Chinatown Updates Discussion

[Changing City]

Originally Posted by GenWhy?

Capped at 8 stories instead of about 12 or so I guess. Will be tough for concrete builds on such small lots for any kind of affordability that the area calls for.

I think 'Sparrow' on Keefer is already designed to meet the new guidelines. 'Framework' on East Pender was 8 storeys; they were allowed 7 floors of residential; I think they would have to put commercial on the second floor under the new guidelines, and I think they might be just over the proposed FSR limit.

[Metro-One]

Originally Posted by jlousa

sigh... so the city of Vancouver is taking the one plan that they actually got right and is taking the axe to it and making it much worse. Some lowlights from the proposed changes.

Eliminate the sites of 120-150ft height and impose a 90ft limit.
Eliminate the uncapped FSR and cap it at 4.8 to 5.35.

There are a bunch of other changes, pretty sober reading and so sad to see a council cave in to protests. The election and certain changing of city staff can't come soon enough.

http://council.vancouver.ca/20180515/documents/p8.pdf

Now that Hector Brennan wasn’t shortlisted for the NPA, aren’t both parties somewhat positioning themselves to anti-development? (at least in regards to what many want to see on this forum, such as relaxed height restrictions downtown and more up zoning in single family home areas)

[GenWhy?]

Originally Posted by Changing City

I think 'Sparrow' on Keefer is already designed to meet the new guidelines. 'Framework' on East Pender was 8 storeys; they were allowed 7 floors of residential; I think they would have to put commercial on the second floor under the new guidelines, and I think they might be just over the proposed FSR limit.

Just the affordability issue folks talk about in relation to the area, and even in relation to the projects you mentioned. Can't remember the cost of Sparrow, but I know car lifts are not cheap. Framework I think was around 600k for a "1 bed".

[Changing City]

Originally Posted by GenWhy?

Just the affordability issue folks talk about in relation to the area, and even in relation to the projects you mentioned. Can't remember the cost of Sparrow, but I know car lifts are not cheap. Framework I think was around 600k for a "1 bed".

There's a 1-bed for sale at $598,000 and a 2-bed at $699,000, so the original sale prices were probably a bit lower. I'm not sure what difference having a slightly higher FSR, or an extra floor would make to the price? The market price is the market price. If unit buyers are willing to pay $1,000 per square foot, isn't that what developers will charge? Obviously that can be different in affordable ownership buildings, but these are proposed as market condos, so they'll be sold at whatever the developer can achieve, presumably based on what resales of equivalent recent developments are selling for. Units on a theoretical ninth floor would be expected to achieve an even higher price, if they have views, but I don't see that they would make the units on lower floors any cheaper.

[Feathered Friend]

PROPOSED CHANGES TO THE CHINATOWN DEVELOPMENT POLICIES MEETING/ 華埠發展政策信息會議
by DTES Planning Team - City of Vancouver

Free
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Event Information
DESCRIPTION
Since 2015, the City of Vancouver has been working on an update to the Chinatown Development Policies to better protect Chinatown’s unique character and manage development. Over the past three years we gathered the community’s feedback about their concerns and ideas for new development in Chinatown, especially the character and impacts of new buildings allowed under development policies adopted in 2011.

自2015年起,溫哥華市政府已著手修改華埠發展政策，以至更加保護華埠的獨特風貌，調節發展的趨向。在過去三年，市府收集了社區對華埠新發展的意見，大家提出各樣的擔憂及想法，特別是關於2011年市議會通過的發展政策下，所容許新建築物的外觀及影響。

We are proposing changes to the development policies based on extensive public feedback. These changes are in a report which will be presented to Council on June 5, 2018. You can read the report here. (http://council.vancouver.ca/20180515/documents/p8.pdf)

聽完公眾意見後,我們已經修改了發展政策。我們將連同政策修改的建議，於6月5日呈交市議會。您可以在這裡閱讀報告。(http://council.vancouver.ca/20180515/documents/p8.pdf)

At this information session, we will share information about these changes. There will also be opportunities for you to ask questions. Cantonese translation will be provided.

我們將會與公眾分享修改的華埠發展政策。您也可以向我們提問。本次會議將提供粵語翻譯。

https://www.eventbrite.ca/e/proposed...ts-46233882788

[officedweller]

From Changing City Updates:

129 Keefer Street

The former James Schouw project has been redesigned with a more modern aesthetic, but still consistent with Chinatown's balconies:

Current design:


https://changingcitybook.com/2018/05...keefer-street/

Previous design:

Originally Posted by Changing City

There's an open house soon for another Keefer Street project. It's not a rezoning, so it's all condos on a 50' lot next to 105 Keefer. More details at https://changingcitybook.com/2017/02...keefer-street/. (The illustration is from there, showing the DE render).

[jlousa]

Liked the previous design so much more then the current one.

[officedweller]

Reminds me a bit of 1050 Alberni:


https://www.yelp.com.mx/biz/canadian-college-vancouver

[SpongeG]

City of Vancouver considers banning new towers in Chinatown

New buildings taller than 90 feet — about 8 storeys — would not be allowed under proposed zoning amendments

Justin McElroy · CBC News · Posted: Jun 05, 2018

The newest debate in Vancouver's never-ending affordability crisis isn't whether to approve a tower but to ban them in a neighbourhood altogether.

City council voted to put amendments to rezoning policies in the southern half of Chinatown to a public hearing.

The new rules would cap any future building at 90 feet (27 metres) in height, and will be voted on by council after the hearing, which is yet to be scheduled.

It was just 2011 when council passed a rezoning policy allowing new towers over 90 feet "when public benefits are offered."

But heated protests by many in the Chinatown community, most notably around a new condo at 105 Keefer Pl., since rejected, has caused staff to reconsider what can be built in the area south of Pender Street.

...

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/britis...ring-1.4691523

[VancouverOfTheFuture]

Originally Posted by SpongeG

City of Vancouver considers banning new towers in Chinatown

New buildings taller than 90 feet — about 8 storeys — would not be allowed under proposed zoning amendments

Justin McElroy · CBC News · Posted: Jun 05, 2018

The newest debate in Vancouver's never-ending affordability crisis isn't whether to approve a tower but to ban them in a neighbourhood altogether.

City council voted to put amendments to rezoning policies in the southern half of Chinatown to a public hearing.

The new rules would cap any future building at 90 feet (27 metres) in height, and will be voted on by council after the hearing, which is yet to be scheduled.

It was just 2011 when council passed a rezoning policy allowing new towers over 90 feet "when public benefits are offered."

But heated protests by many in the Chinatown community, most notably around a new condo at 105 Keefer Pl., since rejected, has caused staff to reconsider what can be built in the area south of Pender Street.

...

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/britis...ring-1.4691523

uhhhh... what? sure, okay... that will solve the problems??? i guess???

[logan5]

You can still get close to 5 FSR with 8 stories, or at 90 feet you could get 9 stories. One retail level I suppose. But yeah, putting a height cap is not going to stop development, your just changing the building form. We were getting some decent looking buildings in Chinatown that replaced 80.s schlock.

This is all ridiculous. Forget the master plan and just rezone on a case by case basis (and the cycle of protesting continues...)

[osirisboy]

Was 105 keefer even that tall?

[csbvan]

I like the idea of skinny buildings. I think that the few skinnier buildings built in the neighbourhood recently have been great. The new buildings on Main St, not so much.

[Aroundtheworld]

I think it's a pretty ridiculous situation. Local activist groups complain about a lack of housing for seniors, but then complain that there is too much development i.e. development that would pay for housing those seniors. Look I get making sure development fits the character of the neighbourhood, but it sounds a lot like people trying to have their cake and eat it too.

[Migrant_Coconut]

Originally Posted by Aroundtheworld

I think it's a pretty ridiculous situation. Local activist groups complain about a lack of housing for seniors, but then complain that there is too much development i.e. development that would pay for housing those seniors. Look I get making sure development fits the character of the neighbourhood, but it sounds a lot like people trying to have their cake and eat it too.

Sounds like the situation in San Francisco. Even the activists should know how that turned out... right?

[WarrenC12]

NIMBYs don't care about the big picture. They just want to protect their own little fiefdoms. The Chinatown NIMBYs are just as bad as the Point Grey ones.

[jollyburger]

Nothing new but something about the office/parkade at 211 East Georgia:

When he bought Golden Crown Centre at 211 East Georgia Street in 2011, Steven Fast had high hopes.

Providence Health Care was planning a new high-tech home for St. Paul’s Hospital to the south, and the city was set to adopt new density and height provisions for the area. Better transit infrastructure and new residents created opportunities to redevelop a portion of the building’s parkade as office space and add a storey or two of residential.

https://biv.com/article/2018/08/down...luck-chinatown

[logan5]

The DTES plan is such a fiasco. The plan itself is fine, but the execution has been a disaster and once again makes me question the competency of City Council.

It's not just Chinatown, but the Hastings corridor as well. It has been left to rot. Who in their right mind would develop there when you see bums and garbage rooted in front of completed developments. Absolutely no hope of retail tenants moving in, and almost no room on the sidewalk for tenants to walk down the street.

This area has the potential to rival any neighbourhood in Canada, but it's being flushed down the toilet.

[GenWhy?]

Originally Posted by logan5

The DTES plan is such a fiasco. The plan itself is fine, but the execution has been a disaster and once again makes me question the competency of City Council.

It's not just Chinatown, but the Hastings corridor as well. It has been left to rot. Who in their right mind would develop there when you see bums and garbage rooted in front of completed developments. Absolutely no hope of retail tenants moving in, and almost no room on the sidewalk for tenants to walk down the street.

This area has the potential to rival any neighbourhood in Canada, but it's being flushed down the toilet.

The DTES plan causes homelessness and vacant storefronts? The DTES Plan calls for more social housing and a balance of development (we have 3 projects at the moment in the DTES and work/know of a few more undertaking process now). Both of ours are social housing with at-grade retail and we have partners. It's hard, yes, but do-able.

The Hastings Corridor is doing quite well up by Nanaimo and is on the cusp of great transformation at about Heatley. The Raymur Ave development is being leased and will really change that section too. Bit by bit. It takes time.

[Vin]

Originally Posted by logan5

The DTES plan is such a fiasco. The plan itself is fine, but the execution has been a disaster and once again makes me question the competency of City Council.

It's not just Chinatown, but the Hastings corridor as well. It has been left to rot. Who in their right mind would develop there when you see bums and garbage rooted in front of completed developments. Absolutely no hope of retail tenants moving in, and almost no room on the sidewalk for tenants to walk down the street.

This area has the potential to rival any neighbourhood in Canada, but it's being flushed down the toilet.

Chinatown is on the decline. Perhaps DTES will spread into Chinatown, officially.