they can't sell 25k tickets now and have 50k+ seats even farther from the field? Ever heard of the concept of ticket scarcity?

At one point you're saying leaving the roof open will cost no money and in the next you're saying no one is mentioning internal upgrades which will cost a whole lotta money.

Neither team will play there permanently until they can improve on the situation they have now, why would they? The require seats close to the action and about half of what is in there now. And again because you weren't listening the first time, no roof doesn't help them with early and late season games which they might like to have scheduled at home instead of away. And for CFM that includes out of season CCL games.

[northernlights99]

Commonwealth Stadium is Open air, hasn't hurt the Eskimos has it ? How many Grey Cups has Edmonton won ?

And their seats are farther away from the sidelines due to the track which is still there.

And if the Eskimos don't like their current situation, why did they recently extend their Lease with Commonwealth?

So I don't want to hear the Als complain about those issues if the Eskimos play under those same conditions.

As for the soccer team, Joey Saputo footed the bill for the Expansion franchise, he certainly didn't do it on the understanding that he would have Olympic Stadium as a back up venue.

If the Als and Joey Saputo want to play in Olympic Stadium under Indoor conditions, then They Can Pay something towards having a Roof covering the opening.

Otherwise if the Als and Saputo want to stay where they are playing and don't want to entertain the thought of playing in Olympic Stadium, fine, then leave it is an Open air venue.

Your only rationale for a Roof to cover the opening is to keep the Als and Saputo happy.

My rationale is make the stadium Open air to host most other events that would benefit being outdoors in pleasant weather.

I say make the stadium an Open air venue for live Concert festivals and sports events that DO want to play there in summer months.

The MLS season is way too long anyways, why are you playing stupid soccer games in early February ?

Maybe Saputo should get Don Garber to have the MLS season start later, I think that would accomplish a lot more.

I don't like the idea of having the Quebec Government bow to the wishes of MLS and make another roof just cause MLS wants to start the season so stupid early.

Leaving it as Open air will save taxpayer money and get the Stadium back open earlier, why is this such a bad thing ?

[northernlights99]

Since when did I say interior upardes will cost no money ?

The total bill for Vancouver was $ 552 million of which $ 365 million was the Retractable roof, the rest went to reinforcement of the structure, scoreboard, lights, sound system and new seats, upgrading of the concourses and washrooms, painting, other exterior work, outdoor signage and exterior message boards, etc.

At one point, 1000 workers were on the BC Place site. And another $ 200 million will be spent for the 2026 World Cup.

I say reinforce the technical ring and leave Olympic Stadium as Open air to :

1. save taxpayer money

2. get the stadium available for summer events next year 2025

I am opposed to them spending a billion dollars and having the Stadium closed for 4 years just to bow to the interests of soccer and football that will just play a few events there when it happens to be cold and miserable at the venues they play most of their events in anyways.

And if the Als and Saputo want a roof to play under in inclement weather, if they want that option available to them, PAY FOR IT.

Enter into an agreement with Quebec cabinet for COST SHARING !

You want improvements done to a venue so you can play in it Under Your Conditions, they enter into a cost sharing agreement with the government.

That is called Cost Sharing. That is in the tax payers best interest.

These teams are privately owned by rich people, you want to close the stadium for a roof JUST FOR YOUR OWN TEAM'S BENEFIT THEN PAY FOR THE DAMN ROOF YOURSELF !!!.

But to close the stadium for 4 years to build a Roof solely for two sports teams just to appease the Als and Saputo, that takes Montreal out for potential 2025 Taylor Swift shows plus many other potential shows.

That will make far more people angry than some sports fans.

And yes That Is A Lot Worse considering Swift brings in 100 times more revenue than those two sports teams.

Another thing to consider is how much longer will the CFL survive ? How does a team only drawing 15,000 make it ?

So what are we supposed to think, spending a billion dollars and closing the stadium for 4 years just so the Als have a roof to play under in miserable weather will save the CFL from Bankruptcy which is the direction they are headed in anyways ?

As for Saputo, have MLS start their season later in late March, if Don Garber doesn't want to do that then maybe Montreal should reconsider being in this league .

Furthermore, don't come on here and say something that isn't true, I never said interior improvements would not cost money. If I did, find that quote.

The Tourism Minister alluded to interior improvements happening so why are you misquoting me ?

[craner]

^ Is this guy for real ?
I don’t even know where to begin.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by craner

^ Is this guy for real ?

As I said from his second post, when his name changed, there is something fishy in the state of Denmark. Looks like it's just an elaborate troll happening.

[northernlights99]

Answer me this: the current fibreglass roof started tearing soon after it was installed in 1999, so why would you replace this roof with the same type ?

You want to cover the opening on Olympic stadium so that Montreal FC can play 2 or 3 early season games when its too Cold to play at Saputo, either the field being too slippery or the hard metal seats too cold for season ticket holders tastes.

And the Alouettes haven't played one single game inside that stadium since 2010.

How do you figure you can "bring the seats forward closer to the sidelines"? That is the way the structure was originally designed, if you are thinking of gutting the lower bowl, then just build a new stadium.

Gutting the lower bowl is what they did with Key Arena in Seattle, it is no easy feat, the Seattle arena project costed $ 900 million U.S. and the seating capacity is 1/4 that of Olympic.

It makes no financial sense.

Just Repair / Reinforce the current structural roof (technical ring) and leave the stadium Open air, do some cosmetic upgrades and have it ready for Concert season in Summer 2025.

Replacing the current roof with another one of the same type that will tear just as quickly is irrational and symbolic of a government with misguided priorities.

[elly63]

Who, aside from you, has suggested replacing the roof with one of the same type? How many concerts are big enough to warrant a 50k stadium? Why did you change your name and have posts that many people here are suspicious of their nature and your motives. You always seem to ignore that. Why did your posts seem like they were computer generated and now seem more genuine. Is it a big troll, how bout answering those questions.

[Djeffery]

Key Arena was completely demolished and rebuilt under the historically designated roof, it wasn't just a lower bowl renovation. A large chunk of the cost was a result of the extra work that went into preserving the roof while the entire structure underneath was removed, excavated and rebuilt.

A more fitting and recent comparison would be the Rogers Centre renovation at about $300 million. A rebuilt lower bowl into a football/soccer layout, with changes to the upper levels with party levels, lounges, social spaces, renovated suites, new seats. I still don't know what the Big O could be turned into something either of those teams would consider as a permanent home again though, as it would still be huge and cavernous.

[northernlights99]

I'm new here, never changed my name, am not AI or computer generated, besides since when does AI have personal tastes ?

Changing the lower bowl to rectangle will take years of planning and consultation with the teams to complete as would a new roof over the opening.

The roof material can't just be picked off a store shelf like groceries can, contracts have to be signed, a design has to be engineered then construction hopefully goes ahead, that could take years.

The Stadium is in crisis mode.

It needs to be fixed up and reopened quickly like next year 2025, lots of events coming up like Taylor Swift plus potential World Cup matches.

If the current structure was strong enough to absorb the weight of a newer type of roof material, then why wasn't that installed in 1999 ?

Cause its likely not feasible. And even less feasible now at this point in the structure's age.

The Technical ring needs Reinforcement to bring it into Building code otherwise, as was clearly explained by the Tourism Minister, without upgrades, this Stadium will Close Permanently In One Year.

Those comments are on record.

If a structure is one year from being closed cause its not up to building code, I call that a crisis.

But that Overhang still would likely not be able to hold the weight of a Metal roof, even a lightweight metal roof would be heavier than the fibreglass on it now.

Even with weight taken off by the mast cables. Those cables have tension limits.

We aren't building a suspension bridge here.

Look at the way the overhang curves downward, I cannot visualize a metal roof being feasible. Sorry I can't see it.

The Stadium already has a Partial roof ( the overhang which keeps most fans dry ). I say remove that pathetic torn blue roof and do the interior renovations.

You asked me a question so a question back to you.

If the Stadium can't be used reliably between November and March cause Insurance will not cover the Stadium during snow months (as is the case), what's the difference between that and just having the Stadium be Open air and have it Closed during winter months cause there will be snow inside anyways ?

As was the case between 1976 and 1987. The Expos never played in those months.

Either way the Stadium will be of limited usage between November and March.

So why would you spend $ 250 million on another fabric roof if the end result will be the same as having it as Open air in terms of number of months it will be open ?

Either way, the Stadium will be mostly closed in snow months. So what are you gaining reinstalling another fabric roof ?

In 5 years it will be torn again in hundreds of places. The current roof started tearing soon after installation.

Another advantage of Open air, you can more easily grow a grass field for a potential 2026 World Cup bid.

The original plan was for Canada to have 3 bid cities, it is true that Montreal pulled out of the bid, however why can't they tie these renovations in with a renewed World Cup bid ?

Vancouver hasn't started construction on its World Cup committments ( they are seeking bids on various projects related solely to the WC ) so I don't see how the clock has run out, still 2 1/2 years out till the event.

The Overhang is there, just leave it. Why make this project more complex than it has to be ?

I would also suggest Cabinet is obligated to look at these options re cost and being responsible to taxpayers.

Leaving it as Open air will Save a Huge amount of money, how is that not relevant ?

Taylor Swift doesn't need government subsidies. Unlike CF Montreal she doesn't necessarily need a roof to play under.

Originally Posted by elly63

Who, aside from you, has suggested replacing the roof with one of the same type? How many concerts are big enough to warrant a 50k stadium? Why did you change your name and have posts that many people here are suspicious of their nature and your motives. You always seem to ignore that. Why did your posts seem like they were computer generated and now seem more genuine. Is it a big troll, how bout answering those questions.

[EpicPonyTime]

Is Olympic Stadium winterized? I suspect there's a lot more to it than just taking the roof off of the thing and exposing it to the elements year-round, however I suppose the interior has been exposed in the past.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by northernlights99

never changed my name

[elly63]

Originally Posted by northernlights99

But that Overhang still would likely not be able to hold the weight of a Metal roof, even a lightweight metal roof would be heavier than the fibreglass on it now.

Olympic Stadium to get $300M roof
cbc.ca June 29, 2010

The Olympic Stadium's retractable membrane roof rips between 50 and 60 times a year.

Quebec's Olympic Installations Board is moving ahead with a project to replace the decrepit roof covering Montreal's east-end stadium.

On Monday, the board filed a notice of intent to seek approval from Quebec's Liberal government to hire SNC-Lavalin for the $300-million job.

The new steel roof will be rigid, fixed, and more durable than the current retractable fibreglass membrane that rips frequently, requiring expensive repairs.

SNC-Lavalin submitted its bid on the Olympic Stadium roof job three years ago, after the OIB issued a tender request in 2005.

"We know that it's an excellent project that has passed all tests, all trials, analysis, etc..." affirmed Sylvie Bastien, communications director at the Olympic Stadium. "It's an excellent project."

The current retractable structure will be dismantled to make room for the new steel structure.

The project also includes major repairs and maintenance over the next 25 years.

The roof of the stadium known as the Big O is in such rough shape that Montreal's fire department threatened this year to shut the building completely.

The membrane has lost almost 50 per cent of its tear resistance and requires repairs as often as 50 times a year.

The membrane roof, installed by U.S. company Birdair in 1998, cannot handle snowfalls of more than eight centimetres.

City reacts to news

Montreal Mayor Gérald Tremblay said the project is encouraging, and that he would like to see the stadium fixed as soon as possible.

"We've been waiting for three years, so why can't we wait another month," said Tremblay. "The good news is that the Quebec government is willing to invest close to $300 million to enhance the value of that important asset for Montreal."

[thurmas]

If I were Legault I would spend 100 or 150 million to renovate and make stade saputo at Olympic Park as a 24,000 seat home to the Alouettes and CF Montreal as its appropriate sized for them. Then for the big O I would spend required to replace the roof and technical ring and maybe spend 50 million on the interior for some new plastic seats and other minor improvements. This way the big O becomes an event centre for concerts grey cups big mls games ect.. where its large size warrants use and stade saputo can be the Montreal version of BMO field with a suitable size for its tenants.

[thewave46]

Originally Posted by elly63

Olympic Stadium to get $300M roof
cbc.ca June 29, 2010

Here we are, 14 years later. No roof, the stadium slowly withering.

I wonder if in another 14 years we are quoting articles of similar vintage.

[northernlights99]

I have seen this article before; THREE major problems.

THE OLYMPIC INSTALLATIONS BOARD NO LONGER EXISTS. It was disbanded. The Government hired another entity to run the stadium's affairs.

So right away the information is outdated and not relevant to today.

The article also states factually incorrect information.

It says "current retractable structure". What retractable structure ?

It is a fixed membrane structure. It is Not retractable. The roof before it was retractable, before 1998, but this was written in 2010.

The current blue roof is Not retractable.

It says the "stadium's retractable membrane roof". Wrong.

Right there is a red flag.

So that is factually incorrect.

Third issue:

It says "steel structure", but does not say that as a quote. Who said it is steel ? Second hand information ?

Where is it quoted from someone that it is a steel structure ?

The writer says it will be a steel structure, is the writer an expert on this ?

We are taking the writer's word that it will be steel. Where is the plan ? Let us see the details.

Also this article was written before it was determined that the Technical ring has to be reinforced. That just happened in the last few months so that is a Game Changer.

Depending on the scope of the repairs to the Technical ring, that could affect load limits.

I suspect there maybe was an issue with french to english to translation, the writer's translation could have been a bit off, that is frequently a problem here, so I don't place a lot of confidence in the accuracy of the article.

Furthermore, nothing ever happened, did it ? Just a lot of talk.

Originally Posted by elly63

Olympic Stadium to get $300M roof
cbc.ca June 29, 2010

The Olympic Stadium's retractable membrane roof rips between 50 and 60 times a year.

Quebec's Olympic Installations Board is moving ahead with a project to replace the decrepit roof covering Montreal's east-end stadium.

On Monday, the board filed a notice of intent to seek approval from Quebec's Liberal government to hire SNC-Lavalin for the $300-million job.

The new steel roof will be rigid, fixed, and more durable than the current retractable fibreglass membrane that rips frequently, requiring expensive repairs.

SNC-Lavalin submitted its bid on the Olympic Stadium roof job three years ago, after the OIB issued a tender request in 2005.

"We know that it's an excellent project that has passed all tests, all trials, analysis, etc..." affirmed Sylvie Bastien, communications director at the Olympic Stadium. "It's an excellent project."

The current retractable structure will be dismantled to make room for the new steel structure.

The project also includes major repairs and maintenance over the next 25 years.

The roof of the stadium known as the Big O is in such rough shape that Montreal's fire department threatened this year to shut the building completely.

The membrane has lost almost 50 per cent of its tear resistance and requires repairs as often as 50 times a year.

The membrane roof, installed by U.S. company Birdair in 1998, cannot handle snowfalls of more than eight centimetres.

City reacts to news

Montreal Mayor Gérald Tremblay said the project is encouraging, and that he would like to see the stadium fixed as soon as possible.

"We've been waiting for three years, so why can't we wait another month," said Tremblay. "The good news is that the Quebec government is willing to invest close to $300 million to enhance the value of that important asset for Montreal."

[northernlights99]

Here is an example of Misinformation. The stadium has Not been abandoned though it is underused. The title is deceiving, the article is party incorrect, the writer is an idiot.

It is true that the Stadium was used to house Asylum seekers and was used as a Vaccination site.

Maybe the Government wants to keep the stadium in bare basic minimum shape just for Emergencies ? It is designated as an Emergency shelter .

Maybe the only desire is to do minimum work to keep the roof from falling in so as to retain it for Emergency purposes ? What if there is another pandemic ?

Another rush of asylum seekers due to Civil war breaking out in Mexico or the U.S. ? If Trump wins there might be a Civil war. The United States is very unstable right now.


https://www.the-sun.com/sport/818002...eal-abandoned/

[elly63]

Originally Posted by northernlights99

The article also states factually incorrect information. Just a lot of talk.

Similar to your posts.