Mobile Development Thread

[Bogue]

The empty properties that are more architecturally interesting often are overpriced relative to their current state. When they're not there's another issue, usually... sometimes there are clouds on the property title, liens, or there's an issue with the physical structure where it can appear nice outside but be degraded inside or in its foundation. Sometimes, though, they're just held onto by idiots who don't care about the property.

Most of those empty neighborhoods are full of houses which aren't architecturally worthwhile to keep. Some would be advantageous to see bulldozed and removed. Replacing an under-sized & uninteresting '60's ranch with a replica craftsman (or similar) would be better for the long-term prospects of those neighborhoods and mesh better w/ the houses in midtown.

[Bogue]

I don't know that Mobile has shown a real need for a new arena yet. There have been numerous concerts in the area and they've almost all tanked due to low attendance. Right now the Civic Center is largely unused & is a waste of money (other than the theatre part). I wouldn't mind them planning to eventually move the Baybears, Sr. Bowl, & USAFootball into a nice multipurpose outdoor facility in Midtown/downtown in the future (like 10-15 years) b/c that would get some use most of the year. As it is, though, there's no need for such a large structure... esp. not an enclosed one.

[BuenaVista]

Originally Posted by phoenixboi08

I did hear that the owners were considering converting them into cheap "condos," but I'm not surprised it didn't happen...More than likely, we'll either see a hotel, or condos, or maybe some office space....

Too bad we don't still have THIS...

The architect was Rudolf Benz. The statue of Marianne and the flanking lions on the pediment to the left of the photo are now at the Musuem of Mobile. The ionic column capitals and the pediment of porch are in Mobile Bay at Arlington Point, used as rip rap. Benz also designed the Three Sister's building at Dauphin and Royal. He is buried at Magnolia Cemetery

[BuenaVista]

Originally Posted by phoenixboi08

I think once we start to see people flocking back to the areas around Government and Dauphin St., we'll start to see the residential "perks" erected in DT. Until then, I think most development will be infrastructure, and attractions (like the Mardi Gras Park and the Maritime Museum).

Curious, why are so many of neighborhoods around DT so empty? I see so many neglected houses around Gvmt and Dauphin St. (etc). And all of them are great houses...what happened?

The entire Oakleigh Garden District Area was much like the empty neighborhoods you describe, 40 years ago. It takes courageous individuals to come in and reclaim the neighborhood, house by house.

[TheMobilian]

Originally Posted by Bogue

I think the orange is probably supposed to be representative of brick as the rest of the hotel (in the background) is also in the same color. I think the orange was chosen over a more accurate color to highlight the new building in newsprint. Personally, I like it as I think it sort of reflects the building across the street and maybe that'll help Govt. Plaza not stick out like a sore thumb. Might be asking too much of a single building though.

I think the flyway is just to connect to the parking deck. Isn't there one across the street on that side?

I agree w/ Phoenix that that pink hotel on the Causeway is hideous. Anyone heard anything about that lately? I know it's hard to sell the property b/c of insurance stuff, but you'd think that someone would've figured out something to do w/ it in all this time that it's sat empty.

Actually the Pink Hotel is not part of Mobile,(wasn't sure if anyone knew that or not) its past the county line
so we would have to ask Baldwin Cnty what the deal is with that

[phoenixboi08]

Originally Posted by TheMobilian

Actually the Pink Hotel is not part of Mobile,(wasn't sure if anyone knew that or not) its past the county line
so we would have to ask Baldwin Cnty what the deal is with that

No, not that one. The one adjacent to the Civic Center. Behind the Holiday Inn...

[TheMobilian]

Originally Posted by phoenixboi08

No, not that one. The one adjacent to the Civic Center. Behind the Holiday Inn...

Thank you PhoenixBoi for clearing that up for me
i was confused

I know which one now the Pink Hotel they were talking about turning into cheap condos
is that correct?

[BlessedMobile]

Originally Posted by TheMobilian

Thank you PhoenixBoi for clearing that up for me
i was confused

I know which one now the Pink Hotel they were talking about turning into cheap condos
is that correct?

The hotel is the old downtown Ramada. It is more of a salmon color than pink but I see the point regarding color. The owner has backed off the condo idea as there weren't enough takers to make it happen. Something good can happen with the property but the current owner does not have the money.

[nimsjus]

Talking about that Ramada property had me thinking about how much the tunnel entry ramps really chop up that part of downtown. The New Plan for Old Mobile suggested eliminating the Water Street ramp, which would help this problem to soem extent. I think it would also be really beneficial to build over the tunnel entrance if possible as well. I know it is absurdly expensive and is a pipe dream in Mobile, but this type of project with I-85 in ATL and the big dig in boston on a much larger scale really helped create new patches of land that restored the original flow of those downtowns. It would be nice to walk straight from Government over to Ft Conder Village without going all the way down to Royal. Maybe even reconnect Monroe, Theatre and St Emmanuel in Ft. Conde Village to the city street grid. I think those two projects combined would help spur development in the tiny enclave of the Ft. Conde Village. It is just a little issolated from most of downtown by I-10. I think it will be even more important if the civic center property was redeveloped because Ft. Conde Village is so close to the Civic Center, but to walk from one to the other is really a hassel because of I-10 and all the exit ramps. Eliminating the ramps and maybe even building over the tunnel entry would creat lots of new land for development and make for much easier getting around that part of downtown. Maybe one day...

[Bayside]

Are you advocating removing Ft. Conde?

[nimsjus]

Originally Posted by Bayside

Are you advocating removing Ft. Conde?

No Im not saying to remove Ft Conde. In Atlanta and other cities, people have essentially created new land and reconnected neighborhoods/pars of town by buring or building over sunken freeways. I was suggesting that it would be beneficial to ft conde viillage and downtown on general if mobile could do this at the entrance to the tunnels allowing ft conde and the village to be more connected to downtown . As it is now, ft conde and the village are a dead end culdesac at the end of south royal because of the I 10 tunnel approach and exit ramps. Removing the water st ramp and creating land over the tunnel entrance would create some new land for development and potentially allow us to reconnect the streets in ft conde village to the city grid again. The problem is projects like this on a bigger scale have been enormously expensive an would not be deemed necessary somewhere like mobile. I just hate that i10 has made ft conde village and the fort an afterthought in the minds of many because it is not very accessible.

[phoenixboi08]

Originally Posted by nimsjus

No Im not saying to remove Ft Conde. In Atlanta and other cities, people have essentially created new land and reconnected neighborhoods/pars of town by buring or building over sunken freeways. I was suggesting that it would be beneficial to ft conde viillage and downtown on general if mobile could do this at the entrance to the tunnels allowing ft conde and the village to be more connected to downtown . As it is now, ft conde and the village are a dead end culdesac at the end of south royal because of the I 10 tunnel approach and exit ramps. Removing the water st ramp and creating land over the tunnel entrance would create some new land for development and potentially allow us to reconnect the streets in ft conde village to the city grid again. The problem is projects like this on a bigger scale have been enormously expensive an would not be deemed necessary somewhere like mobile. I just hate that i10 has made ft conde village and the fort an afterthought in the minds of many because it is not very accessible.

It would be nice if they could sink a good stretch of I-10 and build over that...but THAT is definitely a "pipe dream!"

[Bogue]

I was also confused and thought you meant the one on the Causeway (which I think is much more of an eyesore b/c it's more visible to everyone who passes through). I also was aware that it's in Baldwin Co., but it's less than a mile from downtown so that's why my mind went there. I don't necessarily think BC is to blame for it not being torn down, etc. I think it's b/c they can't get insurance for most things. This is why that gateway project crashed and burned a couple years back, if I recall (plus other stuff, but I may not be remembering correctly). Y'all remember that?

[Bogue]

Also, Some of the wall provided by I-10 is helping keep the neighborhoods and the industrial sector seperate. Don't know if you'd want to bury it & connect the two. The huge amt. of rain the area receives each year (plus a fairly high water table, I think) might make it more expensive to build/maintain than in the other places, as well. B'ham's considering sinking part of I-20/59 through their downtown (a project I like), but they're well-inland and are a good bit higher above sea level than Mobile. It also makes more sense for them as the interstate cleaves their downtown in two. I-10 sort of skirts the edge of Mobile's residential area until it gets pretty close to the bay.

I do sort of get what Nimsjus is saying b/c that's essentially only like extending the tunnel a bit further in order to connect the streets above and have some greenspace above. A nice landscaped greenspace in front of Ft. Conde (essentially a large "Green Roof" over the tunnel addition) would make the fort more of a showpiece & the roads Nim is talking about would just go directly across this. Dunno' if they'd do it b/c it's largely just an aesthetic fix (an expensive aesthetic fix). If any city in this area were going to do something like it, though....

I like removing the Water St. exits, but the next exit down is going to need some work as well to handle all the new on/off traffic. I also think it's silly to have an on-ramp from the Causeway side just before the tunnel. People who just left downtown don't have much reason to jump immiediately back on and the handful that do would be better served by getting back on the mile or so down from there. As it is there's not enough of a merge lane, terrible sight lines, and it makes the silly people who are scared of tunnels freak out.

[NitekKetin]

Perhaps Royal Street, south of Canal Street, can be widened into a landscaped boulevard that connects to I-10 via new directional ramps at the Virginia Street interchange.

[OCA REP]

Originally Posted by phoenixboi08

GREAT photo!

The picture has a very European vibe to it...

[Bogue]

Yeah, it does have a bit of a early 20th century London look to it. It's the guy in the bowler hat that does it, I think

Nite, great idea, but I can't remember if that would take them down by the jail or not.

Speaking of VASt. I'd LOVE if all those state-named streets would have their names changed. Esp. Virginia St. Renaming them after something w/ a more local flair would be better. It's not like those names are anything other than a generic fix to street naming from back in the day (one mirrored in almost every other city in the US). I've just always disliked generic streetnames.

[NitekKetin]

I wouldn't mind seeing a regional jail facility constructed somewhere on Blakeley Island northern reaches. Having the jail moved out of its current location would aide in making the waterfront areas south of Downtown more feasible for light industrial development.

[phoenixboi08]

Originally Posted by NitekKetin

I wouldn't mind seeing a regional jail facility constructed somewhere on Blakeley Island northern reaches. Having the jail moved out of its current location would aide in making the waterfront areas south of Downtown more feasible for light industrial development.

I completely agree.
I also wished that the docks could have been further south...near the Brookley area. An airport AND docks in one place...

[Bogue]

Well, the train runs near that and sort of walls off the waterfront so it's unlikely that they'll make a push to develop that specific chunk. That's also near where they want to put the bridge.

I agree that there needs to be a diff. jail site. Putting the jail right next to the bay is silly, IMO as the inmates would need to be moved en masse if there were even a minor hurricane. I think hiding Mobile Metro Jail somewhere in that mass of light industrial/warehouse buildings between Govt. & Airport just west of I-65 would be the most preferable, but that might be too far from court (though a much more central location for police & not far from their HQ). The problems that Metro had as a result of poor engineering/construction are also well-documented & def. don't need to be replicated in the next attempt.

Back to those run-down neighborhoods for a sec: I spent a little while looking at listings of the "fixer-upper" kind of houses in downtown & the southern half of midtown and there aren't that many that are legitimately worth fixing. A couple were being sold at the worth of the lot b/c the house was irreparable. Some were overpriced relative to the work needed. I did find a couple that were probably worth fixing.

http://www.mobilerealtor.com/search/residential.asp?page=1&orderby=list_price&orddir=ASC

That's a list (which you can sort price-wise from bottom-up or top-down).