Stadiums & Arenas of Canada, Part 3

[Djeffery]

I don't think they ever sold out any of the NFL games they had there over the years. If the NFL decides to come back to Toronto for any more games, we've already seen that BMO can be expanded to 40k or so. Same goes for any international soccer or other sports on that style of field.

Rotating the seats would not be feasible during baseball season based on the above description, but I don't see how it would make a difference in the off season given that there's plenty of time to fix up the infield (assuming that rotating the seats would even affect it).

Even a normal season sees the 2 sports overlap 3/4 of the year. The Jays would always plan to make the playoffs, which would almost entirely match the CFL regular season. Not a lot of baseball off season like there is for an NFL season when they had a lot of shared stadiums there. The Argos didn't exactly light the world on fire with attendance at Rogers Centre the last few seasons there either. Hard to know if this year is an outlier, but even if you do a rough guess at 3000 more people per game at RC prior to moving to BMO, is that enough to warrant the cost of setting up RC for them?

[thurmas]

With 591, 000 viewers for the Argos ti cats game this past Monday there is still obviously a cfl fan base in the area it just seems incredibly difficult to get the Argos fans from the TV screen to a game in person

[thurmas]

Maybe sharing tim Hortons field in Hamilton would make more sense for them who knows. With Montreal not having hosted a grey cup since 2008 Maybe the should host one at Molson stadium and try and squeeze in 30000 there and just charge more for tickets compared to the big o.

[SignalHillHiker]

If you’ve ever had Mary Brown’s, you’ll laugh:

[esquire]

Originally Posted by Djeffery

Even a normal season sees the 2 sports overlap 3/4 of the year. The Jays would always plan to make the playoffs, which would almost entirely match the CFL regular season. Not a lot of baseball off season like there is for an NFL season when they had a lot of shared stadiums there. The Argos didn't exactly light the world on fire with attendance at Rogers Centre the last few seasons there either. Hard to know if this year is an outlier, but even if you do a rough guess at 3000 more people per game at RC prior to moving to BMO, is that enough to warrant the cost of setting up RC for them?

I'm not thinking a football or soccer team would take up permanent residence in Rogers Centre, it's more a question of one-off events like the Grey Cup, NFL neutral site games, bowl games (like the International Bowl), international soccer, etc.

Obviously I stand to be corrected but I find it hard to believe that the venue is no longer capable of hosting those types of events, i.e. that the stands are permanently locked into place. For the right price they'd turn them.

[jonny24]

Before the pandemic Rogers was looking at proposals to redevelop the whole thing. Seems to be shelved for now but probably not forever.

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by esquire

I'm not thinking a football or soccer team would take up permanent residence in Rogers Centre, it's more a question of one-off events like the Grey Cup, NFL neutral site games, bowl games (like the International Bowl), international soccer, etc.

I just don't think it's a very nice facility to watch anything that isn't baseball in. Multipurpose stadiums are just...bleh. It's big and cold and concrete.

The NFL is more interested in Mexico and Europe these days, so I doubt Toronto gets a date any time soon. Anything FIFA or CMNT can play at BMO these days.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by JHikka

I just don't think it's a very nice facility to watch anything that isn't baseball in. Multipurpose stadiums are just...bleh. It's big and cold and concrete.

I'm having a hard time following your logic here... the multipurpose Rogers Centre is fine for baseball but not for other sports???

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by esquire

I'm having a hard time following your logic here... the multipurpose Rogers Centre is fine for baseball but not for other sports???

I mean, it's passable for baseball but it's not exactly great, either. My issue with multipurpose stadiums is that they never do anything particularly well, they just do everything on average or worse. Wouldn't have an issue with the whole facility meeting a wrecking ball.

[AuxTown]

Originally Posted by JHikka

I mean, it's passable for baseball but it's not exactly great, either. My issue with multipurpose stadiums is that they never do anything particularly well, they just do everything on average or worse. Wouldn't have an issue with the whole facility meeting a wrecking ball.

I worked in an electronics store during university and I always use the analagy of a TV/VCR combo. You get a shitty TV and a shitty VCR rolled into one. And when one of them breaks you have to replace the whole thing! Same goes for stadiums.

[esquire]

Where does Rogers Centre fall short? I went to football, baseball and basketball games in there and I thought for big-field sports it was perfectly fine. It was never clear to me what I was missing. And I've attended football and baseball in quite a few venues throughout Canada, the US and Japan so I have a pretty good basis for comparison. For basketball it wasn't so great, although mind you I was sitting in the 500s and maybe I'd have felt differently if my seats were lower... but I doubt it.

Obviously it doesn't have all of the amenities of brand new facilities but that's a matter of age and not multi-purpose design. I get the impression that the biggest issue with Rogers Centre is that like last year's dress, it is simply no longer in style.

[HomeInMyShoes]

Originally Posted by SignalHillHiker

If you’ve ever had Mary Brown’s, you’ll laugh:

I love Mary Brown's. I'm not afraid to admit it.

[WhipperSnapper]

Originally Posted by jonny24

Before the pandemic Rogers was looking at proposals to redevelop the whole thing. Seems to be shelved for now but probably not forever.

Rogers was just putting out feelers with an extremely pro development provincial government. It's probably not going to go anywhere unless Rogers gives the heavily indebted government the better part of the deal over the usual government handouts.

The Argos would have better numbers and possibly built up very good numbers if any of the Downsview or York University plans had been built.

[Acajack]

Funny how moving the Argos to BMO seemed like a great idea at the time.

I suppose people thought the "magic" that happened when the Alouettes moved to McGill (well, it lasted for a decade and a half) would materialize in Toronto as well.

At this point I wonder if the Argos wouldn't even have been better off staying at SkyDome, if that had been possible.

[WhipperSnapper]

I remember a lot more excitement over York University. BMO was considered a better sized stadium than Skydome (which has been proven) and vastly better than Lamport Stadium. I think most were just thrilled that the Argos had a home.

[Djeffery]

I think if it made financial sense for the Argos to stay at the dome, Rogers would have simply bought them, and kept them there. I'm sure they could have picked them up for cheap. Would have been like back in the mid 90's when Labatts owned the Jays, Argos and TSN. Who knows where the whole Toronto sporting scene would have been if Labatts hadn't itself been sold off and the sports teams divested.

[thurmas]

Cfl teams generally do better when community owned or owned by one dedicated sole owner. The corporate umbrella ownership structures have not helped grow cfl teams in stamps being owned by flames and Argos being run by mlse umbrella.

[HomerSPC]

Originally Posted by esquire

Where does Rogers Centre fall short? I went to football, baseball and basketball games in there and I thought for big-field sports it was perfectly fine. It was never clear to me what I was missing. And I've attended football and baseball in quite a few venues throughout Canada, the US and Japan so I have a pretty good basis for comparison. For basketball it wasn't so great, although mind you I was sitting in the 500s and maybe I'd have felt differently if my seats were lower... but I doubt it.

Obviously it doesn't have all of the amenities of brand new facilities but that's a matter of age and not multi-purpose design. I get the impression that the biggest issue with Rogers Centre is that like last year's dress, it is simply no longer in style.

The atmosphere is a huge issue. Having 10,000 fans in a 50,000 seat stadium makes for a horrible atmosphere. You're playing in this giant cavernous stadium, there's no question it has an effect on player morale.

[Hackslack]

Originally Posted by HomerSPC

The atmosphere is a huge issue. Having 10,000 fans in a 50,000 seat stadium makes for a horrible atmosphere. You're playing in this giant cavernous stadium, there's no question it has an effect on player morale.

Don’t the jays, in seasons when they’re not good, play in that sort of circumstance and atmosphere?

[HomerSPC]

Originally Posted by Hackslack

Don’t the jays, in seasons when they’re not good, play in that sort of circumstance and atmosphere?

I never said that the Jays didn't have this issue either.