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  #641  
Old Posted Oct 1, 2006, 4:19 AM
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I checked this place out tonight too, and spent $390 less than fflint (hee). Would have been $400 less if I didn't pick up dinner at Bristol Farms.

Speaking of which, I think Bristol Farms, while not a "supermarket", got it exactly right. Nobody is going to do serious grocery shopping in a mall, but plenty of people will grab a pizza or prepared entree before jumping on BART. So what I saw, a small "grocery" section and a much larger deli section (reminiscent of the Whole Foods in NYC's Time Warner Center, if anyone's been there), made perfect sense. The only thing I wonder about is how they seem to allow you to pick up stuff in one section and check out in the other. How would they prevent shoplifting?

One interesting thing about opening weekend...lots of DJs and electronica/house being played in the open spaces. I guess they really want us to remind us this isn't just a typical Westfield mall transplanted to the Big City.

As for the rest, fflint summed it up well. I'm sure the hottie fashionista chicks will be a regular fixture at this place, considering the stores represented here. I agree that not only the immediate vicinity of the center but the surrounding streets seemed to have a vitality I've usually only seen during the holiday season. So, even though people love to bash malls, I say long live the new SF Centre (for now, anyway)

Edited to add:

1) The new wing of the center seemed reasonably integrated with the old. I thought the two halves would seem really out of sync but didn't find that to be the case.

2) To see lots more reviews of the new SFC, check out Yelp. Damn, is everyone and their dog in SF using that site?

Last edited by rs913; Oct 1, 2006 at 4:43 AM.
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  #642  
Old Posted Oct 1, 2006, 4:27 AM
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great summary fflint.

I actually got back from there again-this time I went by car with some out-of-towners....not fun AT ALL. Traffic at the Toll plaza was terrible, Parking is horrendous, navigating thru the streets with the throngs of people even at 8pm was just very stressful. Note to self, no more driving to Union Square on Saturday evening.....you'd think I would have known that by now.
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  #643  
Old Posted Oct 1, 2006, 4:31 AM
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looks like we SSP forumers are doing their fair share to help consumer spending. LOL
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  #644  
Old Posted Oct 1, 2006, 4:33 AM
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rs913,
I too noticed the hottie fashionistas all over the place. I knew we had them, guess it took this to bring 'em out....was today stiletto-day at the mall or what?
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  #645  
Old Posted Oct 1, 2006, 4:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rs913
I'm sure the hottie fashionista chicks will be a regular fixture at this place, considering the stores represented here.
It being San Francisco, I saw at least as many "hottie fashionista" twinkie dudes carrying clutches of Bloomie bags in both hands.
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  #646  
Old Posted Oct 1, 2006, 4:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dimondpark
great summary fflint.

I actually got back from there again-this time I went by car with some out-of-towners....not fun AT ALL. Traffic at the Toll plaza was terrible, Parking is horrendous, navigating thru the streets with the throngs of people even at 8pm was just very stressful. Note to self, no more driving to Union Square on Saturday evening.....you'd think I would have known that by now.
BART
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  #647  
Old Posted Oct 1, 2006, 4:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dimondpark
rs913,
I too noticed the hottie fashionistas all over the place. I knew we had them, guess it took this to bring 'em out....was today stiletto-day at the mall or what?
I think this place takes the cake for most hotties per square foot, taking the title from fellow Westfielder, Valley Fair. My neck is still sore from Thursday evening. It was nighttime and all, so I couldn't sport my stunnas to hide my wandering eyes.
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  #648  
Old Posted Oct 1, 2006, 5:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dimondpark
great summary fflint.

I actually got back from there again-this time I went by car with some out-of-towners....not fun AT ALL. Traffic at the Toll plaza was terrible, Parking is horrendous, navigating thru the streets with the throngs of people even at 8pm was just very stressful. Note to self, no more driving to Union Square on Saturday evening.....you'd think I would have known that by now.
You Sac folk must be gluttons for punishment When I was waiting in line on Wednesday morning for the preview event I overheard the young group in front of me complaining about the traffic on the bridge at 7am, who woulda thunk it huh?
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  #649  
Old Posted Oct 1, 2006, 5:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EastBayHardCore
You Sac folk must be gluttons for punishment
Well, duh... they live in Sacramento.
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  #650  
Old Posted Oct 1, 2006, 3:21 PM
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excuse yall,
I guarantee you a chunk of all that hotness parading up and down Union Square(both male and female) was from Sactown

But Im now in Oakland-its just that my dad's sister was in from Houston and the silly hefer didnt want to take BART cause her ankles arent used to walking that much-hence another source of aggrevation I had last evening

Quote:
Originally Posted by BTinSF
It being San Francisco, I saw at least as many "hottie fashionista" twinkie dudes carrying clutches of Bloomie bags in both hands
For some reason on friday I felt like dressing up...dunno why?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BTinSF
Yeah, I never thought of myself as a metrosexual before but I just had to have a crockery pumpkin aromatherapy thingy from Bath and Body Works (a guy's gotta have some kind of Halloween decorations) and that required me to buy a couple jars of salt body scrub which is not a product I normally use: scrub + candle = $82. Adding in a felafel sandwich (not near as good as Gyro King's--Grove across from the library) and soda downstairs for lunch and they nailed me for near a C-note.
Its funny how a hundred dollars feels more like a 20 nowadays.
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  #651  
Old Posted Oct 1, 2006, 3:29 PM
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Quote:
But, where is the largest urban mall located? NYC or Chicago. Hello Google.
The official "largest urban mall" is apparently this Carousel mall in Syracuse mentioned upthread, but from looking at the Google satellite image, it doesn't look like an "urban mall" at all...more like a regular suburban parking-lot mall that happens to be really close to downtown, hence the classification.

The SFC's closest equivalents (in terms of store mix and overall feel) seem to be the four urban malls on Michigan Ave. in Chicago, but only Water Tower Place approaches it in size.

Quote:
I too noticed the hottie fashionistas all over the place. I knew we had them, guess it took this to bring 'em out....
Well, there were all those signs all over the place ordering that they "unite" with "foodies", or something like that...

Last edited by rs913; Oct 1, 2006 at 5:19 PM.
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  #652  
Old Posted Oct 1, 2006, 3:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J_Taylor
Ever been to mall of the americas or somthing like that in Minnesota?
Its got a roller coaster inside of it..
Yeah, but Mall of the Americas is not an urban mall. It's in a suburb of Minneapolis (Bloomington). So, no matter how many attractions are in said, it's a suburban mall. But, where is the largest urban mall located? NYC or Chicago. Hello Google.
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  #653  
Old Posted Oct 2, 2006, 5:43 PM
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Big retailers take quietly to Union Square

Retail a-go-go:

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Big retailers take quietly to Union Square
San Francisco Business Times - September 29, 2006
by Sarah Duxbury

All year, all eyes have been on Westfield as it furiously signed leases with 110 new tenants prior to its opening this week.

But while Westfield grabbed headlines and attention in recent months, several significant deals were quietly executed on and around Union Square.

Barneys is the biggest name, and the biggest lease, taking over the 60,000-square-foot building that once housed FAO Schwarz.

Brokers have already seen a Barneys effect. Julie Taylor of brokerage Cornish & Carey said interest has increased in 26 O'Farrell St., 3,000 square feet sandwiched between Macy's backside and Armani.

Other retailers are also changing the look of the area, hot on the heels of European retailers H&M and Zara, which have been very successful here.

Spanish fast-fashion retailer Mango signed on more than 7,000 square feet at 117 Post St., the former Rizolli Books site, for $725,000. They are paying $320 per square foot for a 2,265 square foot ground floor with additional retail areas on the second and basement levels.

Mango opened one of its first U.S. stores in Westfield San Francisco Centre this week. By launching its U.S. invasion from a west coast beachhead, Mango bucked the trend set by Euro-rivals Zara and H&M which first set up shop in New York. Mango has stores open in Costa Mesa, Bellevue, Wash., and now San Francisco. Its second store here, on Post Street, will probably open in 2007, and five others are scheduled to open soon around the country, primarily in the west. Mango has yet to secure a New York location.

"A lot of newer, fashion-forward brands" are coming to Union Square, said Vikki Johnson of brokerage Johnson Hoke. "It's great. We definitely needed a kick in the pants."

Quiksilver, Steven by Steve Madden and American Apparel are some of the arrivals soon to land on Union Square.

That doesn't mean that Union Square is turning from its well-heeled past. Cartier will move across the street into the former Brookstone location at 250 Post for $850,000, or $249 per square foot for the 3,411-square-foot ground floor, with additional retail floors. One of Cartier's other luxury brands is likely to take over the old lease.

Then there's 185 Post, now under construction and poised to become a signature, multitenant property.

Other big spaces could also come into play in the next couple of years. The family that owns 301 Geary St., a prime Union Square corner and former home of Casual Corner, is said to be preparing marketing materials for the space, which has a 5,000-square-foot ground floor, an 8,000?square-foot lower level and a mezzanine.

Nearby, 800 Market St., an 8-story, 49,000-square-foot building recently sold to Blatteis & Schnur, a Los Angeles brokerage, for $22.76 million. They plan to invest $18 million to renovate and reposition the lower level retail, which could come online in 18 months.

Sarah Duxbury covers retail for the San Francisco Business Times.

Source: http://www.bizjournals.com/sanfranci...ml?t=printable
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  #654  
Old Posted Oct 2, 2006, 5:50 PM
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Big retailers take quietly to Union Square

Accidental duplicate post--sorry.

Last edited by BTinSF; Oct 2, 2006 at 6:06 PM.
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  #655  
Old Posted Oct 2, 2006, 9:19 PM
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I really hope the new owners give 800 Market a facelift while they're adding the ground-floor retail component. The plain, weathered concrete facade has looked horrible for 15 years running.

Edit: I found an old photo of the building. I never realized the building was old and had only been remuddled to look like mid-century schlock!

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  #656  
Old Posted Oct 5, 2006, 3:41 AM
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Other big spaces could also come into play in the next couple of years. The family that owns 301 Geary St., a prime Union Square corner and former home of Casual Corner, is said to be preparing marketing materials for the space, which has a 5,000-square-foot ground floor, an 8,000?square-foot lower level and a mezzanine.

Has Casual Corner actually closed? I sure hope so.

One glaring retail omission from the Union Square shopping district? Pottery Barn! And, I wouldn't mind a West Elm too!
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  #657  
Old Posted Oct 5, 2006, 6:34 AM
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Yes, what used to be Casual Corner is now an art gallery.
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  #658  
Old Posted Oct 5, 2006, 7:38 AM
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Can the Westfield Centre Thrive

It's always fun to know what they think about us on the other coast. As usual, the New York spin seems fairly positive. The Wall Street Journal on Westfield SF Centre:

Quote:
Property Report

A Mall Grows in San Francisco
With 170 Stores on Nine Floors, Can the Westfield Centre Thrive As Department Stores Decline?
By RYAN CHITTUM and VAUHINI VARA

October 4, 2006; Page B1

Judging from its first week, one of the nation's largest urban malls, the Westfield San Francisco Centre, is poised to shake up the city's retail landscape. Shoppers waited in a line that stretched around the block at Market and Fifth streets to preview the 338,000-square-foot Bloomingdale's, second in size only to the flagship Bloomingdale's store on Manhattan's East 59th Street.

The 1980s rap star Biz Markie spun records, a fashion show featured outfits by up-and-coming Bay Area designers and the cinema showed "The Maltese Falcon" and other classic San Francisco movies. Diners jammed seven full-service restaurants and a food court that features 15 "casual gourmet eateries" featuring dinner plates, silverware and table service.

"It's kind of like Vegas," a 36-year-old lawyer, Allison Wang, commented to her husband, Tim Wang, as they stood near the historic domed rotunda incorporated into the design of the nine-story mall.

But can the Westfield San Francisco Centre thrive over the long term, on the edge of the city's tourism and retailing hotbeds and in an era when fewer Americans shop in department stores? The question nagged at a mall restaurateur, even as he reveled in the crowds. "San Franciscans don't like malls," said Chris Yeo, the chef at Straits Restaurant, a Singaporean restaurant on the mall's fourth floor. "When the hype is over, who will come here?"

Urban malls have had a spotty history in the U.S. New York's Time Warner Center and Chicago's Water Tower Place -- both smaller than the Westfield San Francisco -- have done well, but others have sputtered, most notably the Manhattan Mall in New York's Herald Square and the Hollywood & Highland Center in Los Angeles, which hosts the Academy Awards in its Kodak Theatre.

More broadly, enclosed malls are battling, and sometimes morphing into, open-air "lifestyle centers," where shoppers can park near storefronts. Mall-based department stores continue to lose ground to discounters. Even as overall U.S. retail sales rose some 24% over the past six years to $2.2 trillion, department-store sales declined nearly 14% over the same period to $86.7 billion last year, according to the National Retail Federation, a Washington trade group. The trend is likely to continue. Department-store spending in the U.S. is forecast to drop by 5.5% by 2010, according to the research firm Euromonitor International.

An element critical to an urban malls' success, experts say, is drawing shoppers up to higher floors, says Paco Underhill, author of "Call of the Mall" and chief executive of Enivrosell Inc., a New York retail consulting agency. At Chicago's eight-floor Water Tower Place, the top floor is connected to a Ritz-Carlton hotel.

Spiral escalators in the Westfield San Francisco Centre show off all angles of the mall. "It's almost like a Ferris wheel ride," says Mr. Underhill. "There's excitement and joy, whereas if you're going up a dark escalator at Manhattan Mall, where you don't know where you're going to end up, that's a lot tougher." Manhattan Mall, which opened in 1989, converted several of its upper floors to office space in 2002.

Cultural attitudes also may make a difference. "San Franciscans embrace the urban, European lifestyle with street retail," says Bill Huelsman, senior vice president for West Coast retail at Jones Lang LaSalle Inc., a Chicago-based commercial real-estate services firm. "L.A. is very much an automobile culture." Westfield San Francisco Centre has subway lines located at the basement level.

An urban mall, if successful, reverberates in the surrounding area. Manhattan's Time Warner Center transformed the downtrodden Columbus Circle area by bringing in a high-traffic, mixed-used project, including the 300,000-square-foot shopping mall at its base. "It has rejuvenated the entire Broadway corridor," says Robert Cohen, executive vice president at Robert K. Futterman & Associates, a New York retail real-estate services firm.

Australia-based Westfield Group and Cleveland-based Forest City Enterprises, which jointly developed and own the $460 million Westfield San Francisco Centre, combined 755,000 square feet of new mall space anchored by Bloomingdale's with 500,000 square feet of existing mall space, anchored by Nordstrom. The development also includes 245,000 square feet of office space above the mall, with tenants including San Francisco State University.

To mark the site's history, the mall incorporates a 250-ton dome and a Beaux Arts facade that were part of the Emporium, a San Francisco department store for 100 years until it closed a decade ago.

The Westfield San Francisco Centre developers are banking on the pull of a critical mass of anchor stores, both within the mall and nearby. Nordstrom Inc. responded to the arrival of Bloomingdale's next door by renovating its 350,000-square-foot store. A Neiman Marcus and a Saks Fifth Avenue are just a few blocks away. Barneys New York, a unit of Jones Apparel Group, is planning to open a 60,000-square-foot store near Union Square next year.

Bloomingdale's, with its array of posh brands including Marc Jacobs and Louis Vuitton, is "trying to separate ourselves from what we define as department stores," says Michael Gould, chief executive of Bloomingdale's, a unit of Federated Department Stores Inc. "We see ourselves playing the specialty-store market. Each floor feels like a store unto itself."

Peter Lowy, Westfield Group's chief executive, says the mall's other retailers -- 170 in all -- also will draw shoppers. "There was big retail demand that was unmet in the marketplace, because you couldn't get space in Union Square and in the old San Francisco Centre," Mr. Lowy says. Half of the stores in the mall are new to San Francisco, he adds.

The new Westfield Centre will draw shoppers from all over the Bay Area, predicts Kazuko Morgan, a senior director for retail at Cushman & Wakefield. "This is really something you'd see in Asia, where they spend a fortune on their malls," she says. Renée Safir, a 14-year-old private-school student wearing Abercrombie & Fitch jeans, worried that the new mall will ruin San Francisco's "hippie" vibe.

Just two blocks from Union Square, the neighborhood immediately surrounding the new mall still has rough spots. A former shopping hub, it declined in the 1950s as San Franciscans began moving to the suburbs or traveling there to shop. The Market Street area "just became shabby," says Susan Goldstein, city archivist for San Francisco. Legitimate movie houses turned into porn theaters, the homeless population grew and many residents avoided going south of Market Street. The Emporium changed hands several times and finally closed in 1996.

The neighborhood has been slowly gentrifying, though. Retailers including Gap Inc. and Urban Outfitters Inc.'s Anthropologie have cropped up amid the dollar stores and discount retailers. The San Francisco Historical Society plans to open a museum in the old mint building nearby. Well-off residents are drawn to pricey high-rises overlooking the San Francisco Bay. "That part of Market Street is undergoing a rebirth," Ms. Goldstein says.



--Vanessa O'Connell contributed to this article.

Write to Ryan Chittum at [email protected]1 and Vauhini Vara at [email protected]2

URL for this article:
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB115992610205082027.html
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  #659  
Old Posted Oct 5, 2006, 7:49 AM
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Quote:
Renée Safir, a 14-year-old private-school student wearing Abercrombie & Fitch jeans, worried that the new mall will ruin San Francisco's "hippie" vibe.
By far the best quote in the article.
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  #660  
Old Posted Oct 5, 2006, 8:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sf_eddo
By far the best quote in the article.
Yes, I detected their tongue in cheek on that one too.
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