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  #5281  
Old Posted Dec 5, 2014, 4:17 AM
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It's not a classical facade, it's a 1970s bank building. Sacamenna Kid, are you maybe thinking of the D.O. Mills Bank at 7th and J, a block away?

Majin is right on both counts--the production of new housing in the central business district is way, way behind, and there is a massive jobs/housing imbalance in the central city as a whole and in the CBD in particular. There are about 100,000 jobs in the central city--and roughly 30,000 residents. The vast majority of those residents are in Midtown, Southside and Alkali/Mansion Flat, and the majority of the jobs are in the CBD. Which means if everyone who lives in the central city, including retirees, children, the disabled, and the 2000 folks in the main jail all had jobs in the central city and none of them did a reverse commute, you still need more than twice as many commuters as residents driving to work every day.

The closest thing to a figure on how many people commute from the suburbs to downtown comes from the following report: http://definingdowntown.org/read-the-report/ . This report states that of the roughly 73,000 people living in a zone defined as downtown Sacramento and the neighborhoods within a 1 mile radius, and 151,000 jobs. 27.2% of the people who live in that radius also work within that radius. Personally I'd suggest that those who live within the "grid" proper are even more likely to work in the central city, because it's that much easier to walk to work. Despite snefnoc's stereotypical caricature of the middle-aged, suburban state worker, I know a lot of folks who live in the central city who work for the state from their twenties to senior citizens, including retired state employees who apparently didn't get the memo that Midtown is only for young people. Some moved here for a short commute to work, some started working for the state after moving here because there were a lot of state jobs in their neighborhood (far more than the neighborhood population can possibly fill.)

I don't think building more office capacity is a good strategy for encouraging more residential use. Let's assume for a moment that snefnoc's 80% ratio is correct, and that of 1000 employees in the Vanir Building, 200 end up living downtown. Figure that the remaining 800 will primarily commute via automobile--some will take transit, maybe 5%, but that's still 750 cars on the roads, clogging up already overloaded highways. That also means 750 parking spaces--reinforcing demand for more parking garages, not downtown housing. Now, the idea is obviously not to force everyone to live downtown (far from it!), but if we can shift that balance from 20-30% to more like 40-50%, not only do we reduce rush hour traffic for all commuters, we meet more of the existing demand for downtown housing. The CBD is zoned for as many as 450 residential units per acre, but the number who actually live there (not counting the jail) is more like 7-8 per acre--which is the maximum zoned density for neighborhoods like Land Park and East Sacramento. Which is less than a quarter of the maximum density for Midtown, but that's another post.

And yes, there is demand--you can see it in the recently opened developments near the central business district. Legado de Ravel filled up very quickly, despite rents of $2000+ for 1 and 2 bedroom apartments, and the not-yet-completed 16 Powerhouse, with rents as high as $3000, has a long waiting list. For-sale housing, what little of it has come on the market, gets snapped up very quickly, even though it is priced considerably higher than houses of comparable size, and generally bigger lots, in the suburbs. Why? Because they're not comparable--being close to downtown is an amenity in and of itself, worth more money to the urban customer.

Some of the disappointment may stem from changes to the city's General Plan that happened recently--the 2030 General Plan was designed to really promote high-density housing in the CBD, but the latest update sets their sights much lower, accepting a few more fourplexes in Midtown in place of high-rise residential Downtown. My personal pet theory is that the biggest builders in the local market have an established business model, new greenfield residential in the suburbs, offices downtown, and they are too risk-averse to change their business model. Odds are, we may just have to wait for some of these developers to die off, because there are younger and more forward-thinking developers who are building new housing in parts of the central city, but only a handful so far within the central business district--and they'll make the money that the old-school suburban developers are leaving on the table, waiting for it to be the 1950s again.

That said, I don't have any particular problem with the Vanir building. I figure they can always convert part of it to residential use later.
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Last edited by wburg; Dec 5, 2014 at 5:43 AM.
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  #5282  
Old Posted Dec 5, 2014, 4:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Majin View Post
This is great and all, don't get me wrong, you guys know I love skyscrapers But where the hell are the residential developments?

The CDB really needs a lot more residents to truly create a "all hours" CDB with lots of retail, grocery stores, and non-weekend entertainment downtown.
I'm still holding out for what will happen at 3rd and Capitol... The former Towers site.... if we can get anything close to that (and I do think we can), that will be HUGE.
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  #5283  
Old Posted Dec 5, 2014, 5:52 AM
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Originally Posted by snfenoc View Post
Also, building a residential tower may not be economically feasible. But building smaller residential structures seems to be. You ask where the hell are the residential developments? I ask, have you been paying attention these past few years? We have had quite a few...just no high rises, and that is fine with me.
I agree there has been a lot of progress recently, but we still have much further to go. It would be cool however to have something like the KOIN Tower in Portland. Office space on the lower floors with high-end condos up top, but keeping the Vanir design as much as possible. The Vanir Tower's location of a half block north of the arena would seem to be a good fit.


KOIN Tower for reference.
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  #5284  
Old Posted Dec 5, 2014, 3:12 PM
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Here are the pics from the article for those locked out of the Bee's Paywall...




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  #5285  
Old Posted Dec 5, 2014, 5:29 PM
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I don't mind the Vanir Building at all. It adds to the skyline in a very understated way and isn't horribly postmodern (1990s). Also, isn't this the first large headquarters of any type in Sacramento?
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  #5286  
Old Posted Dec 5, 2014, 6:14 PM
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  #5287  
Old Posted Dec 5, 2014, 7:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aufbau View Post
Thank Goodness. There are enough vintage late 80s/early 90s high-rises in Sacramento. We're not far enough in the future for a revival of that style.
Could someone post photos? I hit that stupid Sacbee paywall.
At work I never encounter the Sacbee paywall. At home I hit the paywall a long time ago. Just open your browser in incognito mode when you go to Sacbee's website and voila, you are a new visitor again. I use a chrome extention that opens a new window in incognito mode anytime I click on any Sacbee link.
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  #5288  
Old Posted Dec 5, 2014, 9:04 PM
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  #5289  
Old Posted Dec 5, 2014, 11:58 PM
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Sac loves its nubby little skyscrapers. Still hoping The Metropolitan happens so we can have something over 30 stories for once!
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  #5290  
Old Posted Dec 6, 2014, 5:42 PM
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I like the interesting shape, even though it is "plain." I think Sacramento needs more modern looking architecture like this in the skyline. 26 floors is nice - not great, still want something to command the skyline, crossing my fingers for a bigger project. But my fear with this one is as we've seen in the past, interesting designs come out, it gets approved and everyone is excited, then the developers realize it will cost X million $ more for such a design and dumb it down to lower costs. I really hope this irregular box doesn't turn out to be a regular box, is what I mean..
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  #5291  
Old Posted Dec 18, 2014, 10:56 PM
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Kaiser buying building near arena for medical offices




Quote:
In another dramatic development for downtown Sacramento, Kaiser Permanente said it is buying the six-story Sacramento Corporate Center at 501 J St. and plans to renovate it for medical offices.
Kaiser is spending $40 million for a building that has been largely vacant for years. But it's in a key location, across the street from the new Sacramento Kings arena. Kaiser is a partner of the team as its official provider of medical services.
http://www.bizjournals.com/sacramento/ne...ing-building-near-arena-for-medical.html
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  #5292  
Old Posted Dec 18, 2014, 10:57 PM
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^^^^^That is potentially HUGE news. As the article says, this may be the first step in a Kaiser Hospital in the railyards (and the only hospital downtown)!
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  #5293  
Old Posted Dec 19, 2014, 2:36 AM
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We've got a couple in Midtown, but no Kaiser facilities. Could save Kaiser patients in the central city some driving time at the very least--very convenient from light rail or the planned streetcar line.
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  #5294  
Old Posted Dec 21, 2014, 5:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by downtownserg89 View Post
Sac loves its nubby little skyscrapers. Still hoping The Metropolitan happens so we can have something over 30 stories for once!
any chance that this building will break the 500 ft barrier?
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  #5295  
Old Posted Dec 21, 2014, 4:57 PM
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any chance that this building will break the 500 ft barrier?
No chance.
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  #5296  
Old Posted Dec 26, 2014, 4:47 PM
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Someone said in the city data forum that Epic is back on. Has anyone heard that?
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  #5297  
Old Posted Dec 28, 2014, 4:17 PM
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Someone said in the city data forum that Epic is back on. Has anyone heard that?
I've heard, from a good source, that a group of investors in Minneapolis attempted to buy the plans for Epic AND 701L! I don't know yet what came of the attempt!

Edit: Both attempts were unsuccessful. Maybe they are back on!?

Last edited by creamcityleo79; Jan 6, 2015 at 3:28 PM.
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  #5298  
Old Posted Jan 6, 2015, 10:58 PM
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From the Sacramento Bee

Sacramento group seeks to put public market in downtown train depot
BY RYAN [email protected]
01/05/2015 9:00 PM - Updated 01/06/2015 8:16 AM

http://www.sacbee.com/news/local/news-columns-blogs/city-beat/article5473497.html

Quote:
Seeking to capitalize on Sacramento’s growing profile as a food and agriculture hub, a group advocating for a permanent public market in the city has recommended that the facility be placed inside the historic downtown train depot.......

I am curious about this. The train depot sounds like an OK spot with its close proximity to a transportation hub. However, I wonder if the former Greyhound bus depot makes better sense.
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Last edited by snfenoc; Jan 7, 2015 at 12:26 AM. Reason: Clarification to "train depot"
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  #5299  
Old Posted Jan 7, 2015, 4:34 AM
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The Greyhound depot is a lot smaller. It might be nice for a neighborhood market (something bigger than a corner store but smaller than a supermarket) to serve downtown residents but not the right size for something like this, and without quite as many visitors passing through. It might make a good complement for the depot if it is done right--something more along the lines of the SF Ferry Building, where transportation functions are still taking place alongside the market. Just opening up some folksy "farmer's market" stands inside the beautifully restored depot would be a poor fit. However, there is a lot of room between the tracks and the depot that could be brightened up with a few kiosks selling goods to travelers, or regular special events like the Friday farmer's market in front of the Ferry Building. The depot will still have transportation functions for quite a few years--but there is a lot of room to utilize on the eastern side of the building, away from the relocated Amtrak offices and ticket counter.
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  #5300  
Old Posted Jan 7, 2015, 4:44 AM
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Last edited by wburg; Jan 7, 2015 at 3:51 PM. Reason: Posted in wrong forum
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