Hamilton Harbour or Burlington Bay?

[Hammer Native]

Also another note. Hamilton contributes the majority of the tax money into the RBG.

[RePinion]

Originally Posted by SteelTown

I know tons of people that live in Burlington but work in Hamilton (McMaster)

Sure, some of them do. But I think many more Burlingtonians are commuting into Toronto than into Hamilton.

[RePinion]

Originally Posted by Hammer Native

When the Skyway was twinned in the late 1980's the Ontario government renamed it James N. Allan (I think a former transportation minister, not 100% sure) and put Burlington Bay name on it to compensate them for the fact they don't have the harbour. (What a load of B.S.)

The Skyway was not named to flatter Burlington's ego. It was called the Burlington Bay James N. Allan Skyway because it runs along a strip of land which has always been known as Burlington Beach and along a body of water always called Burlington Bay (at least officially if not colloquially). James N. Allan was finance minister and I believe also minister of Highways. I think the bridge may have been named after Allan in recognition of his long service as Niagara Parks Commission Chairman.

[Hammer Native]

Originally Posted by RePinion

The Skyway was not named to flatter Burlington's ego. It was called the Burlington Bay James N. Allan Skyway because it runs along a strip of land which has always been known as Burlington Beach and along a body of water always called Burlington Bay (at least officially if not colloquially). James N. Allan was finance minister and I believe also minister of Highways. I think the bridge may have been named after Allan in recognition of his long service as Niagara Parks Commission Chairman.

That was the Ontario government's story back then as to why they were putting Burlington's name on it. Probably not the official reason. (like I said probably a load of B.S.)

[flar]

I think more Hamiltonians commute to Burlington than vice versa. It's still a Hamilton suburb. In Hamilton as in many other cities, both residential and employment has flowed to the suburbs where land is flat and cheap and serviced by important freeways (QEW).

Not all of Burlington's wealth comes from Toronto, either. Ron Joyce, Ron Foxcroft, Juergen Schachler (Dofasco CEO) and many big players in Hamilton live in Burlington. A lot of Burlingtonians are from Hamilton and think they've escaped. The area between Toronto and Hamilton increasingly sustains itself; the interconnections in the Golden Horseshoe just keep growing.

I think Hamilton and Hamiltonians should try claim more ownership of Burlington. We don't want a Mississauga situation where the suburb gets too big for its britches.

[HAMRetrofit]

Wealth is distributed throughout the entire Hamilton-Toronto Mega Region. Wherever the wealthy now reside, the origins of major economic activity stem from the old city centers, Toronto and Hamilton. The suburbs are just natural extensions of growth of these cities. Call Burlington or Mississauga whatever you want too but the fact that they are successful is reliant on spill off growth from the two original major cities.

[realcity]

Originally Posted by RePinion

The Skyway was not named to flatter Burlington's ego. It was called the Burlington Bay James N. Allan Skyway because it runs along a strip of land which has always been known as Burlington Beach and along a body of water always called Burlington Bay (at least officially if not colloquially). James N. Allan was finance minister and I believe also minister of Highways. I think the bridge may have been named after Allan in recognition of his long service as Niagara Parks Commission Chairman.

It also runs along a strip of land called Hamilton Beach Strip and Hamilton Harbour... yet no reference to Hamilton in the bridge's name. it's bs./

[ihateittoo]

I think the point is that Hamilton Harbour and Hamilton Beach Strip are less historic names for the area and probably came into common use in an unoficial manner. I see no problem with the "standard use" naming. RBG - on the other hand - I would like to annex for hamiltron.

[realcity]

map of the border of Hamilton and SC.... nothing but wasteland in SC



this is according to who paid property taxes to which city before amalg. Eastgate is Hamilton.

[realcity]

and it's GRAY ROAD, not GRAYS....

interesting tho.... it might have to do with historical reference RED COATS = British (United Empire Loyalists) and the GRAY COATS or 'GRAYS' (AMERICANS) who were stopped by the British Red Coats at Battlefield Park in that area. Perhaps the GRAYS got as far as Gray Road.

Either way Stoney Creek sucks really bad... the downtown is about the size of town center of a town of 3,000. The biggest joke is their "City Hall" that was built in the middle of nowhere and even after amalg the 'New' City found it difficult to find use for a 'city hall' built in the middle of farm fields. Actually SC is a geography of nowhere. I remember when the moment they hit 50,000 population they petitioned the Province to be designated a "city" the minimum amount of people required for a city designation. Something Oakville still refuses to be called even though they have a population of 150,000 Oakville is still considered a "town". Must be a serious inferiority complex with SC. Try being a real city before your get the name designation.

[raisethehammer]

Originally Posted by realcity

that's incorrect. Stoney Creek is 662 and 664 exchanges the Centennial corridor is 578

The (old) border extends down Highway 20 until King street then heads east to Lake Ave north to Barton then East yet again all the way to Gray Road (which by the way the morons in SC call "Grays") then north to the Lake.

Those apartment complexes at Lake and Barton area were under the old Hamilton Housing Authority. There was a citizen uproar from the east side residents of Lake Avenue Road (the Stoney Creek) because Hamilton was building 'geared to income' high-rises on the very fringe of the City of Hamilton.

yes, this is correct. Eastgate Square is in Hamilton. As is much of that neighbourhood NE of Eastgate. Including ALL of the highrises clumped together.

[raisethehammer]

Originally Posted by hamiltonguy

Another note.

Raisethehammer claims that Aldershot was part of Hamilton.

This is not technically true.



This was not because of any Toronto-centric policy, but because at this time Flamborough was mostly rural, and the populated portion of Aldershot was closer to Burlington.

Also Burlington is a Hamilton suburb, not a Toronto suburb, so really this is nothing to do with Toronto, merely a minor boundary adjustment.

The argument over the RBG is because the main facilities are in Burlington, on Plains road, even though 70% of the land is in Hamilton.

However, I think it should still be called Hamilton's RBG because Burlington is a suburb of Hamilton, the main facilities are less than a Km from the Hamilton border, and, as already mentioned, 70% of the land is in Hamilton.

I didn't say it was part of Hamilton. It was supposed to be. Talk to politicians who were around back then and for many years it was assumed that when borders were redrawn Aldershot would be annexed to Hamilton.

[raisethehammer]

Originally Posted by HAMRetrofit

Wealth is distributed throughout the entire Hamilton-Toronto Mega Region. Wherever the wealthy now reside, the origins of major economic activity stem from the old city centers, Toronto and Hamilton. The suburbs are just natural extensions of growth of these cities. Call Burlington or Mississauga whatever you want too but the fact that they are successful is reliant on spill off growth from the two original major cities.

exactly right. Hamilton's steel built all of those fancy homes on North Shore Blvd.

[the dude]

for those who don't know, here's how far outside of town stoner crick's town hall is. totally bizarre-o.

[Millstone]

Originally Posted by realcity

and it's GRAY ROAD, not GRAYS....

interesting tho.... it might have to do with historical reference RED COATS = British (United Empire Loyalists) and the GRAY COATS or 'GRAYS' (AMERICANS) who were stopped by the British Red Coats at Battlefield Park in that area. Perhaps the GRAYS got as far as Gray Road.

Either way Stoney Creek sucks really bad... the downtown is about the size of town center of a town of 3,000. The biggest joke is their "City Hall" that was built in the middle of nowhere and even after amalg the 'New' City found it difficult to find use for a 'city hall' built in the middle of farm fields. Actually SC is a geography of nowhere. I remember when the moment they hit 50,000 population they petitioned the Province to be designated a "city" the minimum amount of people required for a city designation. Something Oakville still refuses to be called even though they have a population of 150,000 Oakville is still considered a "town". Must be a serious inferiority complex with SC. Try being a real city before your get the name designation.

Markham has 261k and is still a town too.

the City of Port Colborne has about 18k I think.

[Hammer Native]

I don't want to drag on the subject too much, but on the question of Gray's Road verses Gray Road it's actually both. The Hamilton section which starts just south of Barton and runs to the lake is Gray's Road. The Stoney Creek section to the foot of the mountain is Gray Road. It's just a case of the former two separate cities not agreeing on a common name. Last time I checked the street signs still said that. (that was several months ago mind you.) You would think since we have been amalgamated seven years now they could work that out.

Here's another confusing one. There's a sign on the west mountain "Stone Church Road West ends, Stone Church Road begins. (that being the new extension into the former Ancaster boundary.) Again since we're one city, I don't know why they couldn't have just called the whole thing Stone Church Road West and kept it simple. I think it was that in the first place and they went and changed it.

[realcity]

I took my car to a place off Gray Road north of Barton (the Hamilton section you're referring to) and every street sign said Gray Road, even in the northern industrial area. I told the guy in the business that I was patronizing "you know the signs say 'Gray Road' not Grays like you told me over the phone". His response was "really?"

[Hammer Native]

Originally Posted by realcity

I took my car to a place off Gray Road north of Barton (the Hamilton section you're referring to) and every street sign said Gray Road, even in the northern industrial area. I told the guy in the business that I was patronizing "you know the signs say 'Gray Road' not Grays like you told me over the phone". His response was "really?"

Looks like they finally decided on the one name, it must have been fairly recent, but I can't remember when I was down there last. There was even an article in the Spectator last year about the name discrepancy, and maybe that prompted city hall to straighten it out. Yeah, it probably came as a surprise to the business people in the northern industrial section.

[raisethehammer]

yea, I remember when there was some 'debate' about which name to stick with. it was Gray and Grays for a while there.
At any rate, we've solved the issue of where Eastgate Square lies.

[realcity]

The entire commercial stretch (both sides) of Centennial is in Hamilton. The east side stretch of Centennial that lies within SC is residential.