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  #441  
Old Posted Aug 2, 2019, 9:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Wpg_Guy View Post
Bad news BMO vacating their historic flagship building at Portage and Main. They will be moving to 201 Portage in the spring. That’s a very large the prominent building to be left vacant at portage and Main hopefully a new use is found soon.







We have banked in that hall for 90 years...

I’m in absolute shock at an announcement like that!
     
     
  #442  
Old Posted Aug 2, 2019, 10:34 PM
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That is flat out horrible news. Just horrendous.
     
     
  #443  
Old Posted Aug 2, 2019, 10:41 PM
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That's one of those things that you think will never happen, no matter how many other bad things do -- like GWL leaving the city (obviously smaller than that, but still a real downer).

The corresponding BMO building in Toronto, which is nowhere near as nice, is now the Hockey Hall of Fame. I can't actually think of any 100+ year old active bank branches in Toronto - certainly not downtown.
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  #444  
Old Posted Aug 2, 2019, 10:44 PM
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I guess they're sitting on the least important corner of P&M and not getting much P&M business. So will the RBC signage at 201 Portage be replaced with BMO signage?
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  #445  
Old Posted Aug 3, 2019, 12:03 AM
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Abandoning this jewel is a travesty and could cost the BMO some fussiness.
This is the most beautiful Low-rise edifice ion the city . The former Bank of N Scotia next IMO..It will be nice to see what can be done and re purpose this magnificent structure but too large for a restaurant or night club, too small for a hotel? Any ideas????

Last edited by BAKGUY; Aug 3, 2019 at 12:04 AM. Reason: typo
     
     
  #446  
Old Posted Aug 3, 2019, 12:08 AM
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Were there reasons given for the relocation?
     
     
  #447  
Old Posted Aug 3, 2019, 12:10 AM
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Bank of Montreal

I'm hoping this news isn't true. I've been looking online for any kind of news report about this and can't find anything. Was there some kind of public announcement made?

This building is an absolute treasure!
     
     
  #448  
Old Posted Aug 3, 2019, 12:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Garry9600 View Post
I'm hoping this news isn't true. I've been looking online for any kind of news report about this and can't find anything. Was there some kind of public announcement made?

This building is an absolute treasure!
This so far is all that has been released, there will be an information session held by BMO on Sept 17th.

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  #449  
Old Posted Aug 3, 2019, 12:31 AM
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Originally Posted by borkborkbork View Post
looks like ottawa is doing its utmost to fuck up the sale of portage place:

https://globalnews.ca/news/5712955/f...llion-penalty/
I wish they would just keep their damn noses out of it.
     
     
  #450  
Old Posted Aug 3, 2019, 12:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Wigglez View Post
Oh, they've already been there. The day it was announced they got some pathetic fool from the area to say that the "community" wasn't consulted and to "remember who's land you are on"

No no... seriously, someone actually said this, read it for yourself: https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/manit...tage-1.5216406

"You all made the public library inaccessible. Don't do that with Portage Place mall. Remember whose land you are on."
- Community worker Jenna Wirch

It goes on to have gems like this:

Brunelli told councillors "this is public land, Indigenous land, stolen land," and asked the councillors why revenue from the sale "floated over to the Forks?"


Exactly how long can this kind of attitude go on? How long will the government let this attitude go on? And how long will the Canadian people, with which these people have decided to separate themselves from and feel superior to, let this attitude go on.

Incoming weekly blockades of Portage ave to protect this "sacred food court"

True story - I used to support (financially and through my time) an inner city group that supported (mainly) Indigenous youth. After I read that I cut all contact with that group. They wont see another dime from me unless its forced through my taxes.
This is beyond the point of ridiculous. Soon you won't be able to do anything without the GD feds becoming involved.
     
     
  #451  
Old Posted Aug 3, 2019, 12:56 AM
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the federal government have a legal obligation. theyve been run through the mud loosing 10's of millions in court battles on land claims over the years and this is one of those ones that could get nasty quik
     
     
  #452  
Old Posted Aug 3, 2019, 1:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Wpg_Guy View Post
This so far is all that has been released, there will be an information session held by BMO on Sept 17th.
They didn’t move into the Portage and Main branch in 1910. They should read the front of their own building.
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  #453  
Old Posted Aug 3, 2019, 2:04 AM
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Re: BMO move. I seriously doubt and incredible building like the Bank of Montreal building will be left empty for long. In fact, this could be a good move for opening P & M. A new tenant may demand some actual street level pedestrian access to make utilizing the building a viable option.
     
     
  #454  
Old Posted Aug 3, 2019, 2:12 AM
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This is what happens when you barricade off a building and make it almost impossible to get into. All of the other issues about building mechanics just get amplified. I asked Jeff Browaty ( who was firmly against opening Portage and Main) what he would do if BMO moved out. He said that will never happen.... Idiot!
     
     
  #455  
Old Posted Aug 3, 2019, 2:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eman View Post
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...rstowernyc.JPG

Sir Norman Foster's Hearst Tower. A fantastic way to save a limestone gem like the Bay.
That is my fantasy for the Curry Building!
     
     
  #456  
Old Posted Aug 3, 2019, 3:07 AM
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Originally Posted by davequanbury View Post
Just thought it would be good to point out that Portage Place was funded and built as part of the Core Area Initiative. The purpose of the CAI had to do with raising people out of poverty and encouraging investment downtown. A lot of people criticized the tri-level agreement because the majority of the cash went towards building PP and the Forks, community groups and poverty activist groups felt that more of the money should have gone to 'the people.'

I was not old enough then, nor have I delved into researching the CAI to any extent that would allow me to pass judgement. However, in the context of that history, the mall kind of is somewhat of a community centre because tax money paid for it, and because it was built under the banner of CAI.

This is not the story of some pull-up-your-bootstraps tycoon building a mall and then the loser poor people acting like its their right to congregate there, this is a story of 3 levels of government investing in downtown Winnipeg under the auspices of improving the lives of poor residents.

I can sympathize with yours and other people's frustration about Winnipeg's social problems, yeah, we can be a bit of a shit-hole town sometimes. But I like to take the side of the poor, and when I read that "they should get a community centre built" it's only fair I point out that it takes all day to be poor and it is the wealthy amongst us that have the time and resources to make governments work in our favor. Let's not suggest that poor people can make the system work for them to that degree, they need folks keeping their interests in mind I believe.
This is an excellent point. The purpose of the Core Area Initiative was to revitalize downtown Winnipeg not so it would be cool for suburbanites but that it would recover for the sake of its then residents. But it quickly went off the rails. If they had followed a Jane Jacobs model, they would have simply helped the existing property owners and listened to the residents to find out what they needed. Instead, like everybody in the 1980s, they went for the quick fix. A suburban shopping mall to revitalize the north side of Portage, just like Eaton Centre in Toronto.

What needs to be remembered is that Main Street has also radically changed in the past 30 years. When I was a kid in the 1970s, there was pretty strict segregation in Winnipeg. The poor and indigenous population had the Main Street strip, with its bars, hotels, pool halls, cafes, stores, theaters. Portage was middle class and white. That broke down in the 1990s, not because of more enlightened social attitudes but because of bad urban planning. Main Street was destroyed as a viable neighborhood and where else but Portage Place could Core Area residents without cars congregate out of the elements?

Portage Place now serves an important social function. Its stakeholders should be consulted. But they won't be.
     
     
  #457  
Old Posted Aug 3, 2019, 6:11 AM
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^ what does ‘stakeholder’ consultation look like? We are talking about people who sit in the food court of a private shopping mall. Did we do stakeholder consultation to let the HMV close? If consultation ends up finding that people want to sit in a food court then what? You stop a sale and tell the current owner they can never sell their property unless the food court remains unchanged? I really don’t understand what consultation means in this situation. It is a privately owned building. They aren’t stake holders. They are shoppers.

If they need public space. We need to build public space. Holding a shopping mall hostage is not the answer.
     
     
  #458  
Old Posted Aug 3, 2019, 6:15 AM
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The only other solution is the government buys it and runs it as a 400,000 square foot not for profit community centre.
     
     
  #459  
Old Posted Aug 3, 2019, 6:43 AM
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Originally Posted by Xtoval View Post
This is an excellent point. The purpose of the Core Area Initiative was to revitalize downtown Winnipeg not so it would be cool for suburbanites but that it would recover for the sake of its then residents. But it quickly went off the rails. If they had followed a Jane Jacobs model, they would have simply helped the existing property owners and listened to the residents to find out what they needed. Instead, like everybody in the 1980s, they went for the quick fix. A suburban shopping mall to revitalize the north side of Portage, just like Eaton Centre in Toronto.

What needs to be remembered is that Main Street has also radically changed in the past 30 years. When I was a kid in the 1970s, there was pretty strict segregation in Winnipeg. The poor and indigenous population had the Main Street strip, with its bars, hotels, pool halls, cafes, stores, theaters. Portage was middle class and white. That broke down in the 1990s, not because of more enlightened social attitudes but because of bad urban planning. Main Street was destroyed as a viable neighborhood and where else but Portage Place could Core Area residents without cars congregate out of the elements?

Portage Place now serves an important social function. Its stakeholders should be consulted. But they won't be.
Well, let me fill you in...The agreement was only for 30 some years..A community centre it is not. Nor can it be one.
You can plainly see whatever is happening there now is not working. Going private means that owner get to call the shots whether you or I like it or not. Who would spend another $230 million to add residential and possibly hotel to an unsafe entity? How can one expect people to live in a fairly upscale new market priced residential tower with a unsafe mall full or issues like drug selling etc? gangs? Lets be real..Without this proposal, it stays the same ot gets worse. This is a chance to rise from the ashes and renovate, new name and not just put lipstick on the pig, unless its Miss Piggy of course. lol

Last edited by BAKGUY; Aug 3, 2019 at 6:54 AM.
     
     
  #460  
Old Posted Aug 3, 2019, 8:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xtoval View Post
This is an excellent point. The purpose of the Core Area Initiative was to revitalize downtown Winnipeg not so it would be cool for suburbanites but that it would recover for the sake of its then residents. But it quickly went off the rails. If they had followed a Jane Jacobs model, they would have simply helped the existing property owners and listened to the residents to find out what they needed. Instead, like everybody in the 1980s, they went for the quick fix. A suburban shopping mall to revitalize the north side of Portage, just like Eaton Centre in Toronto.

What needs to be remembered is that Main Street has also radically changed in the past 30 years. When I was a kid in the 1970s, there was pretty strict segregation in Winnipeg. The poor and indigenous population had the Main Street strip, with its bars, hotels, pool halls, cafes, stores, theaters. Portage was middle class and white. That broke down in the 1990s, not because of more enlightened social attitudes but because of bad urban planning. Main Street was destroyed as a viable neighborhood and where else but Portage Place could Core Area residents without cars congregate out of the elements?

Portage Place now serves an important social function. Its stakeholders should be consulted. But they won't be.
I'm %100 with TV on this. It's not nor has it ever been a community property and as it's privately owned it never should be.

If there was nowhere else to go then fine, maybe entertain the idea but that's not the case. People frequenting the mall aren't stakeholders any more than they would be at Polo Park or St. Vital Center and, frankly, I find the suggestion ridiculous. We're still not communists last I checked.

Also, the reason for the "breakdown" in segregation has to do with the city's fortunes moreso than anything else. Not to mention the innumerable publicly-funded initiatives to clean up North Main. As another child of the 70's, I recall West Broadway being every bit as bad as the worst area in the city (well, actually, it was the worst for quite a while) and gentrification has gone a long way to making the area into something desirable. North Main wasn't a beacon for Natives and the destitute because it had so much they wanted out of a city: It was that way because it was allowed to deteriorate and turn into a slum. Is that how we want to attract people to Winnipeg? "Come for the crime, stay for the cesspool!"?
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