Ontario Highways

[sonysnob]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

By the way, are the new HOV lanes on 404 opened to traffic yet? Or does MTO wanna finish the portion between Highway 7 and Major McKenzie Drive first then open everything together?

The HOT lane expansion from Highway 7 to Stouffville Road will open as one project. Without looking it up I think that the timeline for the new lanes opening to traffic is either 2021 or 2022. I think it’s 2022, but I’m not 100% certain from memory.

[Dengler Avenue]

https://twitter.com/opp_hsd/status/1...363703296?s=21

110 km/h speed limit pilot project in effect today! I wonder if cops will for real ticket people for 20 km/h over now though.

[wave46]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

https://twitter.com/opp_hsd/status/1...363703296?s=21

110 km/h speed limit pilot project in effect today! I wonder if cops will for real ticket people for 20 km/h over now though.

I'm surprised they chose the QEW between Saint Catharines and Hamilton for part of the pilot. It's a fairly busy stretch - most places tend to keep lower limits in place for high-volume highways.

The 417 to Montreal and 402 to Sarnia I get - they're pretty rural stretches.

I would have added the 400 north of Barrie, the 416 and the 401 east of Kingston as candidates too.

I have no idea how zealous the police will be about enforcing this - generally places with higher speed limits tend of frown more seriously on speeding (like in Europe), whereas places with artificially low limits (defined as less than the speed of median traffic) tend to be more lenient.

[Dengler Avenue]

Originally Posted by wave46

I'm surprised they chose the QEW between Saint Catharines and Hamilton for part of the pilot. It's a fairly busy stretch - most places tend to keep lower limits in place for high-volume highways.

The 417 to Montreal and 402 to Sarnia I get - they're pretty rural stretches.

I would have added the 400 north of Barrie, the 416 and the 401 east of Kingston as candidates too.

I have no idea how zealous the police will be about enforcing this - generally places with higher speed limits tend of frown more seriously on speeding (like in Europe), whereas places with artificially low limits (defined as less than the speed of median traffic) tend to be more lenient.

From an experimental point of view, it makes sense. Pick a lightly travelled one, then a medium-volume one, then a high-volume one, and see where the 110 km/h speed limit is truly appropriate.

My prediction is that it will only work well on 417 between OTT and MTL, then that MTO will raise the speed limit on 416.

IMO the speed limit on 401 should never be above 100 km/h because it’s busy through and through. Even the section from Highway 416 to Quebec sees a high amount of truck traffic. But it’s a different story if MTO’s okay with trucks going 110 km/h outside of Northern Ontario.

As for 400, as I mentioned in swimmer_spe’s thread, 110 km/h isn’t appropriate unless and until MTO constructs EDR between Exits 162 and 177. The newly twinned section of 69 also seems to lack EDR between Estaire and Alban.

[wave46]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

From an experimental point of view, it makes sense. Pick a lightly travelled one, then a medium-volume one, then a high-volume one, and see where the 110 km/h speed limit is truly appropriate.

That makes sense.

I'm curious why you think an EDR is mandatory for a higher limit. I mostly view the increased limit as a tacit acknowledgement that the current limit is too low for the highway, given the speed the traffic flows at.

[Dengler Avenue]

That's a good question, now that I come to think of it.

Part of it is (weakly) anecdotal. In Nova Scotia, where TCH is a 4-lane divided freeway, the speed limit is usually 110 km/h (except through New Glasgow, but that's because it's skimming through a town). Oddly enough, through the Isthmus, the speed limit is only 100 km/h while the highway's technically in the middle of nowhere. I think that's because there's no reasonable EDR. (There's one on the north side that leads to Port Elgin, N.B., but apparently that's more or less a goat path.)

Part of me is also scared that higher speed limit can actually lead to higher rate of collision (at least the more severe ones). In that case, the highway can be more prone to closure, in which case, we need a backup route (aka EDR).

Edit: I’m aware of B.C. as a counterexample, but I think some parts just don’t support any speed limit higher than 100 km/h, i.e. TCH between Chilliwack and Hope and most stretch of Coquihalla Pass. In North America, one might as well set the speed limit and expect people to go 20~25 km/h over.

[Dengler Avenue]

https://urbantoronto.ca/forum/thread...206190&slide=0

From the looks of it, MTO intends to straighten 410 to meet the new toll road.

[Dengler Avenue]

https://www.gta-west.com/wp-content/...an_updated.pdf

more details

[tyeman200]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

https://twitter.com/opp_hsd/status/1...363703296?s=21

110 km/h speed limit pilot project in effect today! I wonder if cops will for real ticket people for 20 km/h over now though.

Nope, I went 135 km/h past an OPP today on the 402 and they didn't stop me. I think they'll only stop you for doing 140 or more.

[Dengler Avenue]

Did trucks in the left lane give you a hard time? I’m curious to know (for 402 particularly).

[Dengler Avenue]

https://www.stcatharinesstandard.ca/...r-speed-limit/

On QEW, on the other hand, “Knight said speeding charges ranged from driving 15 km over the limit — or 125 km/h — to at least 55 km over.”.

For once, OPP GTA is stricter than OPP West.

[tyeman200]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

Did trucks in the left lane give you a hard time? I’m curious to know (for 402 particularly).

No, it was more of the entitled drivers who wanted to go 100 in the left lane that bothered me.

[Dengler Avenue]

Originally Posted by tyeman200

No, it was more of the entitled drivers who wanted to go 100 in the left lane that bothered me.

That’s true. Drivers in SWO are known for that. The cops are on their side too.

But it’s crazy to hear that OPP there didn’t bother you for 25 over. I always have the impression that OPP West are pretty strict (especially on the 401).

[Dengler Avenue]

Work to add HOV lanes on Highway 404 between 16th Avenue and Major MacKenzie Drive is in full swing. I wonder how the bridge over Beaver Creek will be expanded though.

[sonysnob]

^ The bridges over Beaver Creek won't be expanded. They are already wide enough, they were widened as part of the work to get the HOV lane as far as Highway 7. The bridges over the Rouge River (between 16th and Major Mack) will just be outright replaced with new structures.

[Dengler Avenue]

Originally Posted by sonysnob

^ The bridges over Beaver Creek won't be expanded. They are already wide enough, they were widened as part of the work to get the HOV lane as far as Highway 7. The bridges over the Rouge River (between 16th and Major Mack) will just be outright replaced with new structures.

Sorry I meant the latter (the one over Rouge River). That will require overnight closures then...?

[sonysnob]

I would assume that they'll be some overnight lane restrictions as part of the construction. I'd assume they'll build a new bridge in the median between the northbound and southbound structures, then they'll move either the northbound or southbound lanes over to demolish the existing bridge, extend the new bridge overtop of where the old bridge stood and then repeat for the other set of lanes.

[Dengler Avenue]

Originally Posted by sonysnob

I would assume that they'll be some overnight lane restrictions as part of the construction. I'd assume they'll build a new bridge in the median between the northbound and southbound structures, then they'll move either the northbound or southbound lanes over to demolish the existing bridge, extend the new bridge overtop of where the old bridge stood and then repeat for the other set of lanes.

Fair enough. I think two of the 401 overpasses around Milton are replaced likewise too.

=========
https://www.caledonenterprise.com/ne...incial-report/

Why isn’t the GTA West Corridor going to Guelph anymore? Environmental big no-no? RER to Kitchener isn’t coming any time soon, and Highway 7 isn’t exactly a pleasant drive between Guelph and GTA either. The few times I used it as an EDR to 401, I almost always ended up adding half an hour to the drive.

[sonysnob]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

Fair enough. I think two of the 401 overpasses around Milton are replaced likewise too.

That's pretty much the standard way most overpasses are replaced to be honest. In lower traffic situations, lanes can be closed, part of the bridge can be demolished and subsequently be replaced.

In situations with higher traffic levels, you can narrow lanes a little bit, and reduce the shoulder width to demolish part of the bridge first, but otherwise you pretty much just have to build a new bridge beside the old one.

That's why bridge replacement projects and major rehabilitation work is so often tied to highway expansion projects. You have to move the traffic off of the old bridge to repair or replace, so you might as well do that as part of the work to expand the highway anyways.

[Dengler Avenue]

Originally Posted by sonysnob

That's pretty much the standard way most overpasses are replaced to be honest. In lower traffic situations, lanes can be closed, part of the bridge can be demolished and subsequently be replaced.

In situations with higher traffic levels, you can narrow lanes a little bit, and reduce the shoulder width to demolish part of the bridge first, but otherwise you pretty much just have to build a new bridge beside the old one.

That's why bridge replacement projects and major rehabilitation work is so often tied to highway expansion projects. You have to move the traffic off of the old bridge to repair or replace, so you might as well do that as part of the work to expand the highway anyways.

No wonder people in Vancity got up in their arms about the so-called Patullo Bridge “replacement”. (Then again, road projects there are pretty stupid.)

Yea at first I thought this was either a thing out of convenience or something political. (^ Things that I learned from online forums in general)

What about the GTA West though? Why not all the way to Guelph? That’ll take pressure off the 401. At least do something with Highway 7 in the meantime before RER Kitchener comes into full force.