Guide: How to Become a Developer

[ChiTownCity]

Originally Posted by siunate2324

Chitowncity, you have finally prompted me to get an account on SSP...I've been lurking these forums daily since about 2004 when I was about 14, but never registered since I really have no pertinent info to share. For years I've learned alot about development and real estate on this website listening to the guys like SpyGuy, Bvic, Tup, etc. and I have to say thanks to every1 on Chicago's page for sharing their opinions and knowledge about developments, etc. as its helped me over the years to decide and begin reaching my goals. You guys have really helped me focus on TOD, projects' density, how to fight nimbys in a positive way, storefront retail. etc. and overall what makes a good development.

Since I was a kid I wanted to be an architect and I left high school with the intention of getting an architecture degree at Siu-c. I basically spent my first 1.5 years there as a premajor, then basically through this website I learned a developer arguably can have a much greater impact on architecture than the architect himself. (and im not artistic/tedious enough for it neway) So now Im a jr n my major is finance specializing in real estate with a double minor in management and accounting.

As I'm finishing my undergrad I'm really starting to search for networking and job opportunities like shadowing, internships, etc. I am going to probably start trying to network by volunteering with CAF (chicago arch. foundation). Then I would LOVE to get an MRED for grad school and Im just starting to learn about that program. If anybody has any info on that it'd be much appreciated. Also I'd like to begin to build my capital and rep by starting at a major development company in Chicago. I was wondering if I could get some SSP'ers opinion on what they think are some of the best and most promising development companies in/around Chicago.

I'd love to start a thread for this but being new not really sure how to do much. I'm just a college kid hoping to gain some more knowledge so I can hopefully some day have an impact on development in the greatest city in the world. Someday I hope I can listen to ur guys demands (And get rid of those DAMN surface lots, n keep as many old buildings standing as possible)

Well I'm glad I motivated you lol

Nowhereman, would you mind if I send you a PM if i have any future questions? (and that goes to everyone else willing to help as well)...

[Nowhereman1280]

^^^ Sure, feel free to. If they are questions that aren't personal or private, you should ask them in this thread though so everyone can learn from the discussion.

Originally Posted by aic4ever

The engineering side of things was fantastic all around, but tough sledding though. I knew a LOT of pretty smart people that couldn't hack it there so if you're wavering on your work ethic, IIT is not the place for you.

If you are wavering on your work ethic than real estate development is not the place for you. Actually, the whole industry is like that. If you don't work hard, you won't make it in real estate.

[ChiTownCity]

Getting a Real Estate Broker License doesn't require a degree just being 21 years old and the 75 hours pre-license courses. A real estate broker basically sells real estate that's owned by other people correct? This is a job that doesn't need any prior experience that I can do temporarily while in school? This is similar or different to a Leasing Consultant?

I really don't want to get side-tracked.

Would: getting an Associates Degree in Business Administration 1st

Then, a Bachelors of Science degree in business financing and/or management or something secondary

And after that, Just take a few courses in Urban Design as a Minor (or would that be a whole other degree in its self?)...

Be a good route?

Since I have multiple places to live I was planning on using as much of my income as possible for the 1st 2-3 years after I graduate to get rid of my student loans. I'm estimating I would need to make atleast somewhere in the ball park of $40k a year to knock out the vast majority pending on where I decide to attend (hopefully I would be able to get a scholarship). I was thinking after I graduate I can by 1-2 lots and/or get one property to rent out to start.

[Jasoncw]

Good luck everyone! The world needs more Herb Greenwalds.

[Amanita]

I've contemplated development as a career- this is a long term thing, but I eventually would like to have my own skyscraper

Only thing is, I'm not the kind of person you think of when you think corporate or business type. I am so NOT the suit-wearing, buttoned down type. Unfortunately being (and looking the part of a non-conformist) doesn't always go down well in the business world

[hammersklavier]

I'm working on creating a startup that I can leverage into development...needless to say, I'm thinking big.

[tayser]

^ join the club. MINES BIGGER THAN YOURS

[Amanita]

So is there any place in the development world for an oddball like me? Can I play the game without having to wear suits and pretending to be something I'm not? Learning Urban studies and business is one thing, completely hiding and suppressing myself is a whole other- something I've never been able to do.

No, I'm not some wild and raging freak, but I would hate to have to never be seen at a public Pagan event or sci-fi convention again, or wear clothes I really like in public again (see my pic in the skybar thread on nightclub entrance rules) lest those be held against me.

[ChiTownCity]

^lol well I think I look pretty darn good in a suit. I don't think your attire will matter much outside of when you're presenting yourself to a potential buyer or investor...

[Nowhereman1280]

Originally Posted by ChiTownCity

Getting a Real Estate Broker License doesn't require a degree just being 21 years old and the 75 hours pre-license courses. A real estate broker basically sells real estate that's owned by other people correct? This is a job that doesn't need any prior experience that I can do temporarily while in school? This is similar or different to a Leasing Consultant?

Essentially. You need to do 120 hours of courses for Broker. Don't waste your time with the 75 hour Salesperson course. You may want to take the courses in person, but I did it all online in about two months. Granted it might take you longer since I had quite a bit of experience (2 years doing closings) in real estate before I did it. Another thing about doing it in person is that you get to network with the others in your class which can be useful.

I really don't want to get side-tracked.

Would: getting an Associates Degree in Business Administration 1st

Then, a Bachelors of Science degree in business financing and/or management or something secondary

And after that, Just take a few courses in Urban Design as a Minor (or would that be a whole other degree in its self?)...

Be a good route?

If your credits towards Associates Degree in Business can be transferred towards your core coursework in a Bachelors program in finance program I would transfer to the Bachelors as soon as possible, it will be the fastest route to getting the basic financial grounding you need.

Also, if you spend enough time on here, you don't need to know shit about urban studies because this site will school you better than any course can on urban studies. I would focus very heavily on finance and any real estate economics or finance courses they offer.

PS you said your GPA is a 2.8 or so. That is what I had in High School and I got into Loyola and ended up with like a 3.8 by the time I was done with Loyola. I also got a good deal of financial aid and scholarships, so at least give applying there a try.

Since I have multiple places to live I was planning on using as much of my income as possible for the 1st 2-3 years after I graduate to get rid of my student loans. I'm estimating I would need to make atleast somewhere in the ball park of $40k a year to knock out the vast majority pending on where I decide to attend (hopefully I would be able to get a scholarship). I was thinking after I graduate I can by 1-2 lots and/or get one property to rent out to start.

Don't start with new construction, its much more capital intensive and risky. Start doing rehabs of single family homes and two flats. You don't need to worry about your student loan debt if you can hold down a job at $40k a year. You should be able to maintain about $180k in total debt on a $40k salary. That should be enough to allow you to get your first property (use an FHA loan and live in the property while you renovate it).

Don't get a job as a residential realtor, just start working as soon as you can in real estate law, for a developer, for a REIT, for a consultant, for anyone you can find who will give you work that involves the mechanics of real estate.

Originally Posted by Amanita

So is there any place in the development world for an oddball like me? Can I play the game without having to wear suits and pretending to be something I'm not? Learning Urban studies and business is one thing, completely hiding and suppressing myself is a whole other- something I've never been able to do.

No, I'm not some wild and raging freak, but I would hate to have to never be seen at a public Pagan event or sci-fi convention again, or wear clothes I really like in public again (see my pic in the skybar thread on nightclub entrance rules) lest those be held against me.

Yes there is room for the most eclectic people in Real Estate. Just don't display that side of yourself when you are trying to network. In other words, as long as you don't mix your personal and work lives until you have more money than you know what to do with, then you'll be fine. Once you make an assload you can do whatever you want and no one can tell you not to.

[ChiTownCity]

^Thanks! I already know I'll be back with more questions in the future so bare with me...

[Copes]

Hey this thread is a great help, I've actually been looking for something like this since I joined the forum. I saw another poster say something that is exactly similar to me. When people ask me what I plan to do when I finish school, my answer is always "build a skyscraper." Then I'll become Prime Minister. I don't want my goals to be too unreasonable.

I've got a few questions for anyone willing to answer them. I'm not looking to start with my own developments, I'd love to come out of school and start working for an already established company to gain some experience in the industry. The school I attend has a general Bachelor of Business Administration Program, and no electives focus too much on real estate. Would finance and investment likely be the way to go in terms of choosing my electives? What other general business courses might be useful? Also, in regards to working for some already established companies, what sort of experience would be recommended? What are some entry level jobs? Are there even any entry level jobs?

Thanks a lot, and to anyone else willing to share their stories regarding how they got into the business, I'd be very interested in hearing about it.

[Nowhereman1280]

^^^ Finance is extremely useful in development. Accounting also is helpful, but it seems to me most developer types despise it and like to relegate the function to designated accounting lackeys (called "Accountants"). However, knowing your away around accounting law certainly can be useful.

As far as work goes, I would recommend taking any job you can get that pertains to real estate. I worked for two years while I was in college at a real estate lawyer and I learned a ton. In this market get an internship or job or whatever, money doesn't matter, the experience is what is important.

Read all my previous posts in this thread, I'm sure they will be useful...

[Copes]

Originally Posted by Nowhereman1280

^^^ Finance is extremely useful in development. Accounting also is helpful, but it seems to me most developer types despise it and like to relegate the function to designated accounting lackeys (called "Accountants"). However, knowing your away around accounting law certainly can be useful.

As far as work goes, I would recommend taking any job you can get that pertains to real estate. I worked for two years while I was in college at a real estate lawyer and I learned a ton. In this market get an internship or job or whatever, money doesn't matter, the experience is what is important.

Read all my previous posts in this thread, I'm sure they will be useful...

They were, and thanks for the reply. I'll be keeping my eye on this thread over the coming year or so as I finish my degree. Every tip is a useful one.

[Nowhereman1280]

Any questions, just ask! I'm no pro yet, but I'll share my experiences and what I learn as I get deeper into the profession.

[Copes]

Any tips on approaching prospective employers who have no type of job postings indicating available positions? Especially if you have minimal experience in the field. While I've held some impressive jobs / internships, none have anything to do with real estate. I'm going to be hitting up most of the developers in my city come January, but none of them are actively looking to hire student as far as I can tell.

[Nowhereman1280]

^^^ Just find out if they have any sort of HR (though they probably won't) and contact the HR person with a letter or phone call and find out if they have any positions. If they don't, simply offer to work for free since you are a student. Make sure you have a well-crafted letter explaining all of this and the fact that you have a passion for Real Estate, etc.

If there is no HR department, go straight to the top and try to get in contact with whoever the owner/head hauncho at the company is. You can do this in a number of ways, first search them on Google and see if you can get their contact info. If you can't try calling and asking for them (likely won't work, secretary usually intercepts you). The best trick is just finding the email for someone else at the company and then figuring out the naming protocol for their email. By this I mean if you see John Smith has an email of jsmith@ABCdeveloper.com, then you know the CEO, David Johnson, probably has an email address of djohnson@ABCdeveloper.com. I've actually used this trick before and have gotten direct responses from some pretty high up people as a result. They are often impressed that you were clever enough to use this simple trick to get in contact with them.

From there its simple, just tell them that you'd really like to work for them and will even do it for free. If they let you come do some work for free, work your ass off to prove your value and they'll often move you to a paid position after a while.

[ChiTownCity]

okay so I'm one credit short from being able to transfer which doesn't really matter since I plan on leaving for the fall semester.

I'm looking at taking a quick course between Intro to modern business & business law and environment. Which would be a better choice?

[Nowhereman1280]

Well it depends on what intro to modern business covers. It could be a lot of fluff. Personally business Law was the all around most useful course I took in school, but I don't know how similar business law and the environment will be to it.

[ChiTownCity]

Okay I got a few more questions open to anyone that has an answer:

1.) What are some other names/terms that Developers go by because usually
when I mention that I want to be an urban developer to my professor's or
the average joe none of them seem to have a clue on what I'm talking
about or think I'm trying to become an urban planner. And just googling
urban developer doesn't get me much results.

2.) What's the average age group, if you had to make a guess, that the
average developer is?

3.) How long does the average developer's career last if you had to make a
guess?

4.) Do you have any good recommendations on books that discusses
development?

5.) On average do developers work for a company or do they create their
own?