International Village Revitalization | Idea Pool/Concept

[Skook]

I too have heard rumours regarding horrid management. The current management seems to have no interest or ability to attract mainstream tenants to the building - read: not aimed exclusively at the Asian market - which you think they would put some effort into since the only successful businesses in the place are thoroughly mainstream (Starbucks, McDonalds, Quiznos, Rexall, the theatres, 7-11, pub, liquor store). Hendersons strategy here is peculiar, since even the genuine Chinatown is struggling to attract the Asian market these days (and Chinatown is a treasure, not just another mall). Perhaps they've ticked the retail industry off so badly that no one will deal with them anymore.

There is actually quite a bit of traffic through the mall these days, but once you're in the door, there is nothing to buy (I live right next door, so I'm painfully familiar with this topic).

With the population now in place in the area, all kinds of businesses could do well in there: a chain restaurant (Earls, White Spot, etc); a pizza delivery place; grocery store; bakery (come on Cobs - you can't buy fresh bread anywhere around here); etc.

Or something bigger - Costco does very well just around the corner, as mentioned previously. I've also heard rumours of a kids play area going in (Go Bananas type thing?), which could do well since there is so little of that sort of thing downtown.

I used to think Walmart should have gone in - they're a big draw and target the low end of the market (the DTES is probably the only place in the country where going to Walmart could be considered pretentious...)

[mr.x]

^ i would think the management there has a bad reputation considering how basically every store that tried to set up shop there has gone out of business.

lol, not too sure about walmart setting up shop so close to the DTES...the activists are gonna start thinking it's some sort of corporate invasion.

[nova9]

I think it would be neat if they moved a fashion design school there and fostered like a 'fashion mall' type feel. So you get that SFU central city concept of a school and office with retail. my reasoning is that the store units are very boutique like with the full glass walls - really, only clothing stands or art would fit a store like that as it is less limited to shelving.

it could be like an indoor extension of the boutiques on gastown. so it doesn't have to compete with the general shopping centres in the area and carve out a niche for itself. the boutiques would be a great place for local designers to show their designs.

The inspiration stems from the awesome Ayden Gallery at IV.

[jlousa]

Easiest way to add life to it is offer some ESL schools free rent, once they relocate in there, the place would be swarming with students with disposable income and stores would flock there. Of course you'd probably end up with more pizza by the slice places and a large smoke pit outside but that's life.

Henderson had contracted the fairchild guy to lease out IV but seeing how
Abredeen mall isn't doing all that great maybe it wasn't the best idea.

[wrenegade]

Originally Posted by hollywoodnorth

costco sure seems to do well why is that professor?

Well they are going to be exceptions. Costco is a draw into itself no matter where it is. If you put a Wal-Mart in International Village it would blow the doors off the place. But if you are talking about a regular mall/shopping centre, things are obviously more difficult.

[djh]

This is at least the third time over the years that the terrible state of International Village's tenant troubles has come up - at the very least, the third time I've read and contributed to the discussion. Everything covered above has been covered in detail before.

Yes, the Henderson staff are useless at finding, holding, maintaining and satisfying tenants.
Yes, the mall originally had really good tenants but due to broken promises from many parties (city, developers, property managers), the tenants bailed and some even sued.
I have at least 2 friends who own businesses in the place. One of them has had free rent for about 5 years because they were so unhappy with the mall's operations, and the mall did not want to lose one of their only decent clients

Yes, the idea of a school going in there has been touted before. A friend of mine is the Director of a large local postgraduate school. They were planning on opening a new wing in the building and got far in negotiations. I think the deal offered by Henderson made them cancel their plans. It would have transformed the mall.
No, I don't believe a Wallmart would not work there. There is a Costco literally around the corner, so the competition is too similar, and the market too small to support both

I like the idea suggested earlier about turning say 1 floor of the mall into offices, like at the Eaton Centre. I also like the idea of educational facilities going in. Or the idea of having a large children's play zone there (years back I had suggested something like San Francisco's Metreon, which was a Sony Playstation-themed free arcade, supported by Sony stores and high-tech shops). Might not work any more due to the fact nobody goes to arcades any more and everybody owns their own gaming rig.

No need for a supermarket. Costco does food cheaper than most places, and the chinese supermarket is across the road.

I think the best way for the mall to succeed, is EITHER for high-end places to go in, OR for Chinatown to expand and encompass the location and surrounding streets.

I would like to see what stores or uses that people think would flourish in International Village. Say, a Top 10 Stores you would like to see go in there.

My suggestions:
1 - Office Space (e.g., A-Class and B-Class space, tech space, tv/radio studios, etc.)
2 - School/College/ESL (BCIT/Langara/UBC/Emily Carr, etc.)
3 - Recreational area (kid's playzone - physical fun element)
4 - Recreational area 2 (teens/adults playzone - computer-based play)
5 - High-tech shops (not just a crappy suburban Sony store, but a high-tech area)
6 - Permanent crowd assembly area for street performers (buskers, singers, street performers) - whether it's in the ground foyer in the winter and out by Starbucks in the summer.
7 - Space for Chinatown merchants / Chinese-friendly stalls (e.g., semi-permanent stalls that can be erected and moved. If you've ever been to IV during Chinese New Year and seen how well the merchants do there that set up stalls, you'll get it)
8 - Unique and interesting independent shops (e.g., a bookshop, boutique clothing stores, music shop, computer software shop, DVD shop, children's goods shop, sportswear shop, bike shop, etc.) - maybe small chains ready to grow to the next stage. Think of the shops on W4th in Kits. The new towers around the area have enough customers to keep them in business
9 - A Library?
10 - Food delivery places (not more fast food restaurants, but more like a Domino's/Panago/Pizza Hut Delivery) - good central location to reach the surrounding neighbourhood

[EastVanMark]

Originally Posted by djmk

the firm i work for has/had clients from that mall. several were persuaded to sign leases because they were under an impression that the major tenant would be large BC Liquor Store.

i do not know whether the BC liquor store just never materialized or it was a lie...

BC Liquor Store Walmart, among others all tried to lease space at the site with no success. The money behind the development in the first place was from someone from Hong Kong who would only allow a certain type of store (namely high-end fashion stores) in the mall. Clues to this can be discovered by walking the upstairs and looking at the floors. He also didn't allow any big-name franchises in the food court. He was, however, a big movie buff, that is why he built at the time (and possibly even still is the most lush movie theatre in Vancouver). The seats chosen for those theatres are 2X as expensive as what is usually used in theatres.

When this grand vision never materialized, the tenants sued and to combat the court action, everyone was given reduced or had their rent outright eliminated.

Between this fellow and the other Asian mall owner in Richmond who decided to tear down his 10 year old mall because he didn't like the calibre of tenants he had attracted; can't figure out which one of the 2 has either too much money or not enough sense...

[Skook]

djh, you have some great ideas, but I have to disagree about the Walmart.

Now,this is a moot point, since Walmart isn't going in there anyway, and the neighbourhood couldn't really take the traffic it would generate with all the residential that's gone in lately, but Walmart absolutely would have done well in there (and in many other locations besides). I don't agree that they compete directly with Costco - they are very different stores, very different concepts and very different customers (most Walmart shoppers are not going to shell out for a Costco membership, for one thing).

As for a grocery store, I live in the area and I can assure you that we are not well served foodwise. Things should be better when the Nesters opens in Woodwards, but right now, we're limited to gigantic portions at Costco or Asian food at T&T. You are completely out of luck if you want to get, say, ingredients for a taco (a couple of tacos, not 400 tacos at Costco).

International Village does rock at Chinese New Year, but it wouldn't be like that if that was the concept year round (the night market a few blocks away is cool, but it doesn't draw huge crowds - if IV was like that all the time, it would be even deader).

In my humble opinion, the best options for that mall are in: a) serving the immediate local community (which would have to be upwards of 5000 fairly affluent condo owners once Woodwards opens) or b) add something large scale that is currently missing downtown, like the kids play area or a major retailer that will draw people in or c) getting out of the retail biz entirely a la office space or a school, etc.