Lansdowne Park Redevelopment Phase 1 | Completed - Page 252

phil235 · #**5021** Posted **Oct 29, 2014, 2:32 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1overcosc

Then it's a bit odd they chose an area that's already a prosperous complete urban neighbourhood. You would think they go for an urban area that 1) needs a bit of a boost, 2) that is in the early stages of a revitalization. Somewhere like Little Italy, Vanier/Beechwood, or Main Street.

True, but I think they do both. Yorkville and Kitsilano weren't exactly struggling areas when Whole Foods went in there either.

I do think there is room for revitalization in the area, particularly in Old Ottawa South. The retail there has always been somewhat touch and go, and Landsdowne is poised to make a fairly significant difference.

For me it is a question of how big the impacted area can be, as there are some patchy areas not that far away. For instance, will the residential area west of Bronson (Glebe Annex?) get a boost, even though it's a kilometre and a half away. Does the south end of Centretown or Ottawa East benefit, etc.? I would hope so.

1overcosc · #**5022** Posted **Oct 29, 2014, 2:48 PM**

^ Ottawa East definitely will once they get that footbridge in.

YOWetal · #**5023** Posted **Oct 29, 2014, 5:50 PM**

The whole logic of this (Whole Foods) article is suspect. The "Whole Foods effect" is in cities in the United States where all the affluent neighborhoods already have a Whole Foods and is about Whole Foods expansion into a (usually already) gentrifying neighborhood that some say accelerates this development. This is not the case at all in Ottawa.

Regardless Lansdowne as a whole may help property values but Whole Foods will be a small part of this.

Another difference with the US is our mainstream supermarkets are of much higher quality than their US equivalents.

IMHO if you are defining Whole Foods as big box than the concept has lost all meaning. They do not sell anything in bulk quantities, this location will be fairly urban with limited (underground) parking, and a big chunk of their square footage will be dedicated to already prepared foods. Whole Foods layout is also far from big box. In fact, two carts can barely pass each other in an aisle of a typical whole foods.

nredding · #**5024** Posted **Oct 29, 2014, 6:03 PM**

Whole Foods growth in the US is slowing since many other grocers are also selling organic food. There is also plenty of competition for Whole Foods in the Glebe. As well as Loblaws (renovated a year ago) and the Metro (currently renovating) there are plenty of high quality small food stores, such as the French Baker, Nicastros, The Glebe Meat Market,and Kettleman's Bagels. The idea that Glebe shoppers will desert these outlets and run to Whole Foods seems doubtful to me, especially since Landsdowne will remain a construction site for the next year.

acottawa · #**5025** Posted **Oct 29, 2014, 10:30 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by phil235

I don't agree with this statement. If you look at Whole Foods locations in Canada, the majority are in urban neighbourhoods and could not be classified as big box. In the US, it also anchors a number of new urbanist developments in a way that few other stores have managed to do, notably in Alexandria Va.

As the article explains, the company has quite a unique business model. It has repeatedly taken the step of entering transitional neighbourhoods and kickstarting a transformation of those areas in the US. Check out the store in mid own Detroit for an extreme example. No other grocery store was willing to touch that location.

I don't think Loblaws or other Canadian grocers have histories or approaches that are remotely similar.

Maybe they have a unique business model anchoring new urbanist developments in the US. But in Ontario their locations are here:

https://www.google.ca/maps/@43.45653..._8pwjOt8UA!2e0

(big box format surrounded by surface parking in the most affluent of the 905 suburbs - so the opposite of a transitional neighbourhood)

https://www.google.ca/maps/@43.76096...AOammcfrgw!2e0
(sort of urban, but hardly a transitional neighbourhood)

https://www.google.ca/maps/place/Who...ca960f59eda606

(obviously the streetview is out of date, but it looks like sprawl at the edge of the city)

There is also one at Square One in Mississauga (not on streetview, so not sure whether it looks big boxy or not) and Yorkville (their only urban store in ontario, but in the most expensive shopping district in the province).

Personally, I am not sure how to distinguish Whole Foods' location policy from that of other retailers of consumables; except for Yorkville, many are co-located with traditional big box retailers such as Walmart, Target or Winners.

eemy · #**5026** Posted **Oct 29, 2014, 10:58 PM**

They do seem to be located in close proximity to some form of higher-order transit in all three cases (GO, Subway, and VIVA - I think). Ottawa's location is the exception in that case.

1overcosc · #**5027** Posted **Oct 29, 2014, 11:17 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by acottawa

Maybe they have a unique business model anchoring new urbanist developments in the US. But in Ontario their locations are here:

https://www.google.ca/maps/@43.45653..._8pwjOt8UA!2e0

(big box format surrounded by surface parking in the most affluent of the 905 suburbs - so the opposite of a transitional neighbourhood)

https://www.google.ca/maps/@43.76096...AOammcfrgw!2e0
(sort of urban, but hardly a transitional neighbourhood)

https://www.google.ca/maps/place/Who...ca960f59eda606

(obviously the streetview is out of date, but it looks like sprawl at the edge of the city)

There is also one at Square One in Mississauga (not on streetview, so not sure whether it looks big boxy or not) and Yorkville (their only urban store in ontario, but in the most expensive shopping district in the province).

Personally, I am not sure how to distinguish Whole Foods' location policy from that of other retailers of consumables; except for Yorkville, many are co-located with traditional big box retailers such as Walmart, Target or Winners.

The first example you gave is suburban big box sprawl--but the second and third ones are not.

The second example you gave is in North York City Centre which is an urban neighbourhood.. and one that is rapidly growing. At the corner of Yonge and Sheppard it honestly feels like you're in a downtown. With thousands of new street-oriented condo units being built all along Yonge St in that area, it's certainly a booming neighbourhood about to become quite urban.

The third example is in Downtown Markham, which is a brownfield/vacant lot being transformed into a neo-urbanist downtown as we speak. In ten years that whole area will look like this:

This is Toronto we're talking about. Thanks to Places to Grow Act and the insane condo boom there brand new urban neighbourhoods are being carved out of nothing. An urban downtown for Vaughan is also being created at the site of an old rail yard.

phil235 · #**5028** Posted **Oct 30, 2014, 12:10 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by nredding

Whole Foods growth in the US is slowing since many other grocers are also selling organic food. There is also plenty of competition for Whole Foods in the Glebe. As well as Loblaws (renovated a year ago) and the Metro (currently renovating) there are plenty of high quality small food stores, such as the French Baker, Nicastros, The Glebe Meat Market,and Kettleman's Bagels. The idea that Glebe shoppers will desert these outlets and run to Whole Foods seems doubtful to me, especially since Landsdowne will remain a construction site for the next year.

Whole Foods trading area is much wider than the Glebe. The idea is that it will be a destination store and people will come from throughout the area. In any event, I think the stores will complement each other.

As for the construction site comment, have you been there lately? It's actually looking very good already. And the retail will all be open by early 2015.

phil235 · #**5029** Posted **Oct 30, 2014, 12:14 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by acottawa

Maybe they have a unique business model anchoring new urbanist developments in the US. But in Ontario their locations are here:

https://www.google.ca/maps/@43.45653..._8pwjOt8UA!2e0

(big box format surrounded by surface parking in the most affluent of the 905 suburbs - so the opposite of a transitional neighbourhood)

https://www.google.ca/maps/@43.76096...AOammcfrgw!2e0
(sort of urban, but hardly a transitional neighbourhood)

https://www.google.ca/maps/place/Who...ca960f59eda606

(obviously the streetview is out of date, but it looks like sprawl at the edge of the city)

There is also one at Square One in Mississauga (not on streetview, so not sure whether it looks big boxy or not) and Yorkville (their only urban store in ontario, but in the most expensive shopping district in the province).

Personally, I am not sure how to distinguish Whole Foods' location policy from that of other retailers of consumables; except for Yorkville, many are co-located with traditional big box retailers such as Walmart, Target or Winners.

Just to add to 1overcosc's response, you haven't looked at the bulk of the Canadian locations, which are in B.C. Those are entirely urban.

I'm not suggesting that Whole Foods is entirely urban. Even in the U.S. there are plenty of suburban locations, but from what I've seen, they tend to be in malls rather than big box complexes. The point was more that they have a huge urban presence in all types of neighbourhoods, and have had it for a long time, before other chains were doing the same. Their stores also tend to be high quality builds, which distinguishes them from big box retailers.

acottawa · #**5030** Posted **Oct 30, 2014, 12:51 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1overcosc

The first example you gave is suburban big box sprawl--but the second and third ones are not.

The second example you gave is in North York City Centre which is an urban neighbourhood.. and one that is rapidly growing. At the corner of Yonge and Sheppard it honestly feels like you're in a downtown. With thousands of new street-oriented condo units being built all along Yonge St in that area, it's certainly a booming neighbourhood about to become quite urban.

The third example is in Downtown Markham, which is a brownfield/vacant lot being transformed into a neo-urbanist downtown as we speak. In ten years that whole area will look like this:

This is Toronto we're talking about. Thanks to Places to Grow Act and the insane condo boom there brand new urban neighbourhoods are being carved out of nothing. An urban downtown for Vaughan is also being created at the site of an old rail yard.

Maybe downtown markam will eventually get all the way to highway 7 (the downtown markham development is at the 407 which a km to the south). In the meantime, it is in the middle of a pretty generic big box mall with pretty generic big box neighbours and lots of surface parking (although I do like the parking is in the interior - I wish trainyards had done that.
http://www.uptownmarket.ca/centre/

To me Loblaws has been much more successful at catching neighbourhood transitions (their Rideau, Vanier and Westboro stores were the middle not much when they were built, now they're in condo city). They built a huge store on the Toronto waterfront that was in the middle of nowhere and now surrounded by development and they bought MLG when that area was pretty run down. But of course they don't have the hipster following that whole foods has.

phil235 · #**5031** Posted **Oct 30, 2014, 1:32 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by acottawa

To me Loblaws has been much more successful at catching neighbourhood transitions (their Rideau, Vanier and Westboro stores were the middle not much when they were built, now they're in condo city). They built a huge store on the Toronto waterfront that was in the middle of nowhere and now surrounded by development and they bought MLG when that area was pretty run down. But of course they don't have the hipster following that whole foods has.

That is probably true in Canada. However, you need to remember that Whole Foods has only been here for 10 years, and has only stepped up its expansion in the last few years. The plan is clearly to build a strong base in Canada. It remains to be seen whether they will take the same kinds of risks as they have in the US.

The MLG Loblaws has done good things for that stretch of Carleton St. But Loblaws was a distant second into that neighbourhood after Dominion, which took a much riskier location near Jarvis and Gerrard. I wouldn't say Loblaw's took much of a risk at all, given the extremely favourable demographics of the Gay Village that they were wading into.

Likewise, the Toronto Waterfront store wasn't exactly a pioneer in its area. It was built a stone's throw from St. Lawrence Market and the very successful St. Lawrence neighbourhood east of Jarvis. It was also walking distance to thousands of condominiums that were already along Queen's Quay and had zero access to groceries, including Harbour Square, and its immediate neighbour was the biggest LCBO in the province.

I'm less sure about the history of the Ottawa locations, so I don't know whether they played a catalyst role in those areas.

rocketphish · #**5032** Posted **Nov 1, 2014, 1:22 PM**

Second Lansdowne contractor files lawsuit alleging non-payment

Michael Woods, Ottawa Citizen
Published on: October 31, 2014, Last Updated: October 31, 2014 6:40 PM EDT

A company has filed a lawsuit claiming it is owed money for work it did on the new TD Place at Lansdowne’s signature construction feature.

In a statement of claim filed on Monday, Spring Valley Classic Custom Corporation claims it is owed $3.4 million for work done and materials supplied for the stadium’s cedar veil, which wraps around the outside of the south side stands.

The suit names a number of defendants including the city, the Ottawa Sports and Entertainment Group, general contractor Pomerleau Inc. and TD Bank.

The allegations have not been tested in court and no statement of defence has been filed.

The Hamilton-area company claims it had an agreement to supply design, engineering and construction work for the construction of the stadium’s wooden veil.

The agreed-upon price was about $8 million, which included additional work to ensure a safe design, reworking the original design and materials, and additional costs, the suit says.

The suit claims the company did work and supplied materials “in a good and workman like manner” to a value in excess of $8 million, and that the company is owed $3.4 million.

It alleges the company has requested payment and not received it despite sending invoices for the work. The work was done “at the request of, with the knowledge of, and to the benefit of the defendants,” the suit claims.

The city budgeted about $130 million for the renovation of the stadium at Lansdowne.

Spring Valley is the second company to recently file a lawsuit seeking payment for work on Lansdowne.

Early in October, Quebec steel company Lainco Inc. filed two lawsuits alleging it is owed a total of $5.3 million for work on the north side and south side stands. The company pursued a construction lien, but the case was then elevated to Superior Court.

The company alleges it was contracted by Pomerleau in December 2012 to manufacture, assemble and install the structural steel on the north side and south side stands.

The suit says the company supplied labour, services and materials for the south side stands between Jan. 1, 2013 and July 31, 2014 and for the north side stands between April 1, 2013 and Aug. 28, 2014.

It is seeking about $2.7 million in payment for work on the south side stands and $2.6 million for work on the north side stands.

The allegations have not been tested in court, and statements of defence have not been filed.

[email protected]
twitter.com/michaelrwoods

http://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-...ng-non-payment

Moneybags · #**5033** Posted **Nov 2, 2014, 6:56 PM**

Not sure if it's been posted here but more of the 'notional/unofficial' retail labelled in the early Trinity map may be coming true. Sunset Grill now lists a Lansdowne with a 2015 opening, and it looks like their previously planned Stittsville location has not materialized.

Map: http://www.cbc.ca/ottawa/blogs/cityh..._PARK_Plan.jpg
Sunset Grill Coming Soon link: http://www.sunsetgrill.ca/Stores-ComingSoon.html

citydwlr · #**5034** Posted **Nov 5, 2014, 12:26 AM**

According to Twitter, Milestones is now open:

Quote:

And we're open for business! #Milestones51 @MilestonesCa #Ottawa #Lansdowne

[Source]

*********

Also, the City seems to be looking for someone to hold a pay-per-entry event during the 2015 Winterlude festivities:

Quote:

City is looking for a company to deliver "fee based Amusement and Entertainment Services" during Winterlude at Lansdowne Park in 2015.

[Source]

wingman · #**5035** Posted **Nov 6, 2014, 12:09 AM**

Have to head to Lansdowne this Saturday (High School Football Finals). Could someone confirm if the parking garage is open? I assume it is. Is there a fee? Game is early so could just as easily park on a nearby street. Team is travelling by bus, so it is just us 'fans' that would have to walk.

Thanks

BlueJay · #**5036** Posted **Nov 6, 2014, 12:14 AM**

Yes the garage is open. It's $3 per half hour or $16 max if your out by 5pm. Anytime after 5pm, the maximum jumps up to $20.

Quote:

Originally Posted by wingman

Have to head to Lansdowne this Saturday (High School Football Finals). Could someone confirm if the parking garage is open? I assume it is. Is there a fee? Game is early so could just as easily park on a nearby street. Team is travelling by bus, so it is just us 'fans' that would have to walk.

Thanks