Urban vs Suburban - 2 styles enter, one style leaves!

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by geotag277

Suburban neighbour hell:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s_aMR4GJyrI

At least with a condo board you have some recourse if you have bad neighbours. You can get your neighbour fined and even evicted from the building for harassment and violating condo board rules. If you live in suburbia - good luck. The police won't do anything.

Another win for urban living

I have a friend who lived in Brentwood and his neighbors were unrelenting partiers. Cops did nothing. He eventually sold the house and moved, not entirly because of the neighbors, but they played a big roll, and moved his timetable up.

[MasterG]

Originally Posted by geotag277

Remember kids, the lower the average income the worse the neighbourhood

As long as everyone has the same demographic and economic means as me. That's why suburbia is great, all houses are identical and can only be afforded by the same demographic group. Singles? Renters? Cyclists? eww no thanks. I want everyone I see to be identical to me: 3BR 2,000 sqft house with a 45 minute commute. Not that I want to talk to anyone out here, that's why I got the attached garage so I can drive right in and avoid as much social contact as possible.

We all go to the same fast food joints, go to cross Iron mills every Saturday, drive the same trucks (with the same truck nuts) and wait at the same traffic lights for our hour long commutes everyday. Social conformity makes me feel like I am part of a team. No one is going to socially-engineer me into living in an apartment!

[insert out-of-context Druh Farrell / peace bridge / blue ring / inner-city crime quote here]

[suburbia]

Originally Posted by geotag277

Remember kids, the lower the average income the worse the neighbourhood

Not necessarily, but that is likely where you'll find the most disrespect for private and public property, and largest drug busts.

The reality is, we need to do more for people down and out, and that's why I've advocated for places like East Village to embrace the current residents, as opposed to purging them. You need to fight the drug use and prostitution not by padlocking the washrooms, but by creating infrastructure and the opposite of isolation.

The core is a real paradox. The poorest of the poor often live very close to the richest. It is generally devoid of true middle-class.

[suburbia]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

I have a friend who lived in Brentwood and his neighbors were unrelenting partiers. Cops did nothing. He eventually sold the house and moved, not entirly because of the neighbors, but they played a big roll, and moved his timetable up.

Thanks for bringing this type of thing up. I actually think this tends to happen most in the band that is halfway between the inner city and suburbia. The areas 40-50 years old. Pembrooke, Brentwood, etc., but is not limited to any one part of the city.

Curious though. While I feel the quoted post (and others of the same vein) are fine, why was my post about the major drug bust in the Calgary core removed? Is that not a valid point as to why people may not want to live in that part of the city?

[geotag277]

Speaking of drugs, here's a map of the grow ups in Calgary:

http://www.matthewdekort.com/buyer/growops.html

Shesh, again dominated by suburbia - you never really know who your neighbours are behind those mile high fences huh

[fusili]

Originally Posted by geotag277

Speaking of drugs, here's a map of the grow ups in Calgary:

http://www.matthewdekort.com/buyer/growops.html

Shesh, again dominated by suburbia - you never really know who your neighbours are behind those mile high fences huh

Suburbia's got 35 in his neck of the woods alone!

Only one in the entire centre city.

[suburbia]

Originally Posted by fusili

Suburbia's got 35 in his neck of the woods alone!

Wow! That's one for every drug dealer arrested in the core just in the past 24 hours!

[Surrealplaces]

Originally Posted by geotag277

Speaking of drugs, here's a map of the grow ups in Calgary:

http://www.matthewdekort.com/buyer/growops.html

Shesh, again dominated by suburbia - you never really know who your neighbours are behind those mile high fences huh

Geez looks like Saddle Ridge is grow op central. I thought grow ops on every street would be something you only see in the Beltline.

[suburbia]

Originally Posted by Surrealplaces

Geez looks like Saddle Ridge is grow op central. I thought grow ops on every street would be something you only see in the Beltline.

It is definitely a problem in newer communities, particularly those at the periphery. Garages have their value in Calgary, but most definitely enable grow-ups to hide harvesting / bringing in of equipment, etc.

One thing you can't see in the map shared is the dates. Those are all grow ops that were found and shut down, and the map just keeps getting added to. I'd venture a guess that as the years pass, the houses found to the rim of development, except in isolated cases. The rural ones are often the largest, but it is a huge regional challenge.

I don't understand your comment about seeing them in the beltline. There is a big difference between crack houses and grow ops. Personally, I'd want neither anywhere near me.

[Surrealplaces]

Interesting article in today's CBC website.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgar...651015?cmp=rss

More Calgarians eating, shopping downtown, poll finds
Centre City Perception Survey respondents say they find the city's core to be safe

According to the poll, most Calgarians are satisfied with the level of safety in the city’s core, with nine out of 10 saying it has been steady or improved over the last year.

City planning official Dawn Thome said the results show recent investments in the core are paying off.

“Centre City residents continue to tell us that they enjoy living in their community. Even those who do not live in the Centre City are spending more time taking part in activities and contributing to a vibrant core,” she said in a release.

[geotag277]

Here's Calgary's crime map for reference:

http://crimemap.calgarypolice.ca/con...aimerPage.aspx

It's pretty clear looking at the previous 6 months that the vast majority of crime occurs in Calgary's suburban neighbourhoods.

[suburbia]

Originally Posted by geotag277

It's pretty clear looking at the previous 6 months that the vast majority of crime occurs in Calgary's suburban neighbourhoods.

If I'm not mistaken, that one had already been posted. That one was only 2 people whereas the current bust, Operation Wunderland, resulted in 190 charges and 35 people being tagged, 12 of those currently fugitives running from the law. Looks like half of the 190 charges relate to violence. 100 charges for violence in a 2 square kilometer area is a major issue.

The way the crime map works is you have a situation with one or two people and it creates a single flag, and then you have one with 190 charges and 35 people, and it creates a single flag. Clearly some of those are "higher density".

[suburbia]

Originally Posted by Surrealplaces

Interesting article in today's CBC website.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgar...651015?cmp=rss

More Calgarians eating, shopping downtown, poll finds
Centre City Perception Survey respondents say they find the city's core to be safe

No one will disagree with Calgary being a fantastic and safe city. That's why we live here, right?

I think the question is, do we want to do better, or are we going to say we've done the best we can ever achieve? You look at it with similar vision as we do transit. Our LRT is wildly successful, but we can still improve it.

[RyLucky]

Originally Posted by suburbia

No one will disagree with Calgary being a fantastic and safe city. That's why we live here, right?

I think the question is, do we want to do better, or are we going to say we've done the best we can ever achieve? You look at it with similar vision as we do transit. Our LRT is wildly successful, but we can still improve it.

How do you believe crime can be reduced? Avoiding areas where a crime occurred?

[suburbia]

Originally Posted by RyLucky

How do you believe crime can be reduced? Avoiding areas where a crime occurred?

Probably better in the 'crime' thread, but my brief comment would be something I understand could be said in an AA meeting. The first step is to accept the issue. There is crime. Mind altering drugs that destroy lives are bad. Violence is not normal. Prostitution is not entertainment. I think many people have gotten too comfortable with these things, and you find such types in all areas. When someone is getting hurt or abused, we don't seem to care about it any more, and will instead point to a story from a few months ago saying, 'that was a worse one - this is nothing'.

Anyway - will stop here as we are wayyy off topic.

[geotag277]

Originally Posted by suburbia

Probably better in the 'crime' thread, but my brief comment would be something I understand could be said in an AA meeting. The first step is to accept the issue. There is crime. Mind altering drugs that destroy lives are bad. Violence is not normal. Prostitution is not entertainment. I think many people have gotten too comfortable with these things, and you find such types in all areas. When someone is getting hurt or abused, we don't seem to care about it any more, and will instead point to a story from a few months ago saying, 'that was a worse one - this is nothing'.

Anyway - will stop here as we are wayyy off topic.

I don't think it belongs in a different thread, it strikes at the core of the issue. Many people accept that any crime is a problem, but what is a point of contention is the solution.

Investing in suburban neighbourhoods spreads our police force thin. A police force responsible for a dense urban area is much for efficient than a police force that needs to invest in policing, monitoring, having informants, connections, and personal relationships across huge swaths of land. What you end up with is violence and crime originating from drug loads, meth labs, and sophisticated drug operations head-quartered in compounds out in suburbia whose isolation and exploitation of a thinly monitored police presence facilitates their success.

Police need the resources to do their jobs effectively and suburban sprawl runs counter to that goal. As a result I don't think suburban residents are paying their fair share to keep crime down in this great city of ours.

[RyLucky]

I'll bold the times when the subject of your post was crime in this thread, on this page:

Originally Posted by suburbia

Not necessarily, but that is likely where you'll find the most disrespect for private and public property, and largest drug busts.
[...] You need to fight the drug use and prostitution not by padlocking the washrooms, but by creating infrastructure and the opposite of isolation.

Originally Posted by suburbia

[...] why was my post about the major drug bust in the Calgary core removed? Is that not a valid point as to why people may not want to live in that part of the city?

Originally Posted by suburbia

Wow! That's one for every drug dealer arrested in the core just in the past 24 hours!

Originally Posted by suburbia

It is definitely a problem in newer communities, particularly those at the periphery. Garages have their value in Calgary, but most definitely enable grow-ups to hide harvesting / bringing in of equipment, etc.

One thing you can't see in the map shared is the dates. Those are all grow ops that were found and shut down, and the map just keeps getting added to. [...]
There is a big difference between crack houses and grow ops. [...]

Originally Posted by suburbia

[...]That one was only 2 people whereas the current bust, Operation Wunderland, resulted in 190 charges and 35 people being tagged, 12 of those currently fugitives running from the law. Looks like half of the 190 charges relate to violence. 100 charges for violence in a 2 square kilometer area is a major issue.

The way the crime map works is you have a situation with one or two people and it creates a single flag, and then you have one with 190 charges and 35 people, and it creates a single flag. Clearly some of those are "higher density".

Finally, I quote this post, and I ask you about your views on crime:

Originally Posted by suburbia

No one will disagree with Calgary being a fantastic and safe city. That's why we live here, right?

I think the question is, do we want to do better, or are we going to say we've done the best we can ever achieve? You look at it with similar vision as we do transit. Our LRT is wildly successful, but we can still improve it.

And I'm the one who's off topic?!!:

Originally Posted by suburbia

Probably better in the 'crime' thread, but my brief comment would be something I understand could be said in an AA meeting. The first step is to accept the issue. There is crime. Mind altering drugs that destroy lives are bad. Violence is not normal. Prostitution is not entertainment. I think many people have gotten too comfortable with these things, and you find such types in all areas. When someone is getting hurt or abused, we don't seem to care about it any more, and will instead point to a story from a few months ago saying, 'that was a worse one - this is nothing'.

Anyway - will stop here as we are wayyy off topic.

Crime is bad and not normal. People don't worry enough. Thanks for a non-answer.

[suburbia]

Originally Posted by RyLucky

I'll bold the times when the subject of your post was crime in this thread

Largely in response to people posting a video of an unruly neighbor. Within that context, I was demonstrating what neighbors in other areas do.

Your philosophical conversation about crime, on the contrary, was misplaced.

[geotag277]

That big backyard and shiny fence won't protect you from socio-path neighbours, this one in the suburban community of Patterson:

http://globalnews.ca/news/1348860/wa...in-antifreeze/

[freeweed]

Since when is prostitution bad? It's illegal, but so was alcohol at one point. And all of the crime that happened from that was due to prohibition itself, not the alcohol.