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  #61  
Old Posted Apr 19, 2021, 6:56 PM
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Originally Posted by harls View Post
Both my kids were born here. My wife, who was a nurse at the time, wanted nothing to do with the Gatineau hospital.
Maison des naissances (with midwives)?
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  #62  
Old Posted Apr 19, 2021, 6:58 PM
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I agree Orleans, Barrhaven and Kanata should have their own small hospital facilities.

The Orleans Health Hub was suppose to have an emergency (and possibly more), but was downsized after nearly a decade of dithering. Now it won't be much more than a mini Riverside with medical offices and imaging.

I agree though that Ottawa's hospitals are strangely spread-out, within the mid-century suburban belt, with the core and the newer suburbs mostly underserved. I'm very happy the new Civic will remain within the urban core (a bit closer even) instead of moving to Nepean, as had been discussed, because it would have made things worse by abandoning the dense core completely.
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  #63  
Old Posted Apr 19, 2021, 7:06 PM
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Do you just mean through patients paying for services in Ottawa, or is there more to it than that? I know that CHEO gets some funding from Quebec and explicitly includes West Quebec in its service area, but is there a net benefit to Ontario from that?
I think CHEO is the only one where Quebec is a bona fide partner that contributes to the hospital's bottom line.

For the others I think it's simply Quebec paying the fees for patients cared for in Ottawa hospitals.

There are all sorts of "leeching" urban legends about this but generally speaking Ottawa hospital administrators when discussions have taken place have not been that keen on seeing Quebec "repatriate" Quebec patients back across the river and their facilities generally welcome us with open arms. (I have only used CHEO on a few occasions for my kids since I've lived in Quebec. Never used other Ottawa hospitals for myself or my wife.)

So somehow I doubt Ottawa hospitals are getting hosed in this arrangement. At best they are coming out fairly even and of course if they come out even that still means they can justify more staff and services.
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  #64  
Old Posted Apr 19, 2021, 7:09 PM
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Originally Posted by J.OT13 View Post
I agree Orleans, Barrhaven and Kanata should have their own small hospital facilities.

The Orleans Health Hub was suppose to have an emergency (and possibly more), but was downsized after nearly a decade of dithering. Now it won't be much more than a mini Riverside with medical offices and imaging.

I agree though that Ottawa's hospitals are strangely spread-out, within the mid-century suburban belt, with the core and the newer suburbs mostly underserved. I'm very happy the new Civic will remain within the urban core (a bit closer even) instead of moving to Nepean, as had been discussed, because it would have made things worse by abandoning the dense core completely.
Kanata kinda has its own hospital with the Queensway-Carleton. It's a full-service AFAIK with emergency room and maternity ward. Another example of "what we used to do".

"These suburbs to the west of Ottawa are growing and are gonna grow even more. They're gonna need a hospital so let's build one now."

So you end up with a hospital in... Bells Corners.

If you applied the same logic on the other side of Ottawa you'd be able to give birth in Blackburn Hamlet today.
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  #65  
Old Posted Apr 19, 2021, 7:12 PM
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When Quebec completes its restructuring of health care in the Outaouais, it will be a huge advantage for Ottawa as the wait lists will be reduced and emergencies wait times will go down. At the end of the day, hospitals in Ottawa will either break even, or take in more money (because OHIP pays more than la Carte Soleil) while Ottawa residents will be served quicker and more efficiently.
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  #66  
Old Posted Apr 19, 2021, 7:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
Maison des naissances (with midwives)?
You got it.

I think they moved to another place now, on Ave. de Gatineau.

We had a friend who was pregnant at the same time as my second child. She had twins. She had no choice but to go to Montfort. This was in 2010.. Gatineau hospital wasn't equipped to handle this situation back then, I don't think the situation has changed.
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  #67  
Old Posted Apr 19, 2021, 7:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
I think CHEO is the only one where Quebec is a bona fide partner that contributes to the hospital's bottom line.

For the others I think it's simply Quebec paying the fees for patients cared for in Ottawa hospitals.

There are all sorts of "leeching" urban legends about this but generally speaking Ottawa hospital administrators when discussions have taken place have not been that keen on seeing Quebec "repatriate" Quebec patients back across the river and their facilities generally welcome us with open arms. (I have only used CHEO on a few occasions for my kids since I've lived in Quebec. Never used other Ottawa hospitals for myself or my wife.)

So somehow I doubt Ottawa hospitals are getting hosed in this arrangement. At best they are coming out fairly even and of course if they come out even that still means they can justify more staff and services.
Not sure how it works exactly, but I assume to the extent that there are waitlists for services, having more patients in line isn't great. Better facilities on the Quebec side should help everyone. (On that note, the ideal would be if we could all be under the same regional health care authority, but not like that's going to happen.)
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  #68  
Old Posted Apr 19, 2021, 7:28 PM
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Originally Posted by harls View Post
You got it.

I think they moved to another place now, on Ave. de Gatineau.

We had a friend who was pregnant at the same time as my second child. She had twins. She had no choice but to go to Montfort. This was in 2010.. Gatineau hospital wasn't equipped to handle this situation back then, I don't think the situation has changed.
That's... mysterious. I just checked with someone close to me who actually works in maternity in Gatineau hospital, and they definitely have the ability to deal with multiple births.

Here is a story from 2017 with a world record for the short time between the birth of twins, born at Gatineau hospital.

https://www.ledroit.com/actualites/g...cda98f6da33d5e
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  #69  
Old Posted Apr 19, 2021, 7:39 PM
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I've taken my kids to CHEO and I have always had great experiences.. almost saccharine.

Last time I went I got a few eye rolls from my kid.. and he is 11.
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  #70  
Old Posted Apr 19, 2021, 7:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
That's... mysterious. I just checked with someone close to me who actually works in maternity in Gatineau hospital, and they definitely have the ability to deal with multiple births.

Here is a story from 2017 with a world record for the short time between the birth of twins, born at Gatineau hospital.

https://www.ledroit.com/actualites/g...cda98f6da33d5e
I think her situation was not normal, come to think of it. That's probably why they transferred her.

..Or she got scared from my wife's stories.
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  #71  
Old Posted Apr 20, 2021, 1:10 PM
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I've taken my kids to CHEO and I have always had great experiences.. almost saccharine.
Same here, we always go to CHEO, always received with smiles and great service. The new wait time webpage they have is great to give you an idea of how long you'll wait. Made the mistake one time of going to Gatineau when we thought my daughter had broken a finger, never again, 6hour wait before seeing someone.
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  #72  
Old Posted Oct 6, 2021, 3:26 PM
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Un futur hôpital «high tech» pour l’Outaouais

JUSTINE MERCIER
Le Droit, 5 octobre 2021


https://www.ledroit.com/actualites/s...4fdf3c2f9c1e83

Quick summary.
  • Equipment and food will come-up to the floors without the need for staff. Real high-tech apparently. A dumb-waiter. Wow!
  • Samples from patients will also travel through the hospital without the need for staff (pneumatic tubes? You've done it again Quebec!)
  • Elimination of paper files... Maybe...
  • Sounds like patients will have to travel to the new hospital for tests, and travel back to other hospitals in the region for their stay. Very inefficient centralized approach.
  • $1.5 B. budget. 600 beds.
  • Shortlist of 5 or 6 possible locations. Of those, two or three top choices.
  • Location should be chosen by the end of the year.
  • Hull or Aylmer.
  • 9 minutes travel time max for an ambulance between highway and the hospital.
  • Architect should be hired before Fall 2022 elections.
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  #73  
Old Posted Oct 6, 2021, 4:07 PM
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Originally Posted by J.OT13 View Post
Un futur hôpital «high tech» pour l’Outaouais

JUSTINE MERCIER
Le Droit, 5 octobre 2021


https://www.ledroit.com/actualites/s...4fdf3c2f9c1e83

Quick summary.
  • Equipment and food will come-up to the floors without the need for staff. Real high-tech apparently. A dumb-waiter. Wow!
  • Samples from patients will also travel through the hospital without the need for staff (pneumatic tubes? You've done it again Quebec!)
  • Elimination of paper files... Maybe...
  • Sounds like patients will have to travel to the new hospital for tests, and travel back to other hospitals in the region for their stay. Very inefficient centralized approach.
  • $1.5 B. budget. 600 beds.
  • Shortlist of 5 or 6 possible locations. Of those, two or three top choices.
  • Location should be chosen by the end of the year.
  • Hull or Aylmer.
  • 9 minutes travel time max for an ambulance between highway and the hospital.
  • Architect should be hired before Fall 2022 elections.
Any word on the exact preferred locations? I'm optimistic about this proposal. It really needs to go through.
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  #74  
Old Posted Oct 6, 2021, 5:08 PM
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Any word on the exact preferred locations? I'm optimistic about this proposal. It really needs to go through.
No word yet on a single possible location. Just clues based on requirements and a few guesses from LeDroit over the past year or so.
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  #75  
Old Posted Oct 7, 2021, 5:50 AM
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No word yet on a single possible location. Just clues based on requirements and a few guesses from LeDroit over the past year or so.
They can build a hospital anywhere they want. The reality is Bill 21 and Bill 96 will not allow them to staff a hospital. The same thing going on in England with the gas shortages will happen in Quebec with the discriminatory bill 21 and bill 96 laws.

They can build it a hospital, but no one will be there to work in it.

(P.S. and this is coming from someone who lives in Gatineau)
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  #76  
Old Posted Oct 7, 2021, 12:49 PM
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I can somewhat understand Bill 96. Protect the French language, sure. Goes a bit far, but it's not the end of the world. Bill 21 is, anyway you look at it, discriminatory and will bite them in the ass.

Any extra money they throw at nurses, or other health care professional won't help. Between such laws and dismal working conditions, they will continue to flock to Ottawa.
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  #77  
Old Posted Oct 7, 2021, 3:02 PM
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Originally Posted by jt-mtl View Post
They can build a hospital anywhere they want. The reality is Bill 21 and Bill 96 will not allow them to staff a hospital. The same thing going on in England with the gas shortages will happen in Quebec with the discriminatory bill 21 and bill 96 laws.

They can build it a hospital, but no one will be there to work in it.

(P.S. and this is coming from someone who lives in Gatineau)
Québec couldn't staff anything in Gatineau before those two laws (which do not change anything for any hospital staff anyways) were passed. As J.OT13 pointed out, the working conditions are awful with mandatory overtime and the likes, plus salaries are much lower than in Ottawa.

I don't think these laws are right, but when talking about the healthcare labour shortage it's just poudre aux yeux. There's a lot of things terribly wrong with how the workers are treated.

Last edited by Kelnoz; Oct 7, 2021 at 3:30 PM.
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  #78  
Old Posted Oct 13, 2021, 1:49 PM
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Futur hôpital en Outaouais: quels sont les terrains d’intérêt?

JUSTINE MERCIER
MATHIEU BÉLANGER
Le Droit, 13 octobre 2021


Alors que le choix du site où sera construit le futur Centre hospitalier affilié universitaire (CHAU) de l’Outaouais doit se faire bientôt pour respecter l’échéancier prévu par le gouvernement, certains terrains semblent déjà susciter davantage d’intérêt des responsables de ce projet évalué à 1,5 milliard$.

En entrevue avec Le Droit à la fin septembre, le ministre de la Santé, Christian Dubé, a souligné qu’il fallait «absolument que le choix du site se fasse dans les prochains mois».

Le directeur du bureau de projet au Centre intégré de santé et de services sociaux de l’Outaouais (CISSSO), Michel Parent, a évoqué une «shortlist» de cinq à six terrains potentiels, répartis dans les secteurs Hull et Aylmer. Le ministre responsable de la région, Mathieu Lacombe, a pour sa part indiqué qu’il y en a deux ou trois «en tête de liste».

Selon les informations obtenues par Le Droit, un terrain de plus de 600 000 mètres carrés situé en bordure du boulevard des Allumettières, au nord du club de golf Champlain, dans le secteur Aylmer, fait partie des sites potentiels ayant été considérés. Cet «espace de terrain non aménagé et non exploité» dont l’évaluation foncière s’élève à près de 3,8 millions$ appartient à la Commission de la capitale nationale (CCN), avec qui des discussions ont d’ailleurs eu lieu au sujet de sites potentiels pour ériger le futur CHAU de l’Outaouais.


Un terrain de plus de 600 000 mètres carrés situé en bordure du boulevard des Allumettières, au nord du club de golf Champlain, dans le secteur Aylmer, fait partie des sites potentiels ayant été considérés.
SOURCE : ATLAS DE LA VILLE DE GATINEAU. IMAGES : GOOGLE MAPS

Location ou achat?

Des échanges de courriels datés du 30 avril au 22 juin dernier, dont Le Droit a obtenu copie, laissent clairement entrevoir que le gouvernement du Québec a un intérêt certain pour un terrain appartenant à la CCN. Il n’est toutefois pas précisé de quel site il est question. On y apprend, entre autres, qu’une rencontre a eu lieu le 17 mai entre des dirigeants de la CCN et la Société québécoises des infrastructures (SQI), qui assure la gestion immobilière pour le gouvernement du Québec.

Dans un courriel écrit le 17 mai, un représentant du service de l’immobilier à la CCN avise son interlocuteur à la SQI que le gouvernement fédéral serait en mesure de rendre le terrain visé disponible à l’intérieur d’un «échéancier réaliste» d’un an et demi à deux ans. «À compter de ce moment, nous serions en mesure de conclure une entente avec le gouvernement du Québec pour le site», poursuit le conseiller immobilier de la CCN.

Il n’est pas précisé s’il s’agit d’une vente où d’une location, mais dans le même courriel, la CCN précise que «pour aller de l’avant, comme c’est un terrain fédéral, des approbations sur l’utilisation du sol, du design et des transactions immobilières seraient requises en vertu de la Loi sur la capitale nationale».

La SQI a voulu obtenir des informations par rapport à la contamination du sol. «Après vérification, la CCN n’a pas d’information concernant la qualité des sols de la propriété, toutefois, comme il n’y a pas d’enjeu environnemental majeur sur la propriété adjacente de la CCN, nous pouvons supposer que le risque d’enjeux majeurs serait minime», a répondu la CCN, toujours dans le même courriel.


SOURCE : ATLAS DE LA VILLE DE GATINEAU. IMAGES : GOOGLE MAPS

Dans un autre courriel daté du 21 juin, la CCN rappelle à la SQI que de nombreuses étapes devront être respectées si Québec souhaite négocier un protocole d’entente avec le fédéral dans le cadre de la construction du nouvel hôpital de l’Outaouais. La CCN rappelle qu’elle souhaitera s’entendre sur divers éléments, «notamment la superficie requise pour la mise en place du projet d’hôpital et son emplacement potentiel sur le terrain».

Près du Réno-Dépôt?

Il y aurait aussi de l’intérêt pour le terrain se trouvant derrière le Réno-Dépôt et l’écocentre municipal, dans le secteur Hull. Celui-ci a l’avantage d’être situé plus près de l’autoroute, et l’accès au CHAU y serait aussi facilité en transport en commun grâce à la présence du corridor du Rapibus juste à côté.


Il y aurait aussi de l’intérêt pour le terrain se trouvant derrière le Réno-Dépôt et l’écocentre municipal, dans le secteur Hull.
SOURCE : ATLAS DE LA VILLE DE GATINEAU. IMAGES : GOOGLE MAPS


Selon l’«avis d’intérêt ou demande d’information» qu’avait lancé la SQI le printemps dernier, le terrain où sera érigé le CHAU doit s’étendre sur «environ 150 000» mètres carrés. Le terrain situé près du Réno-Dépôt et de l’écocentre a une superficie de 168 000 mètres carrés, mais la portion la plus à l’est se trouve dans la zone d’intervention spéciale (ZIS) visant à assurer une meilleure gestion des zones inondables.

L’évaluation foncière accorde une valeur de 4,2 millions$ à cet «espace de terrain non aménagé et non exploité» autrefois utilisé comme dépotoir à neige, qui appartient au Groupe Bathurst. Ce groupe immobilier basé à Montréal avait proposé, au milieu des années 2000, d’y installer un nouvel amphithéâtre pour les Olympiques de Gatineau.


SOURCE : ATLAS DE LA VILLE DE GATINEAU. IMAGES : GOOGLE MAPS

D’autres terrains feraient aussi l’objet d’une analyse de la part de Québec. Le vaste ensemble industriel comprenant plusieurs propriétés derrière le magasin Pilon Ltée, sur le boulevard Montclair, dans le centre-ville, serait examiné, tout comme l’immense terrain du Centre Asticou, qui est une propriété du gouvernement fédéral.

Analyse immobilière

La SQI, qui agit comme «gestionnaire du projet», a publié un avis d’appel d’offres, le 29 septembre dernier, pour dénicher une firme pouvant réaliser l’«analyse immobilière» du futur CHAU de l’Outaouais. Les soumissions pour ce contrat doivent être soumises au plus tard le 18 octobre.

Cette analyse doit notamment permettre d’estimer les coûts et l’échéancier du projet, de définir ses «paramètres de mise en oeuvre et de réalisation» et de réaliser une modélisation de l’aménagement du site. On y précise aussi que «la superficie brute totale du projet s’élève à un peu plus de 190 000 mètres carrés», ce qui équivaut à environ cinq fois la superficie du magasin IKEA d’Ottawa.

Dans les documents liés à cet avis d’appel d’offres, la liste des «échéances probables» de l’analyse immobilière indique qu’une «visite du site» pourrait avoir lieu d’ici le 22 novembre, tandis que l’«analyse du site» devrait être faite d’ici le 20 décembre.

Le contrat d’analyse immobilière devrait commencer entre le 8 novembre et le 15 décembre, tandis que «la date probable de fin du mandat est au mois d’avril 2022». L’analyse finale devrait être remise vers le 11 avril 2022.

Les documents de l’appel d’offres lancé par la SQI précise que la construction du nouvel hôpital de 600 lits permettra d’appuyer la mission du CISSSO «et l’ambition qui l’anime désormais de vouloir ‘’mieux se regrouper pour pouvoir mieux se déployer dans des environnements modernes et innovants et renforcer l’offre de services de base en périphérique’’».

https://www.ledroit.com/actualites/s...6cccbb3e065be8
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  #79  
Old Posted Oct 13, 2021, 7:41 PM
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It looks like the NCC has already ruled out the location by the golf course: https://www.ledroit.com/actualites/s...a1410ba981f6ef
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  #80  
Old Posted Oct 13, 2021, 8:43 PM
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The article mentions that the Ecocentre is beside Reno-Depot at that site, but doesn't make mention that it is also a waste transfer site and smells horrible.
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