Calgary Public Transit II

[MasterG]

I heard that real-time stop information is now operating on some bus routes. A friend said Route 7 was going and it worked really well. Any other comments ? I haven't been on a bus since the started it.

Are we going to see this lead to a Calgary Transit app for next bus times and map information?

[Full Mountain]

Originally Posted by MasterG

I heard that real-time stop information is now operating on some bus routes. A friend said Route 7 was going and it worked really well. Any other comments ? I haven't been on a bus since the started it.

Are we going to see this lead to a Calgary Transit app for next bus times and map information?

They said it would be later on, once they had completed the trial and implemented it on all the buses.

This is something that will make commuting via bus so much nicer and easier, especially in winter.

[Full Mountain]

Originally Posted by fusili

I agree. I can't even understand what either is saying anymore.

Occasionally one or the other makes a point I can understand, but 95% of it is taking in circle.

[sim]

I've enjoyed the last few posts.

I wish I was in academia. It would somehow make more sense.

[milomilo]

Originally Posted by speedog

What's so bad about Centre Street - it seems to get me in and out of downtown quite well and it's in fairly good shape. Even walking it isn't bad - guess it's all in one's perspective.

I don't know if I just think differently to other people but I find Centre St is one of Calgary's many roads which has to perform multiple tasks and does all of them poorly. 17th is similar - it is horrible to drive down (slow, narrow, congested, having to wait to turn off) and I always try to avoid it unless there is no alternative. Yet, because it is a major roadway, the sidewalks are also narrow and surrounded by traffic, which I don't find pleasant.

Personally, I'd rather our retail/drinking areas were pedestrianised, and our roadways and transitways were both segregated - and fast. I don't see the point of a Centre St that has cars and rail vehicles combined with no space for pedestrians - that benefits no one.

Let's also remember that the NCLRT is being built primarily for the purpose of transporting suburban commuters downtown - not between destinations on inner city Centre St.

[fusili]

Originally Posted by milomilo

I don't know if I just think differently to other people but I find Centre St is one of Calgary's many roads which has to perform multiple tasks and does all of them poorly. 17th is similar - it is horrible to drive down (slow, narrow, congested, having to wait to turn off) and I always try to avoid it unless there is no alternative. Yet, because it is a major roadway, the sidewalks are also narrow and surrounded by traffic, which I don't find pleasant.

Personally, I'd rather our retail/drinking areas were pedestrianised, and our roadways and transitways were both segregated - and fast. I don't see the point of a Centre St that has cars and rail vehicles combined with no space for pedestrians - that benefits no one.

Let's also remember that the NCLRT is being built primarily for the purpose of transporting suburban commuters downtown - not between destinations on inner city Centre St.

17th is terrible as a street to drive on, and I agree, the sidewalks are not great considering it is our largest commercial high street. IMO, it should be reduced to 4 actual lanes, and sidewalks widened.

[MasterG]

Originally Posted by fusili

17th is terrible as a street to drive on, and I agree, the sidewalks are not great considering it is our largest commercial high street. IMO, it should be reduced to 4 actual lanes, and sidewalks widened.

Absolutely agree. No one should be using this road to expect to commute on it to the burbs, it does not work for this and we should give up on that idea that it can serve that role. Let the dominate mode of pedestrians claim the space what they deserve.

Perhaps a reduction to a 3 lane configuration with middle turning lanes might work in the heaviest pedestrian areas.

[MichaelS]

Originally Posted by MasterG

Absolutely agree. No one should be using this road to expect to commute on it to the burbs, it does not work for this and we should give up on that idea that it can serve that role. Let the dominate mode of pedestrians claim the space what they deserve.

Perhaps a reduction to a 3 lane configuration with middle turning lanes might work in the heaviest pedestrian areas.

I think you would have a hell of a fight with the BRZ to get rid of the on street parking.

[DizzyEdge]

So with the automated stop announcements/led sign on buses in place and next bus app soon coming, I think the only thing lacking compared to other large Canadian cities is improved bus frequency and night buses. Any news on either?

I guess one other thing is Vancouver and Toronto have next bus LED signs in some bus shelters, but I'm not sure it that is really necessary when you have an app. Maybe at very busy stops it could be useful.

[fusili]

Originally Posted by DizzyEdge

So with the automated stop announcements/led sign on buses in place and next bus app soon coming, I think the only thing lacking compared to other large Canadian cities is improved bus frequency and night buses. Any news on either?

I guess one other thing is Vancouver and Toronto have next bus LED signs in some bus shelters, but I'm not sure it that is really necessary when you have an app. Maybe at very busy stops it could be useful.

Calgary transit was doing a study on improving night buses and different ways to implement it a few months back. It will be internal to transit and not go through council. From what I remember, their proposals seemed quite reasonable.

[Full Mountain]

Originally Posted by DizzyEdge

So with the automated stop announcements/led sign on buses in place and next bus app soon coming, I think the only thing lacking compared to other large Canadian cities is improved bus frequency and night buses. Any news on either?

I guess one other thing is Vancouver and Toronto have next bus LED signs in some bus shelters, but I'm not sure it that is really necessary when you have an app. Maybe at very busy stops it could be useful.

Have to be careful with the app thing as not everyone will have a smartphone and those that do might not have it charged when they need it, I know I've had my die on me while I've been out before.

[DizzyEdge]

Do you remember any details? 30 min frequency buses following the existing LRT and BRT routes would be useful. I'm curious how full the trains are between midnight and 2am, with a night bus service ending LRT a couple of hours earlier might be doable if they tend to be pretty empty.

[DizzyEdge]

Originally Posted by Full Mountain

Have to be careful with the app thing as not everyone will have a smartphone and those that do might not have it charged when they need it, I know I've had my die on me while I've been out before.

Good point, and since an app would likely be iphone/android only, I wonder what % of transit users have such phones.

[ByeByeBaby]

Originally Posted by DizzyEdge

Do you remember any details? 30 min frequency buses following the existing LRT and BRT routes would be useful. I'm curious how full the trains are between midnight and 2am, with a night bus service ending LRT a couple of hours earlier might be doable if they tend to be pretty empty.

That's roughly the spirit. Not quite as expansive as this proposal, but in a similar vein. One issue is that going all the way to the ends of the city adds substantial cost; for example, it might be more efficient to go south as far as Anderson or so, and then have taxis there - that could provide more revenue for taxis and lower costs for taxi users.

[MasterG]

Originally Posted by MichaelS

I think you would have a hell of a fight with the BRZ to get rid of the on street parking.

That is true. I am ok with keeping the parking, perhaps just one narrow lane in each direction would suffice. At least cut 1.5m off the Northside Westbound lane, its a weird 1.5 lane configuration for most of the strip, confusing drivers into thinking that they can fit 2 travel lanes and a parking lane westbound. Give that over to the North sidewalk which is one of the busiest ped strips in the city. Add pedestrian bulbs, pop-up patios/parks and larger ped space at corners to reduce turning at speed and you might actually have a nice street in the end.

[VIce]

Originally Posted by DizzyEdge

So with the automated stop announcements/led sign on buses in place and next bus app soon coming, I think the only thing lacking compared to other large Canadian cities is improved bus frequency and night buses. Any news on either?

I guess one other thing is Vancouver and Toronto have next bus LED signs in some bus shelters, but I'm not sure it that is really necessary when you have an app. Maybe at very busy stops it could be useful.

There are a few such signs at the University, but this was a project done by the University and not Transit. The EEEL building has an outdoor sign next to the physical bus stop, and another one inside the building visible to cafe patrons. The signs are based on Transit's published schedules, and don't have any real-time data.

I don't think there's anything similar at the main bus loop.

[mersar]

Originally Posted by DizzyEdge

Good point, and since an app would likely be iphone/android only, I wonder what % of transit users have such phones.

Last numbers I'd seen are over 80% of Canadians have cell phones. Considering worldwide 62% of phones are Android and 32% are iOS, the other 6% are Blackberry and other phones, I'd say a sizeable number of transit users would have Android/iOS.

[Fuzz]

I hope they have a web interface. I have a smartphone(without a sim card) but I don't typically take it out with me. It'd be nice to check a website at home or work just before I leave to make sure they are where they should be. And for people without data plans, its not helpful either.

[Full Mountain]

Originally Posted by DizzyEdge

Good point, and since an app would likely be iphone/android only, I wonder what % of transit users have such phones.

Originally Posted by mersar

Last numbers I'd seen are over 80% of Canadians have cell phones. Considering worldwide 62% of phones are Android and 32% are iOS, the other 6% are Blackberry and other phones, I'd say a sizeable number of transit users would have Android/iOS.

I would hope that transit makes a very basic app and simply provides some sort of API for programmers to integrate into the many apps out there. This removes the burden from transit to build great app (not a core competency or strength of the city).

Originally Posted by Fuzz

I hope they have a web interface. I have a smartphone(without a sim card) but I don't typically take it out with me. It'd be nice to check a website at home or work just before I leave to make sure they are where they should be. And for people without data plans, its not helpful either.

I would imagine they will integrate it into their planning tool, I would also expect that if the data is available Google will integrate it into Google Maps as they have elsewhere.

[outoftheice]

Originally Posted by DizzyEdge

So with the automated stop announcements/led sign on buses in place and next bus app soon coming, I think the only thing lacking compared to other large Canadian cities is improved bus frequency and night buses. Any news on either?

I guess one other thing is Vancouver and Toronto have next bus LED signs in some bus shelters, but I'm not sure it that is really necessary when you have an app. Maybe at very busy stops it could be useful.

What I would like to see is Calgary Transit take steps to elevate the BRT network into a true primary transit network in the minds of Calgarians. To do this I think that they should take several steps to put it on par with the service standards of the LRT.

- Change the large format LRT maps that are posted at all of Calgary's LRT stations to large format Rapid Transit maps that include all of Calgary's BRT network. This would broaden public awareness of the BRT services. Maps would not necessarily need to show every stop along the BRT routes but should at the very least show how interchanges between the LRT and BRT services can be made. I think this will become much more important once we see the north and south crosstown services implemented as well as the Green Line BRT.

- Install heated shelters (or at the very least shelters) at all of Calgary's BRT stops. This helps to elevate the services beyond the rest of the bus network and brings the standard of a BRT stop closer to what is offered at Calgary's LRT stations. I think it will also help increase ridership as one of the only things that keeps me riding the LRT network in the winter is the knowledge that heated shelters are available at a large number of the stations and I would be more than happy to extend this ridership to the BRT network if I knew I wouldn't freeze my butt off at the stop.

- Install real time "Next Bus" signs at all of the BRT network stops. I think this system has dramatically improved the user experience for the LRT network and would do the same to the BRT network. I agree with others that a mobile app would be sufficient for the rest of the network but information for the BRT network should be accessible to all users and not just locals with mobiles who have knowledge of an app. Keeping with this train of thought, I think the schedules of the BRT routes as well as any regular bus routes that make use of the stop should be displayed.

- Install local area maps at all BRT stops. This is done at the LRT stations and is great for orienting oneself to the area when getting off the train. I think having this information readily accessible would make a huge difference in people's confidence levels when it comes to the whether or not they will be able to locate their intended destination once they've taken the bus to the general area where they want to be.

I'm not too sure how much implementing these things would be but my guess is that it would probably be in the $5-10 million range. While it is a large expense, I think the investment would be well received by transit users and go a long way to bringing Calgary's transit network into the "world class" realm. Now is also the time to do it as Calgary Transit gets ready to roll out seven major BRT corridor projects over the next few years.