New York City - Transit News

[mrnyc]

no new alternative funding solution from albany
if congestion pricing does finally fail —



Congestion pricing: MTA left in the lurch after Hochul scraps toll plan, Albany fails on funding bill

By Robert Pozarycki
Posted on June 8, 2024

https://www.amny.com/news/congestion...ochul-funding/

[k1052]

Originally Posted by mrnyc

no new alternative funding solution from albany
if congestion pricing does finally fail —



Congestion pricing: MTA left in the lurch after Hochul scraps toll plan, Albany fails on funding bill

By Robert Pozarycki
Posted on June 8, 2024

https://www.amny.com/news/congestion...ochul-funding/

Impossible to overstate how badly Hochul F'd this up.

[Crawford]

Hochul basically delivered the nightmare scenario I most feared under another you-know-who administration. I thought he would try and kill NYC by strangling CP. Instead it was Hochul. Unbelievable.

I don't think anyone knows how this will end. Legislature will not approve additional taxes. Hochul likely won't backtrack. I can't imagine the MTA will just shut down and be sold for scrap. So will the MTA board just move forward, ignoring Congestion Kathy? CP is enshrined in law.

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by Crawford

Hochul basically delivered the nightmare scenario I most feared under another you-know-who administration. I thought he would try and kill NYC by strangling CP. Instead it was Hochul. Unbelievable.

I don't think anyone knows how this will end. Legislature will not approve additional taxes. Hochul likely won't backtrack. I can't imagine the MTA will just shut down and be sold for scrap. So will the MTA board just move forward, ignoring Congestion Kathy? CP is enshrined in law.

There will be plenty of lawsuits if this doesn't go live on June 30. Many are questioning whether she even has the authority to unilaterally shut it down.

[mrnyc]

from what i saw at the gym that was the discussion on the ny1 news this morning. there are those saying it can be halted and those saying it cant. basically there are four levels of government that have to sign off and she is halting the dot from doing that supposedly.

so we wait to see what happens. of course if it doesn’t go into effect expect lawsuits.

[k1052]

Originally Posted by mrnyc

from what i saw at the gym that was the discussion on the ny1 news this morning. there are those saying it can be halted and those saying it cant. basically there are four levels of government that have to sign off and she is halting the dot from doing that supposedly.

so we wait to see what happens. of course if it doesn’t go into effect expect lawsuits.

The MTA board, while a creature created by the governor and beholden to that office, still has a legal fiduciary responsibility to implement the program because they can't just decide not to take revenue accounted for in its budget. NYDOT, likely illegally at her order, withholding its sign off is almost certain to end up in court.

She says she's not "canceling" the program just delaying it. Mostly because saying to are canceling something that the law says you shall implement isn't a thing you can do. Explaining the difference between a cancelation and an indefinite delay to a judge when the system is ready to go might be a bit uncomfortable.

[Crawford]

Jesus, this idiot Gov. claimed she shut down CP based on complaints in a Midtown diner. A place where the eggs cost more than the CP fee.

Is there one person on earth who drives their car to a diner next to Grand Central? Who does that? Who are these people?

Maybe the politicians have such a warped sense of reality given they're driven everywhere? But how could someone be so stupid to think people are driving their personal cars to Midtown diners? The Grand Central parking alone costs like $60. Lincoln Tunnel is $14. Crosstown congestion is horrible. Who is doing this for eggs?

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by Crawford

Jesus, this idiot Gov. claimed she shut down CP based on complaints in a Midtown diner. A place where the eggs cost more than the CP fee.

Is there one person on earth who drives their car to a diner next to Grand Central? Who does that? Who are these people?

Has she ever actually lived in NYC? I know she supposedly has an apartment in Manhattan, but did she do that before or after becoming governor?

Originally Posted by Crawford

Maybe the politicians have such a warped sense of reality given they're driven everywhere? But how could someone be so stupid to think people are driving their personal cars to Midtown diners? The Grand Central parking alone costs like $60. Lincoln Tunnel is $14. Crosstown congestion is horrible. Who is doing this for eggs?

It's also like 4 crosstown blocks from Times Square, one of the most congested intersections in the world.

[Busy Bee]

Depends on how good those eggs are. It's amazing how hard it is to get fantastic eggs.

[homebucket]

What an idiot.

[SoCalKid]

Just dropping in as a non-New Yorker to say keep up the good fight pushing back on Hochul! It looks like you've got a good shot at making her back down. We're routing for you over in LA! New York can show other big cities the way of the future if this moves forward.

[202_Cyclist]

Another Staten Island ferry is up for auction! Pete Davidson had buyer's remorse with his ferry but this would be an interesting project.

https://www.silive.com/news/2024/05/...k-at-155k.html

[mrnyc]

Originally Posted by 202_Cyclist

Another Staten Island ferry is up for auction! Pete Davidson had buyer's remorse with his ferry but this would be an interesting project.

https://www.silive.com/news/2024/05/...k-at-155k.html

yeah the latest is nobody bid on that one, so they’ll probably have to scrap it. pete’s ferry is sitting in a dock, but they say its still in the works to turn it into a comedy club and move it to miami in the winters (ps pete likes his weed, so, yeah).

[Illithid Dude]

CP would have worked much better if cabs and rideshare were exempt. It should only apply to privately owned vehicles.

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by Illithid Dude

CP would have worked much better if cabs and rideshare were exempt. It should only apply to privately owned vehicles.

Cabs and rideshares would only be charged once per day, so they would likely make money from the surcharge if they enter the zone multiple times per day. I do think they should've exempted private bus operators, but not because it would be an unaffordable charge. It just gave opponents of the CP plan another angle to attack it, while the revenue from private bus services would be minimal.

[mrnyc]

Congestion pricing: How do people get to Hochul’s favorite Midtown diners? Mainly by foot and transit

By Ben Brachfeld
Posted on June 10, 2024


…

We spoke to 25 customers across the three diners and asked them how they arrived: 21 of them got there on foot or by mass transit, while only three drove a car and one took a cab.


more:
https://www.amny.com/transit/congest...iners-transit/

[k1052]

Originally Posted by mrnyc

Congestion pricing: How do people get to Hochul’s favorite Midtown diners? Mainly by foot and transit

By Ben Brachfeld
Posted on June 10, 2024


…

We spoke to 25 customers across the three diners and asked them how they arrived: 21 of them got there on foot or by mass transit, while only three drove a car and one took a cab.


more:
https://www.amny.com/transit/congest...iners-transit/

Most business owners in urban areas have super wrong ideas about how their customers actually arrive at their places. Those same owners will also typically drive to their business in their personal vehicles so they see everything through that lens.

[Crawford]

There are rumors there might be some compromise brewing, where Hochul might try and save face.

There might still be CP, but it will start at a lower rate.

[dchan]

Really, people from NJ are actually going (never mind driving) to these three mediocre midtown diners when they can go to the awesome Tops Diner in East Newark?

• Video Link

Seriously, do yourselves a favor and go to Tops Diner sometime. I had the best chicken and waffles there that I ever had.

Or if Tops is packed, go to another NJ diner. NJ is known for diners, most of which are probably better than these mediocre Midtown diners and definitely significantly less expensive.

Originally Posted by Crawford

There are rumors there might be some compromise brewing, where Hochul might try and save face.

There might still be CP, but it will start at a lower rate.

Not surprised, considering the complete brouhaha that her office has been facing. CP advocates are totally pissed, and the MTA is pissed.

Hochul is in a position of "stupid or liar". She's either a complete idiot, or she's lying through her teeth with BS reasoning.

My main concern is one that I've known since I did my research project 15+ years ago. To wean drivers away from driving, you need very good to excellent quality transportation alternatives. And this is one area where I can't fault drivers here. Where are our excellent transportation alternatives?

I certainly don't trust the MTA much of the time. The MTA has stolen way too much of our valuable time through constant delays, whether through normal operations, scheduled maintenance, or unforeseen circumstances. As I have written many times, I won't evade fares, but I will definitely avoid using the MTA if I can help it.

And if CP goes through again, will the MTA significantly increase good quality (fast with no unexplained BS slowdowns) weekend and mid-day service to provide an "very good transportation alternative" to travelers priced out from driving? Let's see.

Likewise, will we see better bike and e-mobility infrastructure to provide another good transportation alternative? Will bike and e-mobility users have routes that don't conflict with speeding crazy drivers? Will they have the ability to park somewhere without worrying that their bike or e-vehicle will be stolen?

[Nouvellecosse]

Originally Posted by dchan

My main concern is one that I've known since I did my research project 15+ years ago. To wean drivers away from driving, you need very good to excellent quality transportation alternatives. And this is one area where I can't fault drivers here. Where are our excellent transportation alternatives?

I certainly don't trust the MTA much of the time. The MTA has stolen way too much of our valuable time through constant delays, whether through normal operations, scheduled maintenance, or unforeseen circumstances. As I have written many times, I won't evade fares, but I will definitely avoid using the MTA if I can help it.

And if CP goes through again, will the MTA significantly increase good quality (fast with no unexplained BS slowdowns) weekend and mid-day service to provide an "very good transportation alternative" to travelers priced out from driving? Let's see.

While I mostly agree, this part seems like a bit of a stretch. The idea that one of the cities with the most extensive transit systems in the world that already manages to provide the around half the transit trips in the entire country and the majority of trips in the city still can't support congestion pricing because it isn't perfect. Well driving isn't perfect either as there's a constant possibility of unexpected slow downs from things like accidents, construction etc. Yet transit had to be held to such a high standard that it's immune? Well that's just not realistic.

But fortunately, CP doesn't need wean most drivers away from their cars because congestion, when not exasperated by other factors, is caused by excess road usage that exceeds capacity not by an appropriate number of vehicles using the capacity available. And that excess usage can be a fairly small percentage of the total. So for CP to work well it only needs to dissuade a small percentage of drivers, or dissuade a larger percentage of drivers a small percentage of the time. In fact, if it pushed all or most drivers out of their cars it wouldn't make any money because there'd be no one to pay the charge or not enough people to counteract the administration costs. So one of the biggest benefits of CP would be lost.