Sacramento: 301 Capitol Mall: A New Plan for The Towers Site

[brandon12]

^also, the Intercontinental Hotel Group is one of the largest (if not the largest) hotel concern in the world. They probably have a pretty good track record of choosing locations that think will work for them.

I think more than anything, Saca is preaching doomsday scenario in order to position the case for the $11M subsidy and assure they get it. You don't get shit in subsidies if you don't tell the city you need it!!!

[creamcityleo79]

I swear to God you naysayers continue to baffle me with your ignorance! 3rd and Capitol is a deadzone after 5pm right now? What does that have to do with 2-3 years from now when The Towers and Aura get built? What about all the restaurants that are going to be built between now and then? You are one of those who dwells on the past and what has been rather than looking to the future for the hope of what IS to come!...and it's people like you who have kept Sacramento back for decades!

[Phillip]

Originally Posted by neuhickman79

3rd and Capitol is a deadzone after 5pm right now? What does that have to do with 2-3 years from now when The Towers and Aura get built? What about all the restaurants that are going to be built between now and then?

Where are these restaurants going to be built?

The blocks across from and adjacent to SacaTower and Aura are already built out with highrise offices, state and federal office buildings. I don't see available space along Capitol Mall for pedestrian oriented restaurants, coffeehouses, or boutiques.

Are you talking about new restaurants along K Street? I hope that happens and soon.

But how do you get from Saca Tower to K Street without walking past the Greyhound Depot, Berry Hotel, and Jade Liquor Store? Probably enter Downtown Plaza on L Street and exit on 7th and K by Hard Rock. How about after 9pm though, on the way home, when Downtown Plaza is closed?

We'd all like to see those shady places near 7th & L disappear, but I don't hear about that happening over the next two years. Sacramento hasn't even identified a location for a new bus depot yet, much less built it.

Meanwhile if Saca Tower gets built I picture its residents getting in their cars and driving to dinner on 16th Street or Broadway, just like they did when they lived in East Sac or Folsom, which sort of defeats the purpose of moving Downtown.

===================

I'd like to see Downtown/Midtown come more to life. I'd like to see luxury housing Downtown as part of the mix.

My primary objections to Saca Tower are #1) it's not in a vibrant or enticing area of downtown and #2) 900 units are too many for a new and untested market.

What I would have liked to see Saca or someone do was build a much smaller luxury project along 16th Street, around F, G, or H. Tear down one of the blighted motels and put it there. Maybe 200 units. It would have been a natural extension of what's already succeeding in Midtown---PF Changs, Mikuni's, Park Lounge etc, and within walking distance.

If a 200 unit luxury building near 16th Street sells there's room for lots more condos in that area. A 900 unit building should happen later after a few smaller projects have proven the market.

900 units at the start sucks all the pioneer money and pioneer energy into one monolithic project---take it or leave it. If Saca gets built and fails I fear nobody else will attempt luxury Downtown for a long time.

[Majin]

Originally Posted by neuhickman79

...and it's people like you who have kept Sacramento back for decades!

That kind of comment isnt fair.

Do you see me in bowties at every city council meeting trying to get every project taller than the captial canceled? Do you see me supporting the unions trying to block hospital expansions stopped for purely political reasons? Do you hear me on the radio spreading false statements/logic against passing a new tax for the arena? I could go on but I think you see my point.

Those kind of people are the REAL PEOPLE who kept Sacramento back for decades. I think you need to wake up a realize that in all reality me trolling on a random web forum is NOT the problem in Sacramento, its the kind of people I posted above.

I think I deserve an apology.

[bennywah]

^
I have to agree with majin a bit here, he's been pesimistic about projects happening, but not opposed to them, and as of late most of his comments have been about the progress thats been happening, though theres still that $1000 dollars, lol.

both aura and the towers will include retail, and restraunts in there respective buildings, hence creating more foot traffic within the immediate vinicty of the buildins, old sac isnt that far away from the towers and i could defintely see some more restraunts and nightlife going into that area.

nothing is going to happen overnight, but sometimes it takes a shock to the norm to help move along the process of getting things done and creating a more vibrant and ped friendly down town, not just certain parts, its been done elsewhere and it'll get done in sac, and innov8 any more pics of the various projects, i'm coming up on fri and cant wait to see the progress first hand.

[TowerDistrict]

Phillip, you can't put the burden of ressurecting downtown all on two towers. And walking to wherever your destination is not the only aspect to lively streets. I live off Broadway and drive into downtown and midtown all the time. The point is that's where i go to eat, drink, shop and relax - at all sorts of hours. You're also discounting other modes of transportation such as proposed streetcars, pedicabs, taxis. The towers is also 4 blocks from light rail, and Aura is one block away. Residents and hotel guests in the Towers will light up Old Town which is a very short walk away. Also located within a walk - west sacramento, raley field, the riverfront, downtown plaza, capital park, crocker art museum and park, etc.

If Saca thought at all that his market was soaked up by the Towers, I don't think he would've promptly lined up the Metropolitan either. But he didn't stop there and went on to secure the rights for 800 K. If you don't think residential towers there will help chavez park and the JKL streets downtown, I think you're just being pessimistic.

You also mention luxury projects along 16th street near H? Well there are projects there. 50 new lofts and retail by next year in fact. Look at all the smaller infill projects around town - there is a variety of housing options popping up everywhere. The Towers and Aura offer something unique and unprecedented to Sacramento. They don't compete with or ruin other opportunities.

If you're a fan of mixed-use projects like the Elliot Building and O1 Lofts, you can rest assured that Mark Friedman, the Loftworks group, CADA, Petrovich, Kolokotronis, CIM and many more - all have PLENTY projects lined up across town.

[creamcityleo79]

Originally Posted by Majin

That kind of comment isnt fair.

Do you see me in bowties at every city council meeting trying to get every project taller than the captial canceled? Do you see me supporting the unions trying to block hospital expansions stopped for purely political reasons? Do you hear me on the radio spreading false statements/logic against passing a new tax for the arena? I could go on but I think you see my point.

Those kind of people are the REAL PEOPLE who kept Sacramento back for decades. I think you need to wake up a realize that in all reality me trolling on a random web forum is NOT the problem in Sacramento, its the kind of people I posted above.

I think I deserve an apology.

I apologize for any confusion in my message. Majin, I think you are pessimistic. But, I do not think that you don't want the best for DT. I do, however, think that Phillip is small-minded and can't wrap his head around big projects. Because he doesn't think they would be successful. I certainly don't think that you're like that Majin. I just think that you're a bit annoying at times saying things won't get built. But, there is a distinction between wanting something to get built and saying it won't get built. You say it won't get built but want it to and Phillip says it will and doesn't want it to. Basically, he's got a bow tie and you don't. So, I'm sorry. Because I know that at least with you we have the same goal in mind(well, almost...I don't want Sacramento to turn into Hong Kong. But, you know what I mean). Phillip wants to stay in the dark ages and build little suburban low rises in the middle of DT. So, thank you for at least having the same desired goal as the rest of us and not being a NIMBY like Phillip...and again I apologize for any confusion that may have put the two of you together. Your name shouldn't have even been in that post. Because, you're right, the two of you don't have too much in common. In fact, you're complete opposites. The post will be edited!

[brandon12]

^I think Philip and almost everyone else that posts on this thread wants what's best for downtown. Sure, subtle, reasonable differences exist among us. But if you compare these subtle differences to the chasm that seperates most of our ideas/viewpoints to the general public that has their heads in the sand re: the importance of dt revitalization, that's where you have to shake your head in amazement.

[brandon12]

^put another way, the differences in opinion that exist among us are similar to the differences between Barbara Boxer and Dianne Fienstein. The differences in opinion that exist between most of us and Joe Sprawl in Elk Grove are like those of Bush and Kerry.

[creamcityleo79]

Originally Posted by brandon12

^put another way, the differences in opinion that exist among us are similar to the differences between Barbara Boxer and Dianne Fienstein. The differences in opinion that exist between most of us and Joe Sprawl in Elk Grove are like those of Bush and Kerry.

Now you're speaking my language!

[Schmoe]

Originally Posted by brandon12

Joe Sprawl in Elk Grove

HEY!!!

[brandon12]

I said Joe Sprawl, not Joe Schmoe. You're different.

[Phillip]

Originally Posted by neuhickman79

Phillip wants to stay in the dark ages and build little suburban low rises in the middle of DT. So, thank you for at least having the same desired goal as the rest of us and not being a NIMBY like Phillip

Yes, I would like to see several 14-20 story towers go up and sell out in Downtown Sacramento before we attempt 54 stories.

I don't consider 20 stories "suburban low rises". Where in the Sacramento suburbs do you find 20 story residential buildings? Where do you find 10 stories? For the Central Valley 20 stories is high density.

Do you consider Portland's Pearl District a failure? Over two dozen new condo and apartment towers of various heights have gone up and sold out in the Pearl over the last decade, bringing more than 10,000 new residents to Downtown Portland. And the tallest condo in the Pearl is 19 stories!! Luxury doesn't require extreme altitude. Penthouses in the most desired Pearl buildings are selling for well over a million.

I'm not opposed to tall buildings per se, but nothing in Sacramento's history suggests there's sufficient demand to fill two 54-story towers or an 18-story hotel with $300 rooms. Those are assertions of blind faith.

If Saca offered all 800 units to the public now, instead of 400 or 500 units, and all 800 units sold that would quickly silence all naysayers, including me.

Ultimately though it doesn't matter whether you or I like or believe in this project. What matters is whether Deutsche Bank believes in the project enough to close on the $375 million construction loan (and secondarily whether the city believes in it enough to give the $11 million hotel subsidy).

Probably it's a good thing that the big decision will be made by distant bankers who will evaluate the project objectively from financial and feasibility standpoints, and aren't emotionally invested in competing visions of what Downtown Sacramento could/should look like, the way that you and I are.

[foxmtbr]

^I understand your point, building up slowly first. I, personally, am one who is happy with whatever happens, so it's all good.

[innov8]

Well, you don't grab attention when you do it like everyone
else would have done it. A signature structure of size and
presents is what is making the Towers a success... Saca
has the balls to take it further than anyone else would have
ever conceived, and because of that he has more leverage
than ever before for building other incredible buildings
in the future.

Being average will only get you so far... I'm glad Saca's not average.

[Phillip]

Originally Posted by innov8

Saca has the balls to take it further than anyone else would have ever conceived, and because of that he has more leverage than ever before for building other incredible buildings in the future.

I've never met John Saca, but I admire his accomplishments, his drive, and his balls, and I wish him much success in all his other endeavors.

[squintstopher]

Originally Posted by innov8

A signature structure of size and
presents

What, like Santa's sleigh?

[innov8]

Originally Posted by squintstopher

What, like Santa's sleigh?

Exactly

[mechanico]

From the sacbee article
"Caught between rising construction costs and a slumping housing market, Saca has seen the budget for his $500 million project, which would be the tallest residential structure on the West Coast, tighten."

then

"We absolutely need it," he said. "What's happened is our construction costs for the project have gone up well over $100 million from last year."

A 20% increase in cost is substantial, especially with the building barely started. I'm assuming the rise in construction cost was do to material and not labor cost increase. Did he start a $500 million dollar project without a hedge against a rise in material cost?

[craeg]

Uh, since when is 615' the tallest residential structure on the west coast. SF has two all residential buildings under construction that are over 640'