Stadiums and Arenas of Canada part 2

[esquire]

Originally Posted by Acajack

There seems to be an exaggerated eagerness on the part of some posters to demonstrate that where they live is "above" typically Canadian pursuits... iike hockey.

It's all very bizarre.

Haha, it's so true. Maybe you commoners are into hockey and football, but we sophisticates prefer the uber sophisticated MLS (or NLL, or whatever else).

[SaskScraper]

GreaterMontréal
It's not a surprise that the Montréal Impact draws more people than a World junior hockey tournament.

Originally Posted by Acajack
There seems to be an exaggerated eagerness on the part of some posters to demonstrate that where they live is "above" typically Canadian pursuits... iike hockey.
It's all very bizarre.

Originally Posted by esquire

Haha, it's so true. Maybe you commoners are into hockey and football, but we sophisticates prefer the uber sophisticated MLS (or NLL, or whatever else).

I don't think we should be so hard on posters like GreaterMontréal, if stating a fact like Montreal Impact draws higher numbers than World Junior hockey, we shouldn't blame him for it.

Same for posters like me, If my correcting someone by stating a fact that NHL isn't as popular in Saskatchewan as in the rest of Canada, and that in fact, yet another league like NFL has similar popularity as NHL in Sask, we should accept the facts presented even if it differs from preconceived incorrect opinions one may have.

[blueandgoldguy]

Montreal/Toronto guaranteed $21 million profit to Hockey Canada for this year's tournament. Despite the poor crowds this year apparently they weren't too concerned about achieving that mark which is somewhat surprising. I would have thought they would require crowds similar to those of 2 years ago to have any hope of attaining such a monumental goal. I guess corporate sponsorships will help bridge the gap?

I could see Calgary/Edmonton bidding hard for the 2021 world juniors. They probably had the best balance between huge profits (guaranteed hockey canada $18 million in profits) and attendance (set highest average attendance per match) of any World Junior hockey tournament in history. If they do bid and win it will have been 9 years since they last hosted which will be more than enough time to build interest. Plus they will have the additional benefit of a larger arena in Edmonton which can only boost revenues next time around.

I can see Ottawa bid and the possibility of another Winnipeg/Saskatoon bid in a couple years. Quebec City/Halifax is another possibility. I don't see any other bids than those 3...not when Hockey Canada will require profits in the range of $15 - $20 million.

Anyone know what Victoria/Vancouver guaranteed in profits for 2021?

[someone123]

Originally Posted by SaskScraper

I guess those numbers in parentheses are the sample sizes. So in Atlantic Canada, which has 2.3 million people, they asked 100 people somewhere in the region which sports they liked. That is a comparatively small sample that would normally be presumed (generously rather than conservatively) to give a margin of error of +/- 10%. There is no indication how people were sampled (probably not actually randomly sampled from all residents in the region). A lot of the rankings suggested by the table ("province A likes sport X more or less than province B") are probably not real.

[SaskScraper]

Originally Posted by someone123

I guess those numbers in parentheses are the sample sizes. So in Atlantic Canada, which has 2.3 million people, they asked 100 people somewhere in the region which sports they liked. That is a comparatively small sample that would normally be presumed (generously rather than conservatively) to give a margin of error of +/- 10%. There is no indication how people were sampled (probably not actually randomly sampled from all residents in the region). A lot of the rankings suggested by the table ("province A likes sport X more or less than province B") are probably not real.

come up with a table with a larger sample size than mine if you don't like it, as for now we have to accept the data thats presented.

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by SaskScraper

come up with a table with a larger sample size than mine if you don't like it, as for now we have to accept the data thats presented.

Is there any source on this table before I criticize it? I've seen it on here before and can't recall how old it is.

Just because we're presented with a table with numbers with an incredibly small sample size and no proof of how the samples were taken doesn't mean we can't be critical of it.

[someone123]

Originally Posted by SaskScraper

come up with a table with a larger sample size than mine if you don't like it, as for now we have to accept the data thats presented.

I don't care which sports are liked most in which provinces. I'm just making an observation about statistics like this that I think is often overlooked. In order to interpret this data meaningfully, you need to have a sense of the error.

It is common on SSP and elsewhere to see rankings where the differences are much smaller than the error bars. Typically people look at those, ignore the error, and start coming up with narratives to fit to the data ("Based on my last 2-hour layover, I could really feel that city A was 2% less dynamic than city B, + or - 20%, 19 times out of 20").

[SaskScraper]

Originally Posted by someone123

I don't care which sports are liked most in which provinces. I'm just making an observation about statistics like this that I think is often overlooked. In order to interpret this data meaningfully, you need to have a sense of the error.

It is common on SSP and elsewhere to see rankings where the differences are much smaller than the error bars. Typically people look at those, ignore the error, and start coming up with narratives to fit to the data ("Based on my last 2-hour layover, I could really feel that city A was 2% less dynamic than city B, + or - 20%, 19 times out of 20").

I get it, so your sample size of 1 (one) with your SSP layover example is comparable to a Canadian sports popularity same size of fifteen hundred.. gotchya I think I will stick with the Angus Reid poll numbers for accuracy, thank you very much

[isaidso]

Originally Posted by SaskScraper

The numbers for Atlantic Canada are interesting. It ties Ontario for highest interest in MLB at 26% despite no team and never having a team. It's 2nd highest after Ontario for interest in the NBA despite no team and never having a team. If they hadn't included Newfoundland it might have tied Ontario at 11%, or even beat it.

The numbers for MLS clearly show that it's not a national league and will never be one unless it expands beyond the 3 teams it currently has in Canada.

[eemy]

Originally Posted by SaskScraper

I get it, so your sample size of 1 (one) with your SSP layover example is comparable to a Canadian sports popularity same size of fifteen hundred.. gotchya I think I will stick with the Angus Reid poll numbers for accuracy, thank you very much

The point he is making is that the sample size for each province is much smaller than that to the point that it is impossible to draw any reasonable conclusions from the data except at a national level. There are all sorts of questions that could be raised about the methodology (what population was the sample drawn from, most importantly) that we can't answer, because we don't have a source for the poll.

[isaidso]

Originally Posted by Acajack

There seems to be an exaggerated eagerness on the part of some posters to demonstrate that where they live is "above" typically Canadian pursuits... iike hockey.

It's all very bizarre.

I don't know about that. People get tired of being painted with one central Canadian brush. Fans of other sports are used to living in the eternal shadow of fortress hockey. There is a degree of built up frustration with that. We see it with NBA fans and it's something non-hockey people can relate to. This is vast nation and it's not uniform from coast to coast to coast; although you'd never know it listening to Toronto based media. Things are changing for the better though. The Raptors' recent success has increased coverage of that sport dramatically. Soccer and baseball are also getting more attention.

As far as I'm concerned watching basketball IS a typically Canadian pursuit. It's what I grew up with and what everyone around me grew up with. It has nothing to do with being 'above' anything. Are we here to learn about other parts of Canada or just rehash that what's true of one province is true of everywhere?

[Black Star]

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https://twitter.com/NWeisbergCTV

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by isaidso

I don't know about that. People get tired of being painted with one central Canadian brush.

Hockey is not "central Canadian". It's fairly consistently the most popular spectator sport all across the country.

I am not necessarily saying this out of personal fandom: I am not nearly as big a hockey fan as I used to be and people on here know my feelings about the NHL and what I feel it has done to our national sport.

I am just being realistic. And Canadian.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by isaidso

Fans of other sports are used to living in the eternal shadow of fortress hockey. There is a degree of built up frustration with that. We see it with NBA fans and it's something non-hockey people can relate to. This is vast nation and it's not uniform from coast to coast to coast; although you'd never know it listening to Toronto based media. Things are changing for the better though. The Raptors' recent success has increased coverage of that sport dramatically. Soccer and baseball are also getting more attention.

As far as I'm concerned watching basketball IS a typically Canadian pursuit. It's what I grew up with and what everyone around me grew up with. It has nothing to do with being 'above' anything. Are we here to learn about other parts of Canada or just rehash that what's true of one province is true of everywhere?

I can understand that non-hockey fans may be frustrated about what they see as saturation coverage of hockey, but let's look at this realistically: it's the most popular sport in the country, we invented the sport and it's the team sport we're best at as a country. I'd say any sport that has that in its favour in any country is going to get a lot of attention. It's only normal.

As for the Toronto-based sports media, the attention they pay to hockey is far, far from the biggest problem. Obviously interest in any sport is at least partly conditioning but at least there is proven interest and history in hockey in this country. NCAA March Madness? Not so much I'd say.

Unless they're playing in an important playoff game, I fail to see how the Raptors automatically merit more attention from a cross-Canada sports network than any of the Canadian NHL teams...

[Denscity]

Originally Posted by SaskScraper

I don't think we should be so hard on posters like GreaterMontréal, if stating a fact like Montreal Impact draws higher numbers than World Junior hockey, we shouldn't blame him for it.

Same for posters like me, If my correcting someone by stating a fact that NHL isn't as popular in Saskatchewan as in the rest of Canada, and that in fact, yet another league like NFL has similar popularity as NHL in Sask, we should accept the facts presented even if it differs from preconceived incorrect opinions one may have.

Wow MLS soccer is way more popular in BC than Ontario or Quebec! Must be our 40 year history with pro soccer? Mild climate?

[OutOfTowner]

I like hockey and soccer. The seasons overlap nicely and that's enough sports for me. I could care less about basketball (yay! timeout #47!) and couldn't name 10 NBA teams. I go to one Als game every year because it's fun but otherwise don't care about football at all. If Montreal were to get another baseball team I might go to one or two games but that's it. Too much going on in the summer to bother with that. I go to about a half dozen Impact games including extras. Despite being a lifelong Hab fan I will only go if I get free tickets. I can have several other evenings out for the price of one Habs game. The only World Junior game I might have been tempted to attend would have been tonight's but I'm fine listening to it on the radio. The rest of the tournament is crap.

[OutOfTowner]

Originally Posted by Acajack

As for the Toronto-based sports media, the attention they pay to hockey is far, far from the biggest problem. Obviously interest in any sport is at least partly conditioning but at least there is proven interest and history in hockey in this country. NCAA March Madness? Not so much I'd say.

Unless they're playing in an important playoff game, I fail to see how the Raptors automatically merit more attention from a cross-Canada sports network than any of the Canadian NHL teams...

I'm a radio listener, switching back and forth between RC and CBC. I'll also listen to Impact and Hab games but just the game itself as listening to sports talk radio can result in permanent brain damage.

It's amusing to hear CBC blubber on and on and on as to how "All of Canada is holding their breath because the Jays/Raptors/TFC could win/lose tonight!" and then interviewing some schmuck from Brandon or Fredericton as proof that we're "all" in.

I hate to break it to them but I could give a rat's ass about the Jays or Raptors. Needless to say, I could never cheer for TFC.

[Berklon]

Originally Posted by Denscity

Wow MLS soccer is way more popular in BC than Ontario or Quebec! Must be our 40 year history with pro soccer? Mild climate?

Maybe MLS soccer, but not soccer in general. Huge soccer fanbase in Ontario - especially in the GTHA area.

[GreaterMontréal]

almost 200,000 soccer players in Quebec.

[Dalreg]

Originally Posted by SaskScraper

come up with a table with a larger sample size than mine if you don't like it, as for now we have to accept the data thats presented.

Have to accept those numbers for what they are. Stats can be changed in a heartbeat.