CLEVELAND | Project Rundown - Page 21

riverlover · #**401** Posted **May 17, 2009, 9:44 PM**

I have an idea, since this forum has been relatively quiet... I don't know if this would do a lick of good, but why not try anyway....

I was thinking that maybe if we flooded Forest City with letters or emails asking to re-open the OB deck, that maybe it would do some good. Such a building and downtown lacking such an attraction seems a waste. I remember doing volunteer work for the observation deck in the late 1980's and early 1990's. I did it while volunteering for the visitors bureau when they had a booth in the portico at T.T.

It was fun and many visitors came to see this. I remember one historian telling me that there was also at one time an outdoor deck considerable higher. Anyway, I cannot buy anymore excuses why this is not open to the public. The complex benefits by having an attraction like this. The admission was fair and the attraction attracted many positive comments.

Now, we still have nothing of the sort. It is a shame and unacceptable.

I hope others out there want to see this come back as much as I do. If so, tell F.C. about it and tell them why it should re-open. Well, just my thoughts.

Dimension · #**402** Posted **May 17, 2009, 10:28 PM**

^^Insurance costs are sky high for observation decks, thats why many are closed and/are closing.

riverlover · #**403** Posted **May 18, 2009, 12:03 AM**

Admission could be charged as always... Don't know what the costs are to insure such attractions, so I wouldn't know what to offer tom offset the costs. The benefits of Forest City attracting other visitors who could patronize other businesses in the complex might be worth the investment.

Future Mayor · #**404** Posted **May 18, 2009, 4:06 PM**

That's how I see it to, if you attract visitors to the observation deck a decent percentage of those are going to spend at least some time in Tower City and spend at least a little money at the center and give it a feel of vibrancy and activity.

I'm simply guessing but I would guess that admission costs, and revenue from advertisers on the observation deck, combined with increase traffic in Tower City would be enough to justify the cost of opening it up. Come on Forest City, it's not like what you're doing now is really doing the job is it. Maybe it's time to try a different approach, and stop bitching about losing the convention center. Come up with another solution so save your center.

riverlover · #**405** Posted **May 19, 2009, 2:50 PM**

Mayor, I agree...

It is worth the investment. Anyone who supports opening it again should write to Forest City.

cyclovert · #**406** Posted **May 21, 2009, 6:25 PM**

i love that deck; i took piles of inspiring photos from it years ago.

maybe someone has an address or a department to which we could mail these letters. i don't know much about this kind of thing.

also, i bet the views from key tower and the SOHIO-BP-whatever-it-is-now building are equally amazing and offer excellent views of the terminal tower. do they have anything like an observation deck? i remember attempting to go to the top floors years ago (pre- 9/11) and having no success.

hubz1124 · #**407** Posted **May 22, 2009, 12:41 AM**

..."also, i bet the views from key tower and the SOHIO-BP-whatever-it-is-now building"

Im not sure, but I believe that is about to the "Huntington Bank Building"

MayDay · #**408** Posted **May 22, 2009, 2:07 AM**

When BP vacated, the building became officially known as 200 Public Square. As hubz said, Huntington Bank has signed on for 100K sq. feet, signage and I believe the naming rights to the building.

As for the views from the top? You tell me

http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=169454

Fyi, neither Key nor 200 Public Square have public observation decks.

riverlover · #**409** Posted **May 23, 2009, 5:29 PM**

If you want to write to Forest City, here is a link for their T.T. property... There are also several addresses. I encourage everyone to do it.. What's to lose? I just cannot buy anymore excuses for not having this attraction eventually open to the public again. By not having it, they hurt themselves. As I mentioned in my earlier post...I used to volunteer up there and when it was open, it attracted droves of visitors. I was even told of the OB deck that used to be the outdoor one considerably higher than the indoor one. Such an attraction could lead to generating more of the foot traffic they need--which in turn could lead to spending. Visitors from other places like attractions like this---and seeing that this was one of the first skyscrapers of its type in N.A. it is only fitting it feature this attraction. Insurance, 9-11, etc..all B.S. excuses for lazy management. Well, enough of my tangent... Here is the link... http://www.forestcity.net/PROPERTIES/terminal-tower.asp

riverlover · #**410** Posted **May 23, 2009, 5:37 PM**

May, if you're out there... I know you cleared this one up a while back, but I want to ask again---because I hear mixed answers about whether or not the entire tower's stone will be cleaned---or, just the top floors. It seems to me that to do the top and not the bottom would look bad. If they are cleaning this.. I never see it going on...and if they are.. How are they doing it?

Also, the surrounding anchor buildings could use some masonry cleaning as well.

What is the real scoop on this?

Thanks!

riverlover · #**411** Posted **May 23, 2009, 5:57 PM**

Just wondering about this bridge.. To my understanding, the plan will be to restore the bridge so that it will carry west-bound ONLY traffic...while a new bridge will be built next to it to carry east-bound traffic. This bridge is an icon and a part of the city scape. I hope that it is not demolished. That would be a pity. I'll bet it could look fabulous restored and illuminated at night. The bridge shows a lot of might and muscle.

May, do you want to answer this one?

Thanks!

MayDay · #**412** Posted **May 24, 2009, 2:27 PM**

I'm not sure what gets into peoples' heads when they say a company is making "BS excuses". Forest City (like 99% of real estate interests) is having lots of problems due to the economy:
http://www.crainscleveland.com/artic...903309963/1022
http://www.crainscleveland.com/artic...903309963/1022

But apparently, reopening the observation deck on the Terminal Tower should top their list of priorities? For crying out loud, I'm the webmaster of clevelandskyscrapers.com and if anyone wants to see the observation deck reopened, it's ME. I love taking photos from up there, some of my best images are from there, so it's not like I don't want it to happen. But I also realize that in this economy, the shareholders of Forest City might not see expenditures like that as importantly as you or I do. Do *you* know people at Forest City? I do, and they've expressed that they hope (operative word, hope) to have the deck reopened at some point. However, they, more than anyone - are aware that it's not economically feasible for now. If that's not good enough, maybe we should have a bake sale or a car wash.

As far as this notion that the Terminal Tower is only being half-restored (only the top floors)? Where did you hear this? Was it someone from Coon Restoration or Forest City? If not, why even give a baseless rumor any consideration? When the restoration was first announced, someone posted on another forum that they "heard that the restoration company had no experience restoring buildings". So some yoho posts a rumor that he heard from someone who heard something from someone who overheard, etc. and the next thing I know - four or five people send me an email at my site asking about this baseless rumor. I'm happy to provide the "real scoop" but it gets irritating. Notice that this thread has fewer posts than comparable cities - a big reason is that I don't post here based on unsubstantiated rumors.

Here's the latest of what's happening with the Terminal Tower restoration - the reason you're not seeing work on the lower floors is that this year 3 of a FIVE year restoration project:

Anyway - the surrounding anchor buildings? The Higbee Building had a substantial cleaning a few years ago. The Renaissance Hotel is getting a similar treatment to the Terminal Tower. Skylight Office Tower and the Ritz are newer and aren't in much need of cleaning. Now - Landmark Office Towers certainly could benefit from a cleaning, but you are aware that they aren't owned by Forest City, aren't you?

I can't answer about the Innerbelt bridge because things are still currently in the design stage. It may well be an icon but if it's not structurally sound or in good enough shape to be restored, what's the point? It has a lot of similarities to the former I-35 bridge in Minneapolis, sure - an icon but its design was flawed and we saw what happened there.

riverlover · #**413** Posted **May 24, 2009, 3:42 PM**

May,

Thanks for the information. In my post.

I never passed along the rumor of only the upper floors being restored as fact. I don't know why you read into it that way.

In fact, I did not want to mention names, but it is something a councilman in Cleveland told me just the other day when I inquired about it. I thought I was cautious enough with my approach to this so I would not be viewed as passing on a rumor as a fact---which is not at all what I did. Because there seems to be little coverage of the project in the papers, is why I posted the comments in the first place.

Second, what does whether or not me knowing anyone at Forest City have to do with maintaining the opinion that it is a shame to not have the deck opened again, or to promote enthusiasts to write to the F.C. in their support for opening it again someday?--afterall, it was closed long before the economy took a dump..and here again, at least I cannot find information about its current status or future plans, hence the questions/comments here...and again, nothing passed on as fact---other than the fact I used to work in it as a volunteer.

And lastly, my bridge comments were based on what report I saw in the P.D.---about one bridge being re-habbed for west...and a new one being built for east traffic. The point of me posting was to indeed, seek the real stories....should anyone know them. If there are new people who post here wondering about the status of whatever/wherever in related subjects to the site (Cleveland posts)... They may likely be unaware how many times you may have attempted to address a particular issue, so why answer it as though it is a bother.... I think it is good to see enthusiasm for the subject theme, no matter how well one is either informed or uninformed on the particular subject at the time. Just my opinion.

Thanks for your clearance.

Future Mayor · #**414** Posted **May 26, 2009, 7:58 PM**

Very well said, it's not as if you stated those questions as facts, you were simply inquiring about things you had heard and wanted clarification. I look at this forum as a place to express opinions and ideas, not simply as a place to post facts. Some of us aren't in Cleveland anymore but still want to keep tabs on some of the things going on, so it's a nice to read those OPINIONS and IDEAS. GEEZ, lighten up MD!

MayDay · #**415** Posted **May 27, 2009, 3:45 AM**

"In fact, I did not want to mention names, but it is something a councilman in Cleveland told me just the other day when I inquired about it."

So what councilman said it? Some of them have my utmost respect and are truly in touch with what's going on, others are completely incompetent buffoons. It really depends on who said it; hypothetically speaking - a councilman with a gripe against Forest City could be trying to spread a false rumor.

As far as Forest City and the observation deck - I think it's great that you want to get support drummed up for reopening the deck, whether it's an email campaign or what have you. I would just encourage you to avoid using phrases like "all B.S. excuses for lazy management." if you're trying to persuade someone. And as I've said - you're trying to persuade people who deep down would love to have the deck opened but those "B.S. excuses" are preventing them.

Future Mayor, opinions are great. Ideas are great. However - people (for whatever reason) crosscheck this forum with emails to me. So if someone posts "I heard they're demolishing the Arcade, someone at City Hall said so", I can look forward to 3 or 4 emails from people freaking out. Clarifying it here is one thing - but give ME a break.

riverlover · #**416** Posted **May 27, 2009, 5:12 AM**

May,

You're being way too analytical. If I promote a letter writing campaign to support the re-opening of the deck, I am not going to encourage someone to use what was my rhetorical comment about "b.s." I still maintain that it is b.s. to not have it open. Am I not permitted to be upset about that? You are much more intelligent to assume I would literally say something like that in writing a letter. I have been involved in letter writing campaigns for years and I know how to conduct a respectful one.

I don't think it necessary to reveal what councilman I heard the comment about the restoration from, but believe me, there is no bone to pick with FCE. By the way, I can understand your appreciation for FCE, especially if they allow you to take those spectacular photos--but also, last I checked, if someone does in fact have a beef about FCE, there is no law against expressing such.

Anyway, this is absurd, and I do not wish to be dragged into trivial drama that will offshoot in a gazillion different irrelevant directions. No one seemed to have a big problem with the original post...or took it out of context to another level.

Sorry I posted here.

mrnyc · #**417** Posted **Jun 9, 2009, 10:05 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dimension

^^Insurance costs are sky high for observation decks, thats why many are closed and/are closing.

i just remembered something. i think we have at least one pretty decent insurer in the clev that would insure the tt obs deck for a bargain price if FCE spoke to him....and tossed a good bag of dank weed into the deal.

MayDay · #**418** Posted **Jul 11, 2009, 10:24 PM**

Updated July 10 - new images for University Hospitals Cancer Center, Cleveland Hearing and Speech Center, Tremont Place Lofts, and Euclid Corridor (recently completed). New rendering for 27 Coltman townhomes.

hubz1124 · #**419** Posted **Jul 13, 2009, 3:20 AM**

thanks for the update mayday. much appreciated

hubz1124 · #**420** Posted **Jul 24, 2009, 12:06 AM**

New marketing for the Tyler Village Project. Excellent work.

http://www.digitalwebpost.com/tyler/tyler1h.html