CHICAGO | Politics and Current Events

[Handro]

So now the CTU is in charge of managing a major event in the height of summer violent season in 2024. I wonder how they are going to thread the needle here: clearly there will need to be a huge police presence leading up to and during the convention next summer, and I’m guessing there will be clashes with protesters. How will the CTU both minimize the importance of police while relying on them to keep the city from being humiliated?

[Vlajos]

Originally Posted by Handro

So now the CTU is in charge of managing a major event in the height of summer violent season in 2024. I wonder how they are going to thread the needle here: clearly there will need to be a huge police presence leading up to and during the convention next summer, and I’m guessing there will be clashes with protesters. How will the CTU both minimize the importance of police while relying on them to keep the city from being humiliated?

Lol, the mental gymnastics of the socialists will be priceless.

[moorhosj1]

Originally Posted by Vlajos

Lol, the mental gymnastics of the socialists will be priceless.

Almost as much as the mental gymnastics required to create this strawman argument.

[Chisouthside]

Originally Posted by moorhosj1

Almost as much as the mental gymnastics required to create this strawman argument.

For real, grown men creating their own boogeymen.

[Handro]

Originally Posted by moorhosj1

Almost as much as the mental gymnastics required to create this strawman argument.

How is it a strawman? Its based on the actual words of Johnson and the CTU. Johnson has made clear that his approach to public safety is not one that is based on immediate results, but a long-term plan based on community building. It may work and certainly the south and west sides need a new sort of investment, but it doesn't do much when there is just a little over a year until this massive national event. The CPD is full of guys that have clearly "quiet quit" and I'm not sure a mayor who has made clear his negative view of the department is going to motivate them to get it together and stretch themselves thin as the guys who can retire continue to leave the department.

You have a mayor that won based on his derision of the CPD and a police force rotten from diminished hiring standards and low morale. Seems like a troubling environment for 50,000 national politicos to come to town...

[SIGSEGV]

The RNC is in even more dangerous Milwaukee. And recent conventions have been in even more dangerous Philadelphia and Cleveland were fine. It will be ok.

[moorhosj1]

Originally Posted by Handro

You have a mayor that won based on his derision of the CPD and a police force rotten from diminished hiring standards and low morale.

Can you share these quotes/sources? I don’t recollect hearing him “deride the CPD” while campaigning. I do remember the FOP leader deriding Johnson.

[SamInTheLoop]

Originally Posted by SIGSEGV

The RNC is in even more dangerous Milwaukee. And recent conventions have been in even more dangerous Philadelphia and Cleveland were fine. It will be ok.

Yeah, there's a level of goofiness that's been on display here recently.
I'll 'charitably' chalk it up to some fox news brain seeping in. Regardless, it's dumb.

[Kenmore]

folks still losing their minds i see, lol

[VivaLFuego]

Originally Posted by Halsted & Villagio

Its early but I am really liking what I am seeing and hearing from Johnson so far - particularly like his constant drum beat of "uniting" the city. Will he deliver on this? Time will tell. But I like that he is putting that front and center. Do not favor one area over the others (something that has not happened in the past) - address them all 'equally' and if, anything, give special emphasis to those areas long neglected/bringing them up to where they likely would have been had they not been overlooked for decades. That will cut down on discontent/anger - which will likely cut down on crime.

In today's world, where most everything is at our fingertips, and we can literally see other parts on the world in real time, while sitting in our homes via Skype/Zoom, the world has gotten much smaller... and has expanded horizons. Whereas crime used to be firmly entrenched in 'pockets' just over a decade ago, making citizens in other areas of the city feel safe... that is no longer the case. That anger and discontent is traveling now... forcing us to get to the root cause if we want to lower crime... forcing us to address areas long overlooked/discriminated against by redlining and systemic disinvestment.

That may seem like a liberal agenda to some, but Paul Vallas spoke about many of these same issues and talked about how he would do the same thing - continue the mission to upgrade South & West. Again, I will repeat - these are our Harlems/Brooklyn/Bronx, etc. The spillage (for lack of a better term) coming from those areas effect all areas. That young man from Englewood with no hope/no job opportunities/no rec center/food desert/no library/lacking safe parks to play in... he goes North... he goes Downtown... etc. No amount of Policing on the streets can contain the anger he may be carrying with him - until after the damage has been done.
.

The issue with these "neglected" areas is a long-term lack of private investment - they already get tremendously more public expenditures and attention (in the form of infrastructure and services spending) than many other places that don't have nearly the same issues with crime and angry youths.

The amount of public spending required to move the needle -- say, with makework living-wage employment programs for all who want one, or proactively propping up land and property values and improving the housing stock -- is far beyond what Chicago could ever hope to raise in taxes.

Unless or until rampant criminality is improved (both in terms of personal safety and loss/insurance risk), I'm not optimistic for improvement in the outlook in most of the toughest neighborhoods. As it is now, there is adverse selection --- once they're able to, people just leave those neighborhoods to live and invest elsewhere, increasingly in the suburbs.

[Klippenstein]

Originally Posted by VivaLFuego

As it is now, there is adverse selection --- once they're able to, people just leave those neighborhoods to live and invest elsewhere, increasingly in the suburbs.

This is definitely not the case. Movement out of these neighborhoods is not increasing. You could argue it’s because most people already left, but either way, it’s not increasing.

[galleyfox]

Originally Posted by Klippenstein

This is definitely not the case. Movement out of these neighborhoods is not increasing. You could argue it’s because most people already left, but either way, it’s not increasing.

I would clarify this.

I believe abandonment of property has mostly stopped in all but the toughest blocks, since immigration and gentrification in surrounding neighborhoods are limiting housing options.

However, Chicago is extremely likely to show significant outmigration of low income native households from the city to the suburbs over the next decade.

Not increasing, but still a loss.

[Vlajos]

Originally Posted by VivaLFuego

The issue with these "neglected" areas is a long-term lack of private investment - they already get tremendously more public expenditures and attention (in the form of infrastructure and services spending) than many other places that don't have nearly the same issues with crime and angry youths.

The amount of public spending required to move the needle -- say, with makework living-wage employment programs for all who want one, or proactively propping up land and property values and improving the housing stock -- is far beyond what Chicago could ever hope to raise in taxes.

Unless or until rampant criminality is improved (both in terms of personal safety and loss/insurance risk), I'm not optimistic for improvement in the outlook in most of the toughest neighborhoods. As it is now, there is adverse selection --- once they're able to, people just leave those neighborhoods to live and invest elsewhere, increasingly in the suburbs.

This. And private investors won't step up until crime is under control.

[VivaLFuego]

Originally Posted by galleyfox

I would clarify this.

I believe abandonment of property has mostly stopped in all but the toughest blocks, since immigration and gentrification in surrounding neighborhoods are limiting housing options.

However, Chicago is extremely likely to show significant outmigration of low income native households from the city to the suburbs over the next decade.

Not increasing, but still a loss.

Agreed - intended message was that rather than moving else in the neighborhood or within the city, folks with means are more likely to move to the suburbs. This is related to the ongoing collapse in CPS enrollment in many neighborhoods.
https://www.illinoisreportcard.com/d...id=15016299025

[galleyfox]

Originally Posted by VivaLFuego

Agreed - intended message was that rather than moving else in the neighborhood or within the city, folks with means are more likely to move to the suburbs. This is related to the ongoing collapse in CPS enrollment in many neighborhoods.
https://www.illinoisreportcard.com/d...id=15016299025

In that regard, Klippenstein has a point that there’s not that many people with means left in neighborhoods like Englewood and Garfield Park to lose to the suburbs.

Households that make <$30K don’t really have a choice where they end up in the metro. Often the suburbs are the cheapest and sometimes only option.

Also most households are having far fewer children regardless of where they live in the country. Even though vacancy in many violent neighborhoods is probably the lowest in over a decade, they won’t see any population gains without the ability to afford new construction.

[tjp]

Originally Posted by VivaLFuego

The issue with these "neglected" areas is a long-term lack of private investment - they already get tremendously more public expenditures and attention (in the form of infrastructure and services spending) than many other places that don't have nearly the same issues with crime and angry youths.

The amount of public spending required to move the needle -- say, with makework living-wage employment programs for all who want one, or proactively propping up land and property values and improving the housing stock -- is far beyond what Chicago could ever hope to raise in taxes.

Unless or until rampant criminality is improved (both in terms of personal safety and loss/insurance risk), I'm not optimistic for improvement in the outlook in most of the toughest neighborhoods. As it is now, there is adverse selection --- once they're able to, people just leave those neighborhoods to live and invest elsewhere, increasingly in the suburbs.

It's sad, but this is what I think, too. I have some hopes for Johnson's youth employment push, but overall, I have a hard time believing anything he does is going to alleviate poverty and crime.

[Vlajos]

https://wgntv.com/news/chicagocrime/...-teens-gather/

[SIGSEGV]

Originally Posted by Vlajos

https://wgntv.com/news/chicagocrime/...-teens-gather/

yeah CPD and the city needs a better strategy to deal with pre-planned gatherings that they surely must know about hours ahead of time. This has been happening several weekends in the late spring/early summer for the last few years. Pretty obnoxious for us who live near Millennium Park (and it's the reason why you have to go to security at Millenium Park on most evenings, which is also very obnoxious, and clearly doesn't do much...). LL clearly hasn't come up with a good strategy here, hopefully BJ figures out something better.

Obviously most of the teens aren't doing anything worse than making noise and filming themselves doing shitty dancing, but there are some troublemakers. I did hear what sounded like gunshots and looked out my window to see CPD officers chasing after someone who maybe tried to get onto an L train (not sure, I wasn't at my window fast enough).

Just looked outside again and now seems to be more cops than teens on the street. I just saw them chase some kid down and handcuff him. Not sure what for (or if they got the right person... he came running out of an alley)

[galleyfox]

Originally Posted by SIGSEGV

y

Obviously most of the teens aren't doing anything worse than making noise and filming themselves doing shitty dancing, but there are some troublemakers. I did hear what sounded like gunshots and looked out my window to see CPD officers chasing after someone who maybe tried to get onto an L train (not sure, I wasn't at my window fast enough).

There were groups of people trying to break into the Art Institute, assaulting and shooting. Come on.

Make a law that gives harsh penalties for mob action and actually enforce it with a year or more in prison. For the same reason that organized looting should get a harsher punishment than mere shoplifting. Everybody in the city knows these things always turn into violent mobs at some point. The “they were just teens having tun” is excuse is wearing thin, since every single other teen in the city doesn’t do this.

The city has the right to enforce mass gatherings without a permit, and can enforce a curfew against all teens downtown after dark.

[SIGSEGV]

Originally Posted by galleyfox

There were groups of people trying to break into the Art Institute, assaulting and shooting. Come on.

Make a law that gives harsh penalties for mob action and actually enforce it with a year or more in prison. For the same reason that organized looting should get a harsher punishment than mere shoplifting. Everybody in the city knows these things always turn into violent mobs at some point. The “they were just teens having tun” is excuse is wearing thin, since every single other teen in the city doesn’t do this.

The city has the right to enforce mass gatherings without a permit, and can enforce a curfew against all teens downtown after dark.

I don't think I was making excuses, and I'm not trying to sugarcoat what some subset of the hundreds of teens were doing steps from my condo. I was mostly commenting on the incompetent handling of a certainly-telegraphed mass gathering. Arresting hundreds of people once the gathering materializes is impractical.