Rumour Mill - Page 22

HillStreetBlues · #**421** Posted **Jul 24, 2013, 12:19 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jon Dalton

David Blanchard has a lot of space for 'maybe offices, whatever...' I hope he's pitching this to Hortons.

This Is an interesting article about Stelco Tower and office space, from 2007. In it, Blanchard recommends turning the top half of the building into condos. It's a bit gag-inducing to hear them praise him for saving heritage buildings…

A few other interesting points from this:

-The only Class A office space in the City are the Commerce Place buildings. I think that about does it: even if Tim Horton's were to relocate to a core, they would not rent anything other than Class A space.
-At the time of the article, Stelco Tower and Jackson Square accounted for very nearly half of office space vacancy
-Blanchard himself says 'It would be a mistake to hope that the big companies will be coming back to town…"It's not going to happen."'

I doubt he's going to be talking to Tim Horton's, but your point about new construction maybe being an option is a good one.

SteelTown · #**422** Posted **Jul 24, 2013, 1:01 PM**

Yes, vast majority of Hamilton office vacancy is because it's not a Class A office space. That's why the City has set up a grant to help companies upgrade their office space to Class A, so far a few out of town companies have relocated to Hamilton and used the grant.

mattgrande · #**423** Posted **Jul 24, 2013, 2:51 PM**

1. Can anyone explain what "Class A" means, as opposed to what we currently have now? Is it an official definition, or does it mean "the best?"

2. My objections to the Gore buildings being torn down were mostly due to there being no plans to replace them. If they're being torn down for a shiny new Tim Hortons Tower, I'm all for it. (I'm not holding my breath, but it's nice to dream)

SteelTown · #**424** Posted **Jul 24, 2013, 2:55 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by mattgrande

1. Can anyone explain what "Class A" means, as opposed to what we currently have now? Is it an official definition, or does it mean "the best?"

http://www.squarefeetblog.com/commer...ass-b-class-c/

ScreamingViking · #**425** Posted **Jul 24, 2013, 3:39 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by HillStreetBlues

The only Class A office space in the City are the Commerce Place buildings. I think that about does it: even if Tim Horton's were to relocate to a core, they would not rent anything other than Class A space.
-At the time of the article, Stelco Tower and Jackson Square accounted for very nearly half of office space vacancy

That explains the $13.25/sqft lease noted on the properties website, compared to the $22.50 noted for 123 James N in the other thread:
http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/show...7&postcount=64

It would be great to see Yale upgrade them (along with the mall) but they probably won't do so until there's demand. Yet not having quality supply constrains the ability to lease that space, and limits options for companies who may look to locate downtown.

CaptainKirk · #**426** Posted **Jul 24, 2013, 4:03 PM**

Don't forget 21 John St. S., Royal Court, class A boutique style office

$17 sq ft total of 33,000 sq ft

http://looplink.waterloo.cbre.ca/ll/...-Street-South/

SteelTown · #**427** Posted **Jul 24, 2013, 4:09 PM**

I doubt Tim Hortons would go into an urban office tower, plus they wouldn't rent either.

Remember Tim Hortons is a food and beverage company so they'll need a large kitchen, think they call it the Tim Hortons University. What's why I think the former West Harbour stadium site would be a good match, open land, close to GO Transit, can build any style they want.

Remember these are Oakville people, it'll be an uphill battle to convince them to move to Hamilton.

Frankenrogers · #**428** Posted **Jul 24, 2013, 6:22 PM**

Never will happen but it would be cool if they took over Delta High School in a few years. The housing stock in the area is great and if you could put some better retail in across the street you'd have a great little neighbourhood.

While I'm dreaming, put it beside Tim Horton's Field at Scott Park!

ScreamingViking · #**429** Posted **Jul 24, 2013, 7:53 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by SteelTown

I doubt Tim Hortons would go into an urban office tower, plus they wouldn't rent either.

Remember Tim Hortons is a food and beverage company so they'll need a large kitchen, think they call it the Tim Hortons University. What's why I think the former West Harbour stadium site would be a good match, open land, close to GO Transit, can build any style they want.

Remember these are Oakville people, it'll be an uphill battle to convince them to move to Hamilton.

SJAM could be a workable site too.
(not sure the timeline would match though - it's not scheduled for closure for a couple of years?)

movingtohamilton · #**430** Posted **Jul 24, 2013, 8:24 PM**

I love the optimism in this thread. I'm not an optimist when it comes to TDL. This is a suburbs/small town-focused company. It likes Hamilton because of the bonus of downtown "lower city" space in which they have situated drive-thru stores, which consume a lot of land which could be better served by other uses.

Tim Hortons doesn't get all warm and fuzzy about downtown urbanism/green/public transit, unless it suits a marketing initiative. I'm looking for signs of that.

If they get a big taxpayer-financed inducement, the company might move to Hamilton and build something near major highways. And Oakville will battle tooth-and-nail to keep the company.

Just my $0.02

SteelTown · #**431** Posted **Jul 25, 2013, 4:49 PM**

http://www.cbc.ca/hamilton/

There's a CBC poll about Tim Hortons HQ.

Beedok · #**432** Posted **Jul 25, 2013, 4:58 PM**

'Let's foster our own independent coffee culture'? So they want to ignore the city's biggest coffee success to strengthen the city's coffee culture? That's like LA kicking out Hollywood to try to foster it's local movie industry.

movingtohamilton · #**433** Posted **Jul 25, 2013, 5:24 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beedok

'Let's foster our own independent coffee culture'? So they want to ignore the city's biggest coffee success to strengthen the city's coffee culture? That's like LA kicking out Hollywood to try to foster it's local movie industry.

Tim Hortons is a cross-Canada franchised operation, reaping decent to amazing returns for its franchisees and shareholders. The brand image has been carefully nurtured and is now iconic. The company has pressed all the right emotional buttons in the "average Joe". But Jane and Joe Coffee Drinker are important in one and only one thing: sales.

In a small market like Hamilton, it dominates retail coffee, and will never be truly threatened by small coffee shops. Consumers who like the small shops aren't typical TH coffee-drinkers.

But in larger heavily urbanized markets (not Hamilton) it competes with other chains (mainly Starbucks) and with "cafe culture". TH has a bigger fight on its hands to maintain and grow market share in large cities.

matt602 · #**434** Posted **Aug 25, 2013, 7:37 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by SteelTown

Suppose I could put this here...

http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/show...147134&page=11

Starbucks announcement coming to downtown Hamilton?

Not a rumor any more. Just saw the signs for it a few hours ago.

Jackson Square is getting a Starbucks. Still trying to let that sink in...

Can't imagine anyone would have guessed that would happen 5 years ago.

LikeHamilton · #**435** Posted **Aug 25, 2013, 11:01 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by matt602

Not a rumor any more. Just saw the signs for it a few hours ago.

Jackson Square is getting a Starbucks. Still trying to let that sink in...

Can't imagine anyone would have guessed that would happen 5 years ago.

Where is going to be located within the mall?