Salt Lake:Official development news thread

[RFPCME]

Elworth: The world's first skyscraper, the Eiffel Tower, is in Paris. Paris also has many, many tall buildings, concentrated in the Northwestern part of the city known as La Defense', as well as around the belt route that surrounds the city. London, too, although not as many as Paris, has a fair share of tall buildings, but they are in the Eastend, like the Canada Tower.

Both cities, much to their credit, chose to maintain the character of their inner-city cores. London's history goes back 2,000 years. Paris over a 1,000 years, so there was/is a lot of character to preserve. Both cities also still have a great deal of room to expand in all directions.

SLC does have an inner city core, but tall buildings (at least at the time, they were considered tall) have been part of that core. SLC also does not have the room to expand, hemmed in by the mountains and the Lake. So, like Manhattan in a way, it makes sense for SLC to build up--up is part of the character. and its the only space left in which to expand.

[Future Mayor]

I'm glad to hear that the Greek Orthodox Church is considering their expansion again. I say again because I took a tour of the church during my undergrad at the U either in 98 or 99 and they were talking about their expansion back then. Hopefully they put it on hold for 10 years and are now talking about is seriously. I would like to see them expand but seeing as how it has been being discussed for at least 10 years now I won't hold my breath, but I will cross my fingers hoping that it does actually happen.

[Stenar]

Originally Posted by Justnslcsugarhood.

I would love height restrictions every where but probably between second east and west temple and down to eightth south. I prefer quality over quantity so I would love allot of eight to twelve story buildings that are nicely done downtown. I think if we stick to focusing on how nice a building looks over how tall it is it would bring in some decent development, however, it might make companies think twice about building here.

I agree... mostly. I think there should be height restrictions, but I think the corridor on South Temple from Main St. to 400 W (Gateway) should be developed with hi-rise offices as well.

400 South between Main and 9th East should be developed with bldgs 4-6 stories that front the sidewalk, no setbacks for tacky parking lots. Actually, I think I read that was in the newish master plan... that's where I got the idea.

[jmonkey]

Originally Posted by Future Mayor

I'm glad to hear that the Greek Orthodox Church is considering their expansion again. I say again because I took a tour of the church during my undergrad at the U either in 98 or 99 and they were talking about their expansion back then. Hopefully they put it on hold for 10 years and are now talking about is seriously. I would like to see them expand but seeing as how it has been being discussed for at least 10 years now I won't hold my breath, but I will cross my fingers hoping that it does actually happen.

I hope they are considering expansion, or building on the lot. If I remember correctly, the church had expressed reservations about building in the space that hosts the greek festival--perhaps the festival is moving? Why isn't it held in Pioneer Park, instead of in a parking lot?

They also own the lot across the street, which was on of the possible sites for a public market. Could this be the lot being developed? Is the public market actually have any momentum to happen soon? Or is it still just a pipe-dream?

In either case, the Greek Orthodox Church is sitting on some prime property on those two lots. I hope they are developed right, and I hope the church remains a viable presence there.

[PandaUte]

For what it's worth . . .

I noticed what appeared to be a survey team at the old warehouse just north of the Intermodal Hub on 600 West.

Could SLC possibly being be pulling the trigger on the proposed year-round public market? I know that building was on the short list of potential development sites.

I hope so . . .

[delts145]

Originally Posted by Future Mayor

As for the streets to enliven dt., I think the key is to break up the blocks were possible. I think creating a vibrant Regent Street, Market Street, Exchange Place and other mid block streets such as the proposed Main to Regent connector in conjunction with the theater will ad a significant amount of vibrancy and intimacy to the city, I could see making these streets one way. What will help this mid block streets to become vibrant and stay that way is direct access to those streets, particularly in my opinion, residential buildings need to have their main access on these streets, this will create the pedestrian traffic that is necessary to spur additional neighborhood type retail on these non major streets.

Very much agree Future Mayor!! Infact, IMO, if SLC focuses the necessary attention on many of it's inner blocks, their size will not be a liablility, but become one of Downtown Salt Lake City's biggest assets. In a few of our blocks downtown that remain as of yet untouched, except by blacktop, I would like to see us implement many of the tried and true elements practiced in cities like Paris and Rome, where the inner block becomes a jaw- dropping plaza and another world unto itself. Our blocks can accomodate the intimate squares or even the grand Plazas like Piazza Navona, pictured below. For my tastes, I would like to see some appropriate 19th century architecture, which has been lost to the wrecking ball. Also, statuary and fountains using our own incredible folklore of Native Americans, wildlife, trappers, explorers, etc.



Piazza Navona, Rome

[urbanboy]

County, group could conserve swath of Emigration Canyon
By Jeremiah Stettler
The Salt Lake Tribune
Article Last Updated: 09/09/2008 01:16:46 AM MDT



Salt Lake County could stake claim to more than 240 acres of Emigration Canyon's rugged evergreen forests, high-mountain meadows and redrock benches.
Before development creeps any farther up the canyon, the Salt Lake County Council will consider today spending $1.5 million to preserve the patch of east-side wilderness in an area known as Killyon's Canyon.
The Utah Open Lands coalition has offered to raise through private donations the rest of the estimated $3.7 million cost - perhaps with the help of a voluntary price reduction by the seller.
"From an open-space perspective, there is no question that this property has tremendous conservation value," said Wendy Fisher, executive director of Utah Open Lands.
The property includes hiking trails, a creek filled with Bonneville cutthroat trout, access to U.S. Forest Service land and a mixed terrain of rolling hills, Douglas Fir forests and open meadows.
It's also on the edge of urban development. Two developers already have expressed interest in the property, which appraisers say could accommodate up to 29 homes.
Even so, the sellers seem interested in preserving the property as wilderness, according to the county's open-space coordinator Lorna Vogt.
"They aren't trying to get top dollar," she said. "They are trying to work with us."
Democratic
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County Councilman Jim Bradley described Killyon's Canyon on Monday as a "marvelous" expanse that the county should consider protecting.
That contrasts with his recent opposition to the Little Willow Canyon deal in the foothills above Sandy and Draper. The county spent about the same amount of money - $1.6 million - but got just 10 acres of land.
Advocates defended the purchase, saying it would provide a critical access point to the Bonneville Shoreline Trail and augment 40 additional acres of open land at the nearby Hidden Valley Park.
Bradley found the Killyon's Canyon proposal more enticing.
"This has the feel of something much more appropriate, something more in the public interest," he said. "It's not just paying off a developer."
Question is, will the rest of the nine-member council agree? If so, Utah Open Lands will begin an aggressive private-donation campaign to raise the rest of the cash.
[email protected]

[NYC Rick]

Originally Posted by Stenar

I agree... mostly. I think there should be height restrictions, but I think the corridor on South Temple from Main St. to 400 W (Gateway) should be developed with hi-rise offices as well.

400 South between Main and 9th East should be developed with bldgs 4-6 stories that front the sidewalk, no setbacks for tacky parking lots. Actually, I think I read that was in the newish master plan... that's where I got the idea.

The Thing that everything revolves back to is the need for hi-rise offices to happen before all of the boring and blase construrction takes over that area.

All of your design ideas are great but there really has to be a need. SLC is growing and it is impressively pursuing a new philosophy of vitality however
What you are talking about at the Gateway area and the 4th south between Main and 9th East takes a lot more than the concept. That area has to be in demand...not "it should be in demand".

I agree that both are natural areas to foster a powerful and intimate extension of the DT.

DT SLC has the real hold back of the street size ie. oxen and wagon turning area. That will never go away and no matter how you look at, it will never be intimate. They could help by utilizing Regent St, Social Hall and the Exchange place (?) areas to build up. They could also build on the centers of the block. Those areas surrounded by already constructed buildings to foster intimacy.

Salt Lake's downtown is not laid out like any downtown I know of. You could build up any of the streets and it would look over spaced.

Living in NYC and having lived in some European cities, you never notice space, you notice intimacy of structures and their interaction.

In SLC, you get that vibe on maybe 2 blocks (and only one street of those two blocks). South Temple between Main and State plus soon to be up to West Temple and between Second and Third South and Main. Still if you walk one block East or West of these specific areas, you then lose all of the connected intimacy of what a down town really is.

To me, in the Gateway area, you feel the intimacy but it will take maybe 3 blocks wide and 5 blocks long of real development to give a feeling of flow with the Central downtown core. On the DT to 9th East and 4th South corridor that you are talking about will take A LOT of construction with purpose to make a cohesive link. You are not talking about years, you are talking about decades...multiple decades. Unless, SLC becomes some sort of capitol of the new oil potential or anything of that magnitude, those of you who are 20-30 on here will be really old when it does happen. Everyone over 30 will probably be dead. Cryptic isn't it!

[delts145]

Few of us disagree with the types of changes that must continue to take shape downtown. However, many of us including myself, would disagree very strongly, (but good naturedly of course) that it will take decades. Rick, I would assume that you mean around six or seven decades, since given todays longevity for most of us, anyone over 30 today, would be then approaching deaths door... LOL

Given how many blocks downtown have been completely transformed over the past 8 to 10 years from brownfields and asphault to vibrant mixed-use centers, world class plaza's, grand scale and botique hotels, librarys, concert halls, conference centers, convention facilities, and on and on. Not to mention one of the most agressive national building programs of mass-transit systems of any downtown in the country. ..... And then there's CCC...

I know for a fact that there is a line around the block,(and I mean a big SLC block) of developers, both national, international and local, who are only waiting for the economy to rebound, before pouncing on downtown SLC, with major projects.

Barring a national, economic Armageddon, and considering what has already taken place in the past few years, and what is predicted for Salt Lake Metro and it's downtown, "I'll place my bet on two decades, but certainly not five, six, or seven"

[NYC Rick]

Originally Posted by delts145

Few of us disagree with the types of changes that must continue to take shape downtown. However, many of us including myself, would disagree very strongly, (but good naturedly of course) that it will take decades. Rick, I would assume that you mean around six or seven decades, since given todays longevity for most of us, anyone over 30 today, would be then approaching deaths door... LOL

Given how many blocks downtown have been completely transformed over the past 8 to 10 years from brownfields and asphault to vibrant mixed-use centers, world class plaza's, grand scale and botique hotels, librarys, concert halls, conference centers, convention facilities, and on and on. Not to mention one of the most agressive national building programs of mass-transit systems of any downtown in the country. ..... And then there's CCC...

I know for a fact that there is a line around the block,(and I mean a big SLC block) of developers, both national, international and local, who are only waiting for the economy to rebound, before pouncing on downtown SLC, with major projects.

Barring a national, economic Armageddon, and considering what has already taken place in the past few years, and what is predicted for Salt Lake Metro and it's downtown, "I'll place my bet on two decades, but certainly not five, six, or seven"

Fair enough! You are the one that is there and I am only there sometimes.

Funny, Going back maybe 1,2 or 3 times a year, every change is obvious to me as they are always new and not stale.

I do notice how really great an asset that Gateway is. HUGE potential to kick things in gear.

I also know how great the potential of growing East is.

Yet, to cohesively integrate what would then be a pretty large area into an interactive area with a downtown emphasis would seem like a miricle in 2 decades.

However, I am always amazed at how much SLC has changed since the 90's. You may be right!

[Elworth]

I was at a meeting on campus today for a group called TopJobs and they were mentioning how Goldman Sachs was locating its operations group here. Apparently they already have over 500 employees in SLc up here at Research Park by the University. I can't remember if one of the officers or if the student advisor said it, but one of them mentioned that Goldman Sachs could potentially make its office in SLC the 3rd largest behind NYC and London.

They have established, or in the process of establishing an industrial bank here, and I don't know if you guys are aware, but Utah is the premier location for an industrial bank to be located. However, industrial banks are much more focused and don't require the large workforce that commercial banks do.

I just thought this was interesting given their new tower in NYC or NJ or wherever it is.

[Elworth]

I just talked to my instructor and he mentioned that this project is dead. Also, I get to take a tour of 222 S. Main on November 4th. Score for me.

[RFPCME]

Originally Posted by delts145

Very much agree Future Mayor!! Infact, IMO, if SLC focuses the necessary attention on many of it's inner blocks, their size will not be a liablility, but become one of Downtown Salt Lake City's biggest assets. In a few of our blocks downtown that remain as of yet untouched, except by blacktop, I would like to see us implement many of the tried and true elements practiced in cities like Paris and Rome, where the inner block becomes a jaw- dropping plaza and another world unto itself. Our blocks can accomodate the intimate squares or even the grand Plazas like Piazza Navona, pictured below. For my tastes, I would like to see some appropriate 19th century architecture, which has been lost to the wrecking ball. Also, statuary and fountains using our own incredible folklore of Native Americans, wildlife, trappers, explorers, etc.



Piazza Navona, Rome

Delts: Thanks for the picture of the Piazza Navona. It brings back very pleasant memories. I spent the summer and fall of '96 living in a hotel (the Santa Chiara--St. Claire) about 50 meters east of the Piazza Navona. Nothing like a summer's evening, beginning at about 10:00p.m. just loitering in the Piazza. If SLC ever came close to that kind of atmosphere (minus the German tourists) at night, it will have arrived!

[TANGELD_SLC]

Ok, hypothetically speaking, let's say you take a WHOLE city block, raze anything that's on it, and build a beautiful plaza reminescent of Piazza Navona, with the intricate fountains and true Classical architcture. I want to know how much you think it would cost, and what you would put in it.

[delts145]

Salt Lake City ranked No. 3 in nation for job growth

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/1,5143,700257608,00.html

http://bestcities.milkeninstitute.org/bestcities2008.taf?rankyear=2008&type=rank200

Utah's strong job creation has helped keep the state out of some of the economic doldrums facing the nation, according to a report released today.
The report from the Milken Institute ranks Provo-Orem first in job growth among the country's large metro areas. Salt Lake City was third, and Ogden-Clearfield was 18th. Among small metros, St. George was fourth.

Related: Urban Utah's economy hot - State dominates an index of cities' performance

http://www.sltrib.com/business/ci_10423126

Among the nation's 200 largest metros, these are the top 10 performers of 2008 (with their 2007 rankings in parentheses):

1. Provo-Orem, Utah (8)
2. Raleigh-Cary, North Carolina (10)
3. Salt Lake City, Utah (18)
4. Austin-Round Rock, Texas (20)
5. Huntsville, Alabama (16)
6. Wilmington, North Carolina (2)
7. McAllen-Edinburg-Mission, Texas (7)
8. Tacoma, Washington (50)
9. Olympia, Washington (37 in the 2007 ranking of small metros)
10. Charleston-North Charleston, South Carolina (12)

18. Ogden-Clearfield (42)
20. Greeley (29)
27. Boise-Nampa (19)
32. Phoenix-Mesa-Scottsdale (4)
44. Denver-Aurora (106)
55. Tucson (15)
75. Las Vegas-Paradise (9)
95. Boulder (93)
111. Colorado Springs (96)


.

[delts145]

Salt Lake crafting ordinance to reward 'good' landlords

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/1,5143,700257666,00.html

Rental-property owners in Salt Lake City soon may find it profitable to be "good landlords."

Officials are crafting an ordinance that will reward landlords for partnering with the city to improve the quality of life in Salt Lake neighborhoods.

.

[delts145]

Originally Posted by urbanboy

County, group could conserve swath of Emigration Canyon
By Jeremiah Stettler
The Salt Lake Tribune
Article Last Updated: 09/09/2008 01:16:46 AM MDT

http://www.sltrib.com/ci_10415917?IADID=Search-www.sltrib.com-www.sltrib.com

Salt Lake County could buy Emigration Canyon parcel -- if price is right

The Salt Lake County Council voted unanimously Tuesday to pursue the purchase further, starting with a review of the high-mountain property's $3.7 million price tag.

http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_10426590

.

[NYC Rick]

1. Provo-Orem, Utah (8)
2. Raleigh-Cary, North Carolina (10)
3. Salt Lake City, Utah (18)
4. Austin-Round Rock, Texas (20)
5. Huntsville, Alabama (16)
6. Wilmington, North Carolina (2)
7. McAllen-Edinburg-Mission, Texas (7)
8. Tacoma, Washington (50)
9. Olympia, Washington (37 in the 2007 ranking of small metros)
10. Charleston-North Charleston, South Carolina (12)

Yes, it is nice SLC is there and it is admirable. However, this list really omits the larger areas where cities may not compete percentage wise but the relative populace makes it much easier for smaller cites.

I would imagine that in these kinds of lists, the largest urban areas never score well.

Yet, it is admirable that a city and area the size of SLC could be ranked with some of much smaller areas and that is the point.

[urbanboy]

Yes, so what these statistics show is the likelihood one is able to get a job. Although there may be more available jobs in larger cities there are also more people that one must compete with in order to get the job. These types of statistics will bring more growth to the region because of the amount of jobs available per capita.

[RFPCME]

Delts: The data from the Milken Institute is impressive. But the name "Milken" struck a chord with me, so I had to research who this group is--there seemed to be almost a pattern with the rankings, heavily in the Southeast and Texas, with the amazing performance by Utah cities.

As you may know, the Milken Institute was established by Michael Milken, the king of leveraged buyouts, greenmail, and junkbonds, which are all okay, I guess, but this guy served two years in the Federal slammer for some very sleezey deals. Rudy Guiliani put him away.

Also, the Managing Director of Greenstreet Partners, the sponsor of the survey, had a company he ran go bust because of dealings with Milken in the 80's. I sense the possibility of a scam here, or maybe I'm just being too cynical.