CHICAGO | Aqua | 858 FT / 262 M | 87 FLOORS

[i_am_hydrogen]

Originally Posted by Atlas

I hope this project is canceled or they change the design.

With all due respect, I completely disagree. Even if I weren't as enthralled with this design as I am, I'd still want this project to go forward. This is an 83 story building--an 83 story building. We've become so spoiled by this recent boom that it's easy for us to lose sight of the fact that it could dry up at any time. Whenever a major project like this goes through, I consider it a small miracle and wonder if it can keep happening again and again. Fortunately, it does. And so we need to keep snapping up as many projects as possible, save for the truly awful ones such as 29-39 Lasalle, before the boom subsides.

Originally Posted by forumly_chgoman

^^^^^off topic but i_am_hydrogen I love Mingus......Mingus,Mingus,Mingus

Nice.

[the urban politician]

Originally Posted by Atlas

I don't know, I think it will ruin Chicago's skyline. It just looks odd, it looks like it should be in Dubai not Chicago.

^ No offense, and I very well could be characterizing you incorrectly, but an attitude like yours is what drove Chicago into an architectural toilet in the late 90's/early 00's (luckily we're out of that rut)

[honte]

Yes. I was thinking about the 877' foot figure (above ground level - not street level) some more... One way to look at the scope of this boom is to consider that merely 40 years ago, this would have effectively been the tallest building in Chicago and, if I'm not mistaken, the tallest in the world outside of NYC.

That's pretty amazing, and even more amazing when you consider that two other buildings taller yet are presently U/C here, with several others in the same category! We are very lucky.

PS Hydrogen - Black Saint is my favorite recording of all time.

[Atlas]

Originally Posted by i am hydrogen

With all due respect, I completely disagree. Even if I weren't as enthralled with this design as I am, I'd still want this project to go forward. This is an 83 story building--an 83 story building. We've become so spoiled by this recent boom that it's easy for us to lose sight of the fact that it could dry up at any time. Whenever a major project like this goes through, I consider it a small miracle and wonder if it can keep happening again and again. Fortunately, it does. And so we need to keep snapping up as many projects as possible, save for the truly awful ones such as 29-39 Lasalle, before the boom subsides.

That's why I said "or change the design."

Originally Posted by the urban politician

^ No offense, and I very well could be characterizing you incorrectly, but an attitude like yours is what drove Chicago into an architectural toilet in the late 90's/early 00's (luckily we're out of that rut)

This building is an architectural toilet.

[Steely Dan]

Originally Posted by Atlas

This building is an architectural toilet.

do you find marina city to be an architectural toilet too?

aqua will likely be the best skyscraper built in chicago, perhaps even the nation, in roughly 3 decades. the spirit of goldberg lives! let's make chicago a city of architectural relevance again (it's been so long).

[Atlas]

Fine.....

lol, it would look better totaly covered in glass though.

[observer]

Aqua is a fine building diagram, however it is in the wrong climate zone...it should be in a climate that's warm all year round....I find the geometry as wonderful as the next person, and will be among those who go to the base of the building to look up at it, but the fact remains that Chicago is more cold than warm, and this is a painted concrete box with no insulation minus the insulated glass....when those miles of balconies are frozen it's going to cause a huge thermal bridge which will make the building extremely expensive to heat. In that respect, it's very enviromentally unfriendly and irresponsible...however I dought that will ever make it into the press.

One other note...there's are at least two reasons many residential towers along the lake do not have balconies (especially large ones)...the first one is the obvious need for developers wanting to max out nssf with lake views, but the more functional one is that because at least part of the year they are COVERED with spiders, blown in from lake breezes.

Great design diagram...wrong climate to be building it in. I am currious as to what Studio Gang will do with their next highrise they are designing (a 40 story apartment building on the near south side I beleive...that's just a rumor I've heard). We are lucky to have a design firm like that in the city of Chicago.

[Steely Dan]

^ so do you also believe that marina city shouldn't have been built in chicago?

[spyguy]

Originally Posted by observer

I am currious as to what Studio Gang will do with their next highrise they are designing (a 40 story apartment building on the near south side I beleive...that's just a rumor I've heard).

Hmm...hope it's true

[observer]

Steely Dan,

I don't know how to answer that...marina city was built at a different time with different priorities in society. If it were a new proposal today in Chicago, I would have the same opinion.

I would consider Aqua a near flawless design if where being built in a desert for example (cold at night, hot during the day).

Now if they decided to heat Aqua with old school radiators...that could be extremely economical and effecient...but my guess is that they will use electric baseboard heat to suplement the fan coils.

[Steely Dan]

^ well i say screw society and priorities, i wanna live in a city filled with cool-looking buildings, and aqua fits the bill. i eagerly anticipate its construction.

[honte]

Originally Posted by observer

Aqua is a fine building diagram, however it is in the wrong climate zone...it should be in a climate that's warm all year round....I find the geometry as wonderful as the next person, and will be among those who go to the base of the building to look up at it, but the fact remains that Chicago is more cold than warm, and this is a painted concrete box with no insulation minus the insulated glass....when those miles of balconies are frozen it's going to cause a huge thermal bridge which will make the building extremely expensive to heat. In that respect, it's very enviromentally unfriendly and irresponsible...however I dought that will ever make it into the press.

The city has significantly increased its requirements for high-rise efficiency... that's part of why we're seeing so much more nice curtainwall on typically cheap-as-it-gets concrete apartment buildings.

I am no expert, but while I understand the concept that a continuous floor slab extending into the elements would create a thermal bridge, I'm guessing that this building has found a way to prevent this effect. I don't think it could have been approved otherwise... and Studio Gang is much more sophisticated than that, I believe.

Also, not meaning to argue, but you neglect that the overhanging balconies are environmental in that they shade the windows, keeping interiors cool. Also they may act as a thermal mass in the cooler season, such as now, which would allow the sun's warmth to be retained and heat the units on cool evenings.

Good point about the spiders. My old unit used to be covered too!

[i_am_hydrogen]

Originally Posted by Atlas

That's why I said "or change the design."

Here's your original statement:

Originally Posted by Atlas

I hope this project is canceled or they change the design.

Saying "I hope this project is cancelled or they change the design" is the same thing as saying "If they don't change the design, then I hope this project is cancelled." They aren't changing the design, ergo, you hope the project is cancelled. So my original point still stands.

[Atlas]

How do you know that's what I meant?

[i_am_hydrogen]

Originally Posted by Atlas

How do you know that's what I meant?

By operation of logic, that's what you meant. You laid out two simple alternatives: Cancel the project or change the design. If the design isn't changed, the only remaining alternative, according to your statement, is to cancel the project.

[Atlas]

Ok, I'll reword that. "I hope that they don't build it or that they change it's design."

[i_am_hydrogen]

Originally Posted by Atlas

Ok, I'll reword that. "I hope that they don't build it or that they change it's design."

Seriously, I don't really want to continue this for much longer. Saying "I hope that they don't build it" is the functional equivalent of saying "I hope it's cancelled."

[Atlas]

That's not the point, the point is that now it says what I've been trying to say all along. The part about the design.

I agree, let's stop arguing about a sentence in which I have corrected my mistake. Case closed.

[i_am_hydrogen]

Originally Posted by Atlas

That's not the point, the point is that now it says what I've been trying to say all along. The part about the design.

It's no different from your earlier statement. Again, two simple alternatives. If they don't change the design, then they shouldn't build it. That's my last post on this. If it isn't clicking in your head, then it never will.

[Nowhereman1280]

Hey guys there is no need to argue about it because I don't think the original point was valid at all. I mean last time I checked concrete wasn't the greatest conductor, thus suggesting that having a continuous floor slab extending outside wouldn't really do that much. I am pretty sure more heat gets through glass and steel than concrete. Isn't that why they often build residential buildings out of concrete, because it insulates the rooms from noise? Now if those balconies were made out of steel, that would be a different story.

Not to mention that Honte had a good point about the cooling effect of overhanging balconies durring the summer. You musn't forget that this climate is broiling hot for a good quarter of the year.

On top of all that, this building just looks cool.