Halifax Stadium Discussion

[Empire]

Originally Posted by BravoZulu

Here is an idea I have been thinking about for a while, not sure if it has been mentioned before so if it has please forgive me.

Consider a stadium development (Shannon park or elsewhere) which includes condo towers around the field. Some of them (the inward facing ones) would have excellent views of games, concerts etc. The outward facing ones would have water views if located in Shannon park, but perhaps the roof could allow these poor owners to still see the game from their home.

If the city was the controlling developper (by financing the project) surely they could fund a stadium through the profits from the condo sales. I know some wouldn't want to live near a sports stadium, and that's fine, there are tons of condos in Clayton Park, but I for one would be quite happy to purchase a condo with a balcony on the 50 yard line (kind of like expensive skyboxes). I'd probably still purchase tickets to the games for a more intimate experience but still seems like a way to raise the required funds for a stadium from people who choose to pay for it. The city would be on the hook for the initial financing but in the end it should be close to a zero cost and then property taxes would come in from the homeowners.

Thoughts?

I'm definitely not a finance major or a developper so I'm interested to hear what you guys think, just seems win-win to me, more residents in an underdevelopped location, justification for a ferry crossing and quasi free stadium.

BZ

BZ, now you are thinking outside the box. Please go to post #75. The following would also apply to Shannon Park of course.

Perhaps the developers at DC would be interested in modifing their residential plans for DC north? (the Quarry). If a condo development were to incorporate a stadium then costs could be reduced dramitically for the stadium superstructure. Perhaps HRM could help by allowing more height for the Stadium Suites Condos so it would be even more feasible. These suites would not be for everyone but I think they would have great market appeal for a specific segment. There could be additional parking under the field and of course across the field from the residential component would be the Stadium Suites Hotel.

[cormiermax]

So is this dead or what? I kind of lost track of what's going on, if they postpone this I think we can all agree the will of government to go ahead with a stadium in the near future will be diminished.

[BravoZulu]

Originally Posted by Empire

BZ, now you are thinking outside the box. Please go to post #75. The following would also apply to Shannon Park of course.

Haha sorry Empire....you know what they say though, great minds think alike, mine just thinks a little slower (apparently about 224 pages worth of posts slower

[Jstaleness]

From News95.7 Twitter feed.

Council Votes:

23-0 say no thanks to FIFA

14-9 to add stadium project to future capital plan.

17-6 to explore shannon park as option for future site.

[q12]

Originally Posted by Jstaleness

From News95.7 Twitter feed.

Council Votes:

23-0 say no thanks to FIFA

14-9 to add stadium project to future capital plan.

17-6 to explore shannon park as option for future site.

Who are the 9 who said no to adding it to the future capital plan? I say we start a campaign to make sure these Councillors never get elected again.


Titanic:

[fenwick16]

Here are the recommendations in the staff report (http://www.halifax.ca/council/agendasc/documents/120327ca1011.pdf):
"It is recommended that Halifax Regional Council:
1. Not proceed to Stadium Analysis Phase 3 - Construction, at this time;
2. Direct the Mayor, on behalf of Halifax Regional Municipality, to thank the Canadian Soccer Association for their ongoing interest in Halifax Regional Municipality as a candidate and potential host city, and to notify the CSA of Council's decision to decline further discussions related to the 2014 and 2015 FIFA Women's World Cup events;
3. Approve the Phase 2 Stadium Analysis report as the basis of the requirement for a stadium and include the project on the Capital Plan as a future consideration; and
4. Identify Shannon Park as the preferred site for the future Multi-use Stadium project, and direct staff to work with Canada Lands Company for the future siting of a recreation/sport facility campus (up to 40 acres)."

I wonder when staff will start working with Canada Lands Company? I hope that they will move as quickly as possible and purchase the necessary land. It would be great to see it happen within the next year and not just sometime in the future.

Now would be a good time to start a building fund. Then there will be money available for land acquisition in the near future.

[Keith P.]

Originally Posted by q12

Who are the 9 who said no to adding it to the future capital plan? I say we start a campaign to make sure these Councillors never get elected again.

I wasn't watching, but feel pretty confident saying two of them are Watts and Barkhouse. NDPers don't like stadiums.

[Empire]

Now is the time for HRM to start the Stadium Fund that is 28 years overdue:

The public can start it by sending Peter Kelly a cheque for the amount they wish to donate, whether it be $5 or $5,000.

The Public

1. Make the cheque out to [HRM Overdue Stadium Fund] with the actual amount
e.g. ($50.00)
2. Write --------VOID-------- across the cheque.
3. Write on the cheque "I will send this amount to the HRM Stadium Fund when it is established".
4. Encourage as many people as possible to do the same.


Instructions for the Prov. Gov.

Allow a tax deduction for the stadium donation.


The Fund - HRM:

- Establish a good website.
- Show a running total of the fund.
- Register with loto corp. and have every 100th donator win back double their donation. The city shall match the amount and put it in the fund so no money is lost.


Local musicians:

Have a fundraising concert with some big name local artists.

[q12]

We are gonna have to boot out the NDP and Dexter who fail to see the benefit of a stadium. Apparently Quebec and Manitoba don't have the same problem.

Dexter will probably tell us we can have a stadium as long as we don't mind paying 20% HST.

We are taxed to death in Nova Scotia and have nothing to show for it.

[beyeas]

Originally Posted by q12

We are gonna have to boot out the NDP and Dexter who fail to see the benefit of a stadium. Apparently Quebec and Manitoba don't have the same problem.

Dexter will probably tell us we can have a stadium as long as we don't mind paying 20% HST.

We are taxed to death in Nova Scotia and have nothing to show for it.

I would also like a clear explanation as to why the federal government gave money to Moncton for a stadium that was to be used for an international event, but said (through its minister of sport) that it would not give funding to Halifax for a stadium to be used for the FIFA event.

[q12]

Election speculation swirls in advance of N.S. throne speech
Michael MacDonald , The Canadian Press
Date: Wednesday Mar. 28, 2012 2:50 PM ET
http://atlantic.ctv.ca/servlet/an/local/...speech_120328/20120328/?hub=AtlanticHome

Baillie said the government has collected an extra $686 million in HST revenue since the tax was increased.

"That's why I think it's so laughable that they're going to try to bring in a modest tax cut to compare to that."

McNeil said the Liberal party plans to push Dexter to do something about rising electricity and gasoline prices in the upcoming session. The HST will also figure prominently, he said.

"The HST increase takes a million dollars a day out of the pockets of Nova Scotians," McNeil said. "Some token tax cut -- pennies a day given back -- is really not going to make a lot of difference to Nova Scotians."

That money reaped from HST hike back in 2010 that Nova Scotians will not forget come election time could have been used to fund a stadium.

[RyeJay]

Originally Posted by beyeas

I would also like a clear explanation as to why the federal government gave money to Moncton for a stadium that was to be used for an international event, but said (through its minister of sport) that it would not give funding to Halifax for a stadium to be used for the FIFA event.

Moncton built its stadium years ago, which was part of past budgets that were more flexible -- so your comparison isn't a fair one at all.

Also, Moncton recently reqested federal funding for a new downtown arena/events centre -- and the feds said no to them. Since Halifax was, at that time, still seeking a stadium despite the lack of funding commitments from both the federal and provincial governments, The Times&Transcript began running uninformed articles asking why Halifax was getting special treatment for its stadium when the feds just said no to Moncton.

I doubt anyone in Harper's court...erm, government.. is going to answer your question. He's too busy buying F- 35s and not investing in health care and education.

[someone123]

Originally Posted by q12

We are gonna have to boot out the NDP and Dexter who fail to see the benefit of a stadium. Apparently Quebec and Manitoba don't have the same problem.

It's a complicated issue. I think that there is a good case for Halifax to build a new stadium, but the timing for FIFA wasn't very good and the stadium planning wasn't going well. It's important to be very careful about sports events because many cities get burned hosting them and building infrastructure.

In Quebec, Montreal spent far too much on a questionable stadium and now Quebec City is going to sink hundreds of millions into an arena that may or may not result in an NHL team. Even if it does, I am not sure it's a good use of taxpayer dollars.

At this point I think the pro-stadium crowd should regroup and then set their sites on some sports event bid that is a few years out.

[someone123]

Originally Posted by RyeJay

Also, Moncton recently reqested federal funding for a new downtown arena/events centre -- and the feds said no to them. Since Halifax was, at that time, still seeking a stadium despite the lack of funding commitments from both the federal and provincial governments, The Times&Transcript began running uninformed articles asking why Halifax was getting special treatment for its stadium when the feds just said no to Moncton.

Like I said, is a stadium even a good investment for the federal government? Halifax and many other cities are falling behind rapidly when it comes to much more important infrastructure like transit.

I would hate to see Canada become like the US, where mid-sized cities are falling over themselves to scrounge up hundreds of millions for private, for-profit sports teams. Sacramento just sold off their parking revenue to a private company so they could build an arena. It's insane.

[fenwick16]

I really get frustrated reading the Halifax-area media columns. Today there was a story by Chris Cochrane giving his synopsis of the end of the latest stadium debate.

It is interesting (to me) how in many big and small cities a decision will be made to go ahead with a stadium (or other public venue) and then leaders will spend the necessary time and effort to see it through to completion (even if it takes several years). However, once again the talk in Halifax is about the failure of the stadium idea.

In my opinion the stadium debate has just begun, it isn't over. People just have to keep contacting political leaders and encourage them to continue with what they agreed on - to negotiate the purchase of Shannon Park for a stadium.

Here is the Chronicle Herald story - http://thechronicleherald.ca/sports/78567-halifax-stadium-idea-seemed-doomed-fail-start.

Halifax stadium idea seemed doomed to fail from the start
March 29, 2012 - 4:23am By CHRIS COCHRANE Sports Columnist


OK, the great Halifax stadium debate is once again officially over.

Halifax regional council ensured on Tuesday that this chapter is finished by voting an overwhelming 22-1 against meeting FIFA’s deadline for a commitment to build a stadium in time for the 2015 Women’s World Cup.

This isn’t the first time the stadium concept has been slapped down.

In 1983, after the CFL had awarded Halifax a conditional franchise, a stadium proposed for Dartmouth fell through when federal funding didn’t materialize.

Prospects for a stadium didn’t brighten again for two decades until one became a featured part of the bid for the 2014 Commonwealth Games. But the Games bid, including the stadium, was abandoned in 2007 after an unhappy public got wind of the inflated cost.

This most recent attempt to get a stadium built, at a projected cost of $57 million, was the weakest yet. At least in 1983 and 2007, identifiable groups behind the efforts sincerely wanted Halifax to have a stadium. This time, it seemed too many people were simply going through the motions. Few expected the project would come to fruition.
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[thurmas]

Sorry boys but if your politicians are this stupid and cheap for 30 years now Moncton or someone else will get a cfl team now too bad what a shame.

[c-way-dude]

An article of Halifax's quest for a stadium.
www.tsn.ca/columnists/alex_walling/?id=392634

[worldlyhaligonian]

Whatever, when all these clowns are gone from council and more development occurs we will get a much better stadium than the recent proposals.

I'd actually be in favour of Moncton getting a team because maybe the team in Halifax would be called Halifax or NS something rather than lumping us in with a maritime franchise.

[worldlyhaligonian]

Originally Posted by thurmas

Sorry boys but if your politicians are this stupid and cheap for 30 years now Moncton or someone else will get a cfl team now too bad what a shame.

It sucks, but Halifax is growing rapidly right now. I'm sure things will be much different in 10 years.

[fenwick16]

Originally Posted by C_Boy

I guess I should have posted this here instead...


City of Moncton identifies potential site for downtown entertainment centre

News 91.9


The City of Moncton has entered into an agreement with the option to purchase the Highfield Square Shopping Centre site , and has identified it as the preferred site for a proposed downtown multi purpose sports and entertainment centre. This option agreement would allow the City to purchase the property for $6 million dollars.

This is old news from a month ago (March 20, 2012) which was posted in a Moncton thread - http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=198260 .

Although not directly related to the Halifax Stadium discussion, it is the type of news that is required in the Halifax area (for example: an option to buy Shannon Park land for a future stadium) to keep people believing that a stadium is on the horizon in the not too distant future.

The goal of obtaining an option to buy 40 acres of Shannon Park land for a stadium was approved by HRM Council on March 27th, 2012. I hope that we will hear of progress in the next couple of months (if not, then supporters need to contact elected representatives to request information).