The Official Saint John, NB Project Thread

[PersonPlaceorThing]

There is an article in [here] about the Abbey St. Andrew Housing project:http://herenb.canadaeast.com/news/article/935987

Hopefully this succeeds.

[kwajo]

Originally Posted by PersonPlaceorThing

There is an article in [here] about the Abbey St. Andrew Housing project:http://herenb.canadaeast.com/news/article/935987

Hopefully this succeeds.

Four storeys? I thought it was supposed to be five (the upper two being setback). Has the project been downscaled due to the financing problems?

[PersonPlaceorThing]

Originally Posted by kwajo

Four storeys? I thought it was supposed to be five (the upper two being setback). Has the project been downscaled due to the financing problems?

The building design hasn't changed in about a year. The size did change due to some planning issues, but there are still around the same amount of units.

[Sherri]

Hey all you passionate, wondefully knowledgeable St. Johners (is that what we are to call you?)..

I'm from Ontario (blech) forcibly confined here for 30 years, and I want to escape. I'm really really loving everything I'm learning about St John - except the anti-progressive bent it is currently showing. (reminds me of home)

My husband and I are thinking of making the move, and I would like some advice. We are looking to make real estate our retirement plan so need to know if there are any opportunities in St John right now that you would personally go for?

There are several on MLS that we've thought about - believe me we've asked the realtors, but you just never know.. you know?

Please advise as to why the "brodie building" is so cheap in comparison to its neighbours, and to which streets (or boundaries) in uptown we should be paying attention to.

I'm spirited, lively, politically minded, smart, educated, an artist, and passionate - and I want to move there and give it my whole heart. I do not want to be raked over the coals. We've got some money behind us from straight up thrifty living and hard work..

if it isn't too much to ask, please let me know what sorts of businesses might go over, and where / where not to buy.

[Wrightguy0]

Originally Posted by JRocca

At the present time, most businesses have no choice but to target the day time population because there is not enough people living Uptown to support them at night[ other than "destination" businesses such as food and beverage business that draw from the entire region].

Which is why we need to attract more people to Uptown and make living there a safe, and interactive environment.

your condo project addresses the need for denser residential zones within the core, but the city also has a massive stock of historic properties that if properly restored would also be attractive to buyers and leasers, but of course that idea isn't as attractive to developers due to marginal gains and the fact that the costs of renovating and restoring a 108 year old building can balloon out of controll and the project can easily get derailed with delays, moreso than building new.

Now i think it's important that we all look to mixing the old and new into the city so that people see that we have an urban core worth moving too. the established services can attract more people, who will in turn attract more of the desired services, office, commercial, entertainment.

[Joe]

Heard rumors that the Long Wharf project will not proceed.

[PersonPlaceorThing]

From Twitter:

CBCNB CBC News has learned Irving Oil's parent company, Fort Reliance, has cancelled plans to build its new world HQ at Saint John's Long Wharf.

[Joe]

Well that's a blow. It was one of the cornerstones of waterfront developement.

[kwajo]

Yeah I got word this morning and then the press release arrived in my inbox about 20 minutes ago. It sucks for Uptown, but I always had issues with the odd placement of a campus-like headquarters in our urban core. Oh well, onward and upward

[PersonPlaceorThing]

Maybe this will allow us to build an Opera House at the Lantic Sugar site...

Seriously though, the Lantic Sugar site was part of the major waterfront plan, Long Wharf was just thrust into the spotlight by the IOL HQ proposal. If someone can make the case for cleaning the Sugar site, it could actually be a batter site for improving the uptown. A Lantic Sugar site development would surround the south end in positive, rather than further focus the economic hub at the north end of the peninsula.

[Joe]

Reading the wording of the press release, sounds similar to the announced cancellation of the refinery project. I guess why build when you have space in Brunswick Sq. office tower. I belive they occupy 5 or 6 floors now.

[PersonPlaceorThing]

I wonder if they need the cash and political capital this would cost in order to proceed with their new power transmission project.

[Joe]

I had heard this rumor almost a month ago, but thought only a rumor since they were going full steam ahead with the pilings. Have to agree with what you said on you're blogspot personplacething, what was the point in taking part in the Waterfront openhouse.

[Wolkenkratzerliebhab]

Iriving has cancelled their new long wharf head quarters, according to the CBC, stating that:

Irving Oil Ltd.'s parent company, Fort Reliance, has cancelled a plan to build its new world headquarters at Saint John's Long Wharf, CBC News has learned.

A news conference was expected Tuesday afternoon.

Irving Oil signed a memorandum of understanding with the Saint John Port Authority in June 2008 on a deal which would see the company construct a $30-million building in the Long Wharf area along the shore.

In November 2009, New Democratic Party MP Yvon Godin called on the family-owned company to halt construction until the project received full federal approval. The International Longshoremen's Association was also a vocal opponent of the development.

The union opposed the city's sale of the Lantic Sugar property, arguing that once Long Wharf was leased to Irving Oil there would be a lack of locations to increase port business, such as moorage for cruise ships."

Hopefully, the new high-rise originally planned will be built instead, which I much rather prefer anyway, even though the Long Wharf project was a world-class project.

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/new-brunswick/story/2010/02/02/nb-irving-oil-headquarters-1258.html

[mylesmalley]

Is this because they don't need the extra office space now that the second refinery has been shelved?

Regardless, this is a terrible shame. It wasn't the best use of land, but it was a classy looking building and would've made a great addition to uptown SJ.

[Joe]

Don't think this has to do with the refinery. They've needed office space for a while now. They were spread all over the city. Like I said in an earlier post, they occupy the most office space the Brunswick Sq. tower. They also want the nineteenth floor. This space has become available since Bell has moved most of it's offices to Halifax.

[kwajo]

Originally Posted by PersonPlaceorThing

Maybe this will allow us to build an Opera House at the Lantic Sugar site...

Seriously though, the Lantic Sugar site was part of the major waterfront plan, Long Wharf was just thrust into the spotlight by the IOL HQ proposal. If someone can make the case for cleaning the Sugar site, it could actually be a batter site for improving the uptown. A Lantic Sugar site development would surround the south end in positive, rather than further focus the economic hub at the north end of the peninsula.

That won't happen I'm afraid, there are other plans for the Lantic sugar site and the Lower Cove terminal, it won't be part of any sort of expansion of the South End community or an 'urban village' or anything like that.

[PersonPlaceorThing]

Originally Posted by kwajo

That won't happen I'm afraid, there are other plans for the Lantic sugar site and the Lower Cove terminal, it won't be part of any sort of expansion of the South End community or an 'urban village' or anything like that.

Assuming the agreement with IOL wasn't fumbled, it will still be up to the city how this is developed not the Port Authority.

We will have to decide, is expanding the Potash Terminal the right choice for the city in the long term?

Are there any plans on using any of this area for cruise related things?

[JRocca]

Originally Posted by Wrightguy0

Which is why we need to attract more people to Uptown and make living there a safe, and interactive environment.

your condo project addresses the need for denser residential zones within the core, but the city also has a massive stock of historic properties that if properly restored would also be attractive to buyers and leasers, but of course that idea isn't as attractive to developers due to marginal gains and the fact that the costs of renovating and restoring a 108 year old building can balloon out of controll and the project can easily get derailed with delays, moreso than building new.

Now i think it's important that we all look to mixing the old and new into the city so that people see that we have an urban core worth moving too. the established services can attract more people, who will in turn attract more of the desired services, office, commercial, entertainment.

I totally agree with you.
As you correctly point out, the challenge with living in our beautiful old buildings AT THIS TIME is the cost to renovate them. I would also add parking as a secondary challenge.
The cost to renovate our historic housing stock is higher-and in many cases much higher- than the cost of new costruction.So we need buyers that will pay more BECAUSE they are PASSIONATE about living in these beautiful properties.Secondly, we need buyers that will put up with the hastle of no parking.
It is extremely difficult to find many of these committed individuals that will do both when you can spend a lot less less and have parking-and you are only a 10 minute drive from whatever you love about Uptown.
Part of the solution would ber for the City to offer significant renovation grants rather than the token ones they have offered in the past.There is a sound business case for doing this unlike the business case for the genereous grants the City now offers for subdivisions.
The property taxes the City would receive from people moving into existing building[or infill projects like our Harbourfront] do not have any expenses associated with them.
Unlike in a new subdivision, the City would not have to spend part or all of the property taxes revenue on extending services,snow removal for the new streets,looking after new sidewalks,etc.Everything already exists Uptown.
So,the net effect is that the City offers grants to subdivion developers to induce them to generate new property tax revenue, the lion share of which the City will have to re spend to look after that subdivision and offers little to Uptown developers that could generate property tax revenue, 100% of whch could be used to reduce the cost of providing other sevices to residents of Saint John.

[JRocca]

Originally Posted by PersonPlaceorThing

Assuming the agreement with IOL wasn't fumbled, it will still be up to the city how this is developed not the Port Authority.

We will have to decide, is expanding the Potash Terminal the right choice for the city in the long term?

Are there any plans on using any of this area for cruise related things?

I don't know what the other options are besides port uses but I have said publicly before that the development of this site for retail/commercial/residential is not in the cards even if you didn't have to take into consideration the astronomical site remediation costs.
Do you want to pay $300K+ to live in a condo next to a 24hr potash operation?
Do you want to open a retail operation where there are no other retailers around?
And do you think that office tenants would pay you big rent to be in the South end by the Potash terminal rather than in the Aliant tower for half the rent?
The only thing the Lantic Sugar site has is a spectacular water view.But that has only value IF the site is competitive in every other respect.