Salt Lake City: Official Development News Thread - Part 5

[Liberty Wellsian]

Originally Posted by Marvland

Sorry, no hard data. That's the very nature of "un-reported" unfortunately. The wife is in law enforcement and I'll leave it at that.

I do urban brownfields development among other things. I'm in a new city every two to three weeks. I actively pursue marginal areas in cities to see the affected area and how it interfaces with non-affected areas across social, development and environmental spectra. Believe, me, and I repeat myself, RIO GRANDE IS AS BAD AS ANYTHING IN THE COUNTRY and it bleeds into neighboring areas constantly. Read that until your teeth turn white, people. Or continue to deny it. It is not as large and the encampments in LA, for example, but it is unique in it's concentrated sheer suckiness.

Let's look at crime that isn't underreported. The homicide rate. Surely SLCPD doesn't ignore a dead body. Here is a list of the worst 30 US cities by homicide rate.
https://www.neighborhoodscout.com/bl...er-rate-cities

To put SLC in perspective number 30, D.C., has a homicide rate 5 times higher than SLC.

[Marvland]

Originally Posted by Liberty Wellsian

Let's look at crime that isn't underreported. The homicide rate. Surely SLCPD doesn't ignore a dead body. Here is a list of the worst 30 US cities by homicide rate.
https://www.neighborhoodscout.com/bl...er-rate-cities

To put SLC in perspective number 30, D.C., has a homicide rate 5 times higher than SLC.

No argument about overall homicide rate, but the much less official and scientific concept of "suckiness" in Rio Grande and its bleed-through in the community. These are personal observations. I'm not sure why so many people on this board are in denial about these obvious things. If we don't acknowledge how bad it is, we will never improve it.

[stayinginformed]

Originally Posted by Liberty Wellsian

I fail to see the correlation between the two. operation diversion was an ultimatum given to drug addicts by police. Jail or inpatient treatment you decide. How did that cause this shooting?

Operation diversion was a round up. People who don't want to be caught up in said round ups in the future move to other areas so they don't have to make the decision to go to jail or go to rehab. I see the diversion into the neighborhoods every day by the number of people sleeping on the medians on 800 West from 100 south to 300 North. There is a marked increase even from the levels we saw last year.

[Marvland]

This article syncs up with all of the feedback I've received from local OR exhibitors:

"It seems like they've been looking for an excuse [to leave Salt Lake City]," said Austin Moyes, national sales manager for Logan-based Aquamira Technologies, which produces filtered hydration packs and water bottles. "To say that Utah is not an outdoor-friendly state is bogus."

"We think the name of Utah has been tarnished a bit in that endeavor … especially from out of state.

"As a Utah company, we're really proud of Utah," Keller said. "It's extremely important to protect public lands, [and] we acknowledge Utah is not perfect in that capacity. … [But] we're not agreeing to the villainous [reputation] we've been given."

They, except for perhaps the deplorable Black Diamond (please for the love of god, Peter "Lord Jesus" Metcalf, move your company to Colorado), are almost universally pissed off about OR leaving Utah and they form a massive coalition within OR. The smart people at DA, VSL and SLC need to pounce on this yesterday and form an alternative OR convention. OR's influence is waning due to competing conferences anyway. Now is the time to pounce.

I would like to see a bi-annual conference that turns OR on its head by including both the public, like Comicon, and the industry. Integrate with existing food, beverage, tech and music events: Tastemakers, Taste the Wasatch, Park City Food and Wine, Twilite Concerts, Crucial Fest, etc. Make it a two week mish-mash, market the hell out of it it and welcome 200,000 friends to SLC. Sort of like our very own SXSW. Salt Lake is already a sneaky destination city, now let's capitalize on ti.

[bob rulz]

Originally Posted by Marvland

Sorry, no hard data. That's the very nature of "un-reported" unfortunately. The wife is in law enforcement and I'll leave it at that.

We can leave it at that, but unless your wife is also law enforcement in other cities - which obviously she isn't - you can have no possible frame of reference to compare how much unreported crime Rio Grande has in comparison to other cities. I'm also unclear on your definition of "unreported" - if your wife is in law enforcmenet and you hear of these things, are you saying unreported in the sense that the news doesn't pick up on it? Or unreported in the sense that it's not going to make it into official police statistics? And if that's the case, how would a crime that law enforcement is aware of not make it into official police statistics?

I do urban brownfields development among other things. I'm in a new city every two to three weeks. I actively pursue marginal areas in cities to see the affected area and how it interfaces with non-affected areas across social, development and environmental spectra. Believe, me, and I repeat myself, RIO GRANDE IS AS BAD AS ANYTHING IN THE COUNTRY and it bleeds into neighboring areas constantly. Read that until your teeth turn white, people. Or continue to deny it. It is not as large and the encampments in LA, for example, but it is unique in it's concentrated sheer suckiness.

Well see, I'm more inclined to believe you after something like this, but you undermine yourself by saying things like "read that until your teeth turn white" or using terms like "general suckiness" because it makes you sound hyperbolic. We get that you can't have anything other than personal observation to go on, but forgive me if I don't take the word of a single person - even if that single person does see a lot of underdeveloped areas.

So I'll be clear about something else - NOBODY IS DENYING THAT IT'S BAD. We're just taking exception to the particular way in which you're choosing to express your observations.

And if you don't mind me asking, if your job is to figure out how these undeveloped areas interact with surrounding regions, what kinds of solutions would you propose?

[Liberty Wellsian]

Originally Posted by Marvland

This article syncs up with all of the feedback I've received from local OR exhibitors:



They, except for perhaps the deplorable Black Diamond (please for the love of god, Peter "Lord Jesus" Metcalf, move your company to Colorado), are almost universally pissed off about OR leaving Utah and they form a massive coalition within OR. The smart people at DA, VSL and SLC need to pounce on this yesterday and form an alternative OR convention. OR's influence is waning due to competing conferences anyway. Now is the time to pounce.

I would like to see a bi-annual conference that turns OR on its head by including both the public, like Comicon, and the industry. Integrate with existing food, beverage, tech and music events: Tastemakers, Taste the Wasatch, Park City Food and Wine, Twilite Concerts, Crucial Fest, etc. Make it a two week mish-mash, market the hell out of it it and welcome 200,000 friends to SLC. Sort of like our very own SXSW. Salt Lake is already a sneaky destination city, now let's capitalize on ti.

Now that the bubble in the mining sector has burst perhaps Rio Tinto would be ready to consider the ski resort in soldier hollow. If opened it would be the closest ski resort to an international airport in the world and would bring the county's inventory of resorts to 5.

I'm with you. Think bigger. Include the southetowne expo center and throw a concurrent music festival in SLC. The Twilight music festival?

Edit: oh and run the trains 24 hours a day.

[bob rulz]

Originally Posted by asies1981

The city unveiled the selected RFP for the Barnes Bank site, two buildings 9 and 5 stories each.

I like these renderings a lot.

[Makid]

Originally Posted by asies1981

The city unveiled the selected RFP for the Barnes Bank site, two buildings 9 and 5 stories each.

I like these as well.

I was hoping for a 9 story building with underground parking but I will take it as it does have ground floor uses.

This will be a great addition to the area.

[ThePusherMan]

Originally Posted by Marvland

I would like to see a bi-annual conference that turns OR on its head by including both the public, like Comicon, and the industry. Integrate with existing food, beverage, tech and music events: Tastemakers, Taste the Wasatch, Park City Food and Wine, Twilite Concerts, Crucial Fest, etc. Make it a two week mish-mash, market the hell out of it it and welcome 200,000 friends to SLC. Sort of like our very own SXSW. Salt Lake is already a sneaky destination city, now let's capitalize on ti.

An OR type show where the public is allowed to go check out the wares is the most "no duh" idea I have heard in a very long time. The outdoor community in SLC already gets all giddy when OR is in town. Imagine if they could actually go to there.

[Liberty Wellsian]

Originally Posted by Marvland

No argument about overall homicide rate, but the much less official and scientific concept of "suckiness" in Rio Grande and its bleed-through in the community. These are personal observations. I'm not sure why so many people on this board are in denial about these obvious things. If we don't acknowledge how bad it is, we will never improve it.

No one thinks that there is not a problem. Your exaggeration "as bas as anything in urban America" is over the top.

Warning: many of this guy's videos are nsfw. They are also fascinating. They may suck you into a YouTube hole.

• Video Link

Originally Posted by stayinginformed

Operation diversion was a round up. People who don't want to be caught up in said round ups in the future move to other areas so they don't have to make the decision to go to jail or go to rehab. I see the diversion into the neighborhoods every day by the number of people sleeping on the medians on 800 West from 100 south to 300 North. There is a marked increase even from the levels we saw last year.

So you don't want the police to pick up homeless people that have warrants or are breaking the law? What do you want the police to do? You really can't blame this problem on the SLCPD. They have no control of the services that might fix the problem.

[Orlando]

Originally Posted by asies1981

The city unveiled the selected RFP for the Barnes Bank site, two buildings 9 and 5 stories each.

We looked into this project as well. We tried going in with Gerding Edlen, but didn't pursue it. We heard later that other developers, such as Cowboy Partners, dropped out of it due to the site being offered only at market rate, and no discount. The proposed program for the site was very interesting, and did demand a tallish midrise building in order for it to be justified. I really like the GIV group, and their demonstrated ability to build attractive affordable housing in urban areas. Though, I'm still a little doubtful that financing will come through for this. This is their largest project so far, and I hope this does get built as shown.

[EPdesign]

Originally Posted by Orlando

We looked into this project as well. We tried going in with Gerding Edlen, but didn't pursue it. We heard later that other developers, such as Cowboy Partners, dropped out of it due to the site being offered only at market rate, and no discount. The proposed program for the site was very interesting, and did demand a tallish midrise building in order for it to be justified. I really like the GIV group, and their demonstrated ability to build attractive affordable housing in urban areas. Though, I'm still a little doubtful that financing will come through for this. This is their largest project so far, and I hope this does get built as shown.

I like this comment

[airhero]

Originally Posted by asies1981

The city unveiled the selected RFP for the Barnes Bank site, two buildings 9 and 5 stories each.

Awesome. I love that. Also thanks for the mini update on Violin School Commons. I really hope that gets moving soon.

[Stenar]

Originally Posted by Liberty Wellsian

Now that the bubble in the mining sector has burst perhaps Rio Tinto would be ready to consider the ski resort in soldier hollow. If opened it would be the closest ski resort to an international airport in the world and would bring the county's inventory of resorts to 5.

I'm with you. Think bigger. Include the southetowne expo center and throw a concurrent music festival in SLC. The Twilight music festival?

Edit: oh and run the trains 24 hours a day.

You mean Soldier Flats. Kennecott closed their Kennecott Land division entirely, which makes it less likely to happen. I wish they would do it already, though.

[Liberty Wellsian]

Originally Posted by Stenar

You mean Soldier Flats. Kennecott closed their Kennecott Land division entirely, which makes it less likely to happen. I wish they would do it already, though.

Yeah that is what I meant.

Didn't they close down shop as far as development is concerned following the financial crisis and the housing bubble bursting? At the same time China was still ratcheting up domestic production. At the time it made sense for them to focus investment on mining assets to protect/enhance market share. Now that production has more than caught up with demand they likely won't be looking to expand their mining interests. They may newd to diversify or even be forced to deleverage some of their mining assets. With the real estate market so hot now it seems like the perfect time for them return to some of their plans for development.

[Liberty Wellsian]

What's going on at the 900 s viaduct? They have the roadway ripped off. Please say it's going bye bye.

[delts145]

^^^

I wish. Apparently, it will be closed for at least a month while they do repairs on the bridge over 300 West. There was an article on it in the Tribune

http://www.sltrib.com/home/5549338-1...it-closing-for

[Orlando]

Originally Posted by Liberty Wellsian

What's going on at the 900 s viaduct? They have the roadway ripped off. Please say it's going bye bye.

In the masterplan, they want to turn the 900s viaduct into a park.

[Comrade]

I kinda like the 900 S viaduct. I think it adds a certain vibe to the area.

[Marvland]

Originally Posted by Liberty Wellsian

No one thinks that there is not a problem. Your exaggeration "as bas as anything in urban America" is over the top.

Warning: many of this guy's videos are nsfw. They are also fascinating. They may suck you into a YouTube hole.

• Video Link

I'll be in Detroit in two weeks. Can't wait really. Last time I was there was in 2010 and the place was nuked. I've heard amazing things about its recovery progress. Massive swaths are still bombed out though. It has some of the best bones of any city in the country.