PHILADELPHIA | Highrise Development Thread X

[TonyTone]

DJI_0267 by Tony Valuez, on Flickr

DJI_0263 by Tony Valuez, on Flickr

DJI_0262 by Tony Valuez, on Flickr

DJI_0250 by Tony Valuez, on Flickr

[reparcsyks]

Originally Posted by bdurk

Why does every cool thing Philadelphia ever proposed never come to fruition

Our biggest miss ever.

https://hiddencityphila.org/2018/11/...ly-for-its-hq/

[Mr Saturn64]

Originally Posted by bdurk

Why does every cool thing Philadelphia ever proposed never come to fruition

I've spend an unhealthy amount of time researching this. I believe there are three categories of canned project

- Economy. The Centennial Tower, the American Commerce Center, the A. Merritt Taylor subway plan, the Episcopal Cathedral in Roxborough, and a whole crapload of skyscrapers along the Delaware, all due to financial issues. Speaks for itself.

- NIMBYism/provincialism - NIMBYism is a problem all cities face (I've heard Boston is NIMBY central), but here in Philly they've chased away some great projects. World Trade Square could've boosted Philly's international economic role, but it got NIMBYed by people who didn't even live in the same neighborhood. Then there's the largely separate issue of provincial thinking, which in my view has been a problem in this city since at least the early 1800s. I said before on a day when Philly was pissing me off that Philly is the largest small town in the world. There have been for decades/centuries a sort of small town attitude to settle for less, keep things the way they've always been, etc. The gentlemen's agreement is a great example of this. The story of the Widener art collection and how it moved is another.

- Sometimes you just get screwed. Philly was going to host the United Nations Headquarters until Rockefeller paid them to come to New York. What can you do about that? Philly was a finalist for the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, but the public voters selected Cleveland (although that always struck me as dubious). Nothing you can do about that.

The Centennial Tower lives rent free in my head. I can't help but imagine the snowball effect that that would have had. Imagine if we had everything ever proposed. 5 1000+ footers, Centennial Tower and UN together in Fairmount Park, Rock Hall on South Broad, Phillies ballpark district on Spring Garden, subways throughout the whole city, more skyscrapers, more museums, all that stuff. It haunts me.

Also, no matter how bad our never built history is, Chicago's is a thousand times worse.

[jaysb]

Originally Posted by Mr Saturn64

I've spend an unhealthy amount of time researching this. I believe there are three categories of canned project

- Economy. The Centennial Tower, the American Commerce Center, the A. Merritt Taylor subway plan, the Episcopal Cathedral in Roxborough, and a whole crapload of skyscrapers along the Delaware, all due to financial issues. Speaks for itself.

- NIMBYism/provincialism - NIMBYism is a problem all cities face (I've heard Boston is NIMBY central), but here in Philly they've chased away some great projects. World Trade Square could've boosted Philly's international economic role, but it got NIMBYed by people who didn't even live in the same neighborhood. Then there's the largely separate issue of provincial thinking, which in my view has been a problem in this city since at least the early 1800s. I said before on a day when Philly was pissing me off that Philly is the largest small town in the world. There have been for decades/centuries a sort of small town attitude to settle for less, keep things the way they've always been, etc. The gentlemen's agreement is a great example of this. The story of the Widener art collection and how it moved is another.

- Sometimes you just get screwed. Philly was going to host the United Nations Headquarters until Rockefeller paid them to come to New York. What can you do about that? Philly was a finalist for the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, but the public voters selected Cleveland (although that always struck me as dubious). Nothing you can do about that.

The Centennial Tower lives rent free in my head. I can't help but imagine the snowball effect that that would have had. Imagine if we had everything ever proposed. 5 1000+ footers, Centennial Tower and UN together in Fairmount Park, Rock Hall on South Broad, Phillies ballpark district on Spring Garden, subways throughout the whole city, more skyscrapers, more museums, all that stuff. It haunts me.

Also, no matter how bad our never built history is, Chicago's is a thousand times worse.

haha yea it sucks some of that stuff didn't come to fruition, but there is a LOT of good stuff happening now! How many of us ever expected the 95 Cap Project to get moving (etc etc)?

[PHLtoNYC]

Originally Posted by reparcsyks

Our biggest miss ever.

https://hiddencityphila.org/2018/11/...ly-for-its-hq/

A shame it came down to money. Wonder why deep pocketed Philadelphian's didn't counter Rockefeller's bid? (maybe they did, but he was insanely wealthy).

If the UN was in Philadelphia, the city's international profile would be immensely larger, on par with Boston, San Fran, Chicago.

[bridge25]

Philadelphia has an incredibly rich history, I'd argue more than Boston, but I feel like the City doesn't do enough to capitalize on it.

That being said, I'd like to see the City and region really think outside the box for a new attraction that would grow the city's tourism industry. This might sound crazy, but what a Sphere (like in Las Vegas?). The stadium district seems perfect for this kind of thing. It wouldn't cannibalize Las Vegas but complement it with an east coast location.

We have Comcast HQ'd here. Why don't we have some sort of NBC or Universal theme park? What about a huge indoor Universal theme park on Market East? I feel like other than the jobs, Comcast doesn't seem to want to support the City as much as it should. Even Philly Live is kind of an embarrassment.

[Skintreesnail]

There are a bunch of spots in the city screaming for development, but the stadium district is definitely one of them. FDR park is beautiful, there's the bsl for rapid transit and i can definitely see large scale development lining broad street. The sea of parking down there now is gross. There's already momentum there from the navy yard and hilco development.

[Mr Saturn64]

Originally Posted by reparcsyks

Our biggest miss ever.

https://hiddencityphila.org/2018/11/...ly-for-its-hq/

In that article, the author hints that it's a good thing the UN didn't come here because we would have lost a chunk of green space. That's village thinking at its worst. Sure, we can become the capital of the world, or we can save this park. That attitude is a problem.

Originally Posted by PHLtoNYC

A shame it came down to money. Wonder why deep pocketed Philadelphian's didn't counter Rockefeller's bid? (maybe they did, but he was insanely wealthy).

If the UN was in Philadelphia, the city's international profile would be immensely larger, on par with Boston, San Fran, Chicago.

There's a whole book on this process, it's called Capital of the World: The Race to Host the United Nations by Charlene Mires (who I think is from Philly). The Rockefeller bid came in at the 11th hour and it was too late for us and San Francisco to counter it.

Originally Posted by bridge25

Philadelphia has an incredibly rich history, I'd argue more than Boston, but I feel like the City doesn't do enough to capitalize on it.

That being said, I'd like to see the City and region really think outside the box for a new attraction that would grow the city's tourism industry. This might sound crazy, but what a Sphere (like in Las Vegas?). The stadium district seems perfect for this kind of thing. It wouldn't cannibalize Las Vegas but complement it with an east coast location.

We have Comcast HQ'd here. Why don't we have some sort of NBC or Universal theme park? What about a huge indoor Universal theme park on Market East? I feel like other than the jobs, Comcast doesn't seem to want to support the City as much as it should. Even Philly Live is kind of an embarrassment.

Comcast is at least, to their credit, building the new development down by the Wells Fargo Center. I would love to see a new landmark rise up, but it seems to me like the great days of building landmarks are over.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I guess now's a good time to talk about this; I'm actually writing a book about never built Philly history, from 1840 to the present. I would like to see it published someday, but I have no idea when or how that would happen. I have around 50 pages written so far, fully researched, but I'm having trouble finding exact sources and chasing leads.

[3rd&Brown]

Originally Posted by bridge25

Philadelphia has an incredibly rich history, I'd argue more than Boston, but I feel like the City doesn't do enough to capitalize on it.

That being said, I'd like to see the City and region really think outside the box for a new attraction that would grow the city's tourism industry. This might sound crazy, but what a Sphere (like in Las Vegas?). The stadium district seems perfect for this kind of thing. It wouldn't cannibalize Las Vegas but complement it with an east coast location.

We have Comcast HQ'd here. Why don't we have some sort of NBC or Universal theme park? What about a huge indoor Universal theme park on Market East? I feel like other than the jobs, Comcast doesn't seem to want to support the City as much as it should. Even Philly Live is kind of an embarrassment.

So many of these types of attractions are gimmicky but I do agree an East Coast Sphere would be amazing and the stadium district is perfect for it.

[BroadandMarket]

Originally Posted by Mr Saturn64

In that article, the author hints that it's a good thing the UN didn't come here because we would have lost a chunk of green space. That's village thinking at its worst. Sure, we can become the capital of the world, or we can save this park. That attitude is a problem.


There's a whole book on this process, it's called Capital of the World: The Race to Host the United Nations by Charlene Mires (who I think is from Philly). The Rockefeller bid came in at the 11th hour and it was too late for us and San Francisco to counter it.


Comcast is at least, to their credit, building the new development down by the Wells Fargo Center. I would love to see a new landmark rise up, but it seems to me like the great days of building landmarks are over.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I guess now's a good time to talk about this; I'm actually writing a book about never built Philly history, from 1840 to the present. I would like to see it published someday, but I have no idea when or how that would happen. I have around 50 pages written so far, fully researched, but I'm having trouble finding exact sources and chasing leads.

I'm still very skeptical of how much the WFC complex will get built up. I think the venue gets built and that little Xfinity Live outback addition. The renderings were absurd and included a lake in the middle of H lot and pedestrian bridges over Broad to FDR and Pattison to CBP. Citizens Bank Way is just begging to have some bars and restaurants, that road is already closed on Phillies game days.

If Comcast really wanted to rep Philly, they'd build a new NBC Sports broadcast complex at the WFC. Comcast is buying TNT's share of the NBA broadcast so I'd at least hope for a show hosted at Comcast Innovation studio where local 10 NBC is. Charles Barkley would be an obvious pick with his ties to the area and the TNT show.

[TK2001]

Philadelphia skyline from New Jersey by Philly SkyGuy, on Flickr

SEPTA Streetcar and Interurban by Don Oltmann, on Flickr

[Jes75]

I couldn't find the post thread where it was announced that Widener Law was looking to move into one of the old MBNA/Bank of America buildings in several years time dependent on funding.

I am curious given that the DCAD is looking to cease in business operations. Widener Law, I would believe, would be looking at DCAD's facility to be bought out for housing for students, since the goal is to offer housing in downtown Wilmington (close to the new proposed Law school location).

So, if Widener Law is potentially looking to move to downtown Wilmington, so this would create an opportunity for Wilmington University to purchase Widener Law's existing campus to augment its new law school program?

I am sure that Wilmington U is also looking at Concord Mall as possible place for future expansion efforts down the road.

[ScreamShatter]

Anyone go to BOS party last night for Pride? That party hit hard this year. Probably like 4k people at filmore. Haven’t seen nightlife like that in Philly in a long time. Really cool to see phillys club scene rebirthing.

[Raja]

Originally Posted by ScreamShatter

Anyone go to BOS party last night for Pride? That party hit hard this year. Probably like 4k people at filmore. Haven’t seen nightlife like that in Philly in a long time. Really cool to see phillys club scene rebirthing.

Wasn't there, but this weekend has been packed generally. And, perhaps even better, I did not see a single person passed out, shooting up, or smoking any of the three times I took the El yesterday--and that includes not just on the train, but in the stations too!

[ScreamShatter]

Originally Posted by Raja

Wasn't there, but this weekend has been packed generally. And, perhaps even better, I did not see a single person passed out, shooting up, or smoking any of the three times I took the El yesterday--and that includes not just on the train, but in the stations too!

Ya missed out. That party last night was the closest thing I’ve seen to Ibiza. Couldn’t believe they pulled off that in Philly.

You going to the street festival today?

[reparcsyks]

Originally Posted by ScreamShatter

Anyone go to BOS party last night for Pride? That party hit hard this year. Probably like 4k people at filmore. Haven’t seen nightlife like that in Philly in a long time. Really cool to see phillys club scene rebirthing.

I was at The Fillmore earlier for a different event. Once we wrapped, I was loading out - the clients were all from out of town and seriously impressed by the nightlife turning out for the Fillmore event. It made Philly look like Berlin. I drove a few back to their hotel and the whole city was packed with people - they were all experiencing serious FOMO at never having visited Philly before. They planned on getting out of town early this morning but spent the entire day here.

[TonyTone]

I'm like 98% sure that Ped traffic is up to pre C19 Times. The city is booming everyday, and it's great.

WE ARE SO BACK

[ScreamShatter]

Originally Posted by reparcsyks

I was at The Fillmore earlier for a different event. Once we wrapped, I was loading out - the clients were all from out of town and seriously impressed by the nightlife turning out for the Fillmore event. It made Philly look like Berlin. I drove a few back to their hotel and the whole city was packed with people - they were all experiencing serious FOMO at never having visited Philly before. They planned on getting out of town early this morning but spent the entire day here.

That was def the general consensus. It’s funny bc my friend came in from Houston for the party and he’s a big traveler (lived in Germany for years), and he was comparing Philly party scene to Berlin after this weekend bc he said. “The city has an edge.” The staff at the Filmore were hilarious too…the clothing check ladies said to us as we walked out “the gays certainly party on a different level…and we’ve never made this much money doing coatcheck.” ������

Many of us had been giving feedback to the BOS planners that we wanted proper European/Miami style circuit parties and they gave it and it paid off big. Even the Pride festival this year was bigger than ever. Never seen that many people crammed into those blocks.

Philly should realize this is an underserved opportunity. These parties and festivals rake in huge dollars. People travel from far away to get to the best ones.

[reparcsyks]

Originally Posted by ScreamShatter

That was def the general consensus. It’s funny bc my friend came in from Houston for the party and he’s a big traveler (lived in Germany for years), and he was comparing Philly party scene to Berlin after this weekend bc he said. “The city has an edge.” The staff at the Filmore were hilarious too…the clothing check ladies said to us as we walked out “the gays certainly party on a different level…and we’ve never made this much money doing coatcheck.” ������

Many of us had been giving feedback to the BOS planners that we wanted proper European/Miami style circuit parties and they gave it and it paid off big. Even the Pride festival this year was bigger than ever. Never seen that many people crammed into those blocks.

Philly should realize this is an underserved opportunity. These parties and festivals rake in huge dollars. People travel from far away to get to the best ones.

As an ally and dad of an LGBTQIA+ child, I was “proud” to see Philly nightlife represented so well, and proud to see the Philly gay community throw a killer parade. Agree that these things make a city feel like a real city.

[PHLtoNYC]

A blessing in disguise.

Center City apartment development scrapped, retailer sought for space
https://www.bizjournals.com/philadel...velopment.html

Plans have been scrapped for a mid-rise apartment building on the western edge of Center City and the owner of the property is looking to lease the existing single-story building to a retail tenant.

“Prior to the Feds beginning this series of rate increases Trammell Crow had a couple of potential clients interested in working with them on this project,” Zeghibe said. “Once those interest rates started to rise, they backed away. The capital markets just went to the sidelines and they didn’t have a partner to work with.”

Zeghibe, who is also president of Patriot Parking, said the property is being leased and not sold because it’s unlikely it would sell for as high as Trammell Crow was willing to pay. The Patriot Parking entity has owned the site since 1995.

“There’s no reason to leap into another sale,” Zeghibe said. “I would like to see the market get a little bit stronger. And it will. It always does.”

Zeghibe wants to see development throughout Philadelphia pick back up before construction at the former Rite Aid will come back into focus.