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  #21  
Old Posted Apr 11, 2022, 3:43 PM
OTownandDown OTownandDown is offline
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If Bank Street in the Glebe HAS a density cap, this would not be it.

Sorry if there's traffic, you live in a City. Move closer and walk.

Bus-frequency is not yet at maximum capacity during day-to-day operation, and it's a 5 minute bus ride to the CBD, if that's what you're worried about.

Current underground parking for residents at Lansdowne should be minimized, and new parking for games should also be minimized. I know it's not a popular sentiment, but here we are. I've never had a problem parking 6-7-8 blocks away, on the street, and attending a game. (although I prefer to walk)
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  #22  
Old Posted Apr 11, 2022, 6:13 PM
Uhuniau Uhuniau is offline
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Originally Posted by J.OT13 View Post
How will it not cast a shadow? It's a wall of towers directly south of the entertainment district.
It will not cast a shadow over the same place for the entire day.

Even if it did - which it won't, because the planet rotates - so what? Shade is exaggerated as a problem.

Quote:
Bank is a traditional main street and Lansdowne a medium density entertainment district. The area is not served by rapid transit. This is not an appropriate spot for such tall buildings. 25 floors closest to Bank, and up to 8 floors for the two towers to the east would be more reasonable.
There is no contradiction between buildings having tallness and their being on a traditional main street.
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  #23  
Old Posted Apr 11, 2022, 6:16 PM
Uhuniau Uhuniau is offline
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Originally Posted by OTownandDown View Post
Bus-frequency is not yet at maximum capacity during day-to-day operation, and it's a 5 minute bus ride to the CBD, if that's what you're worried about.
Please tell me more about this five-minute bus ride.

(We could, very easily, have a 10-ish minute transit connection from Lansdown to the downtown core... if the NCC and the nosey neighbours would get over themselves and allow transit on the driveway.)
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  #24  
Old Posted Apr 11, 2022, 7:32 PM
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Originally Posted by OTownandDown View Post
Bus-frequency is not yet at maximum capacity during day-to-day operation, and it's a 5 minute bus ride to the CBD, if that's what you're worried about.
With no traffic and hitting every green light, sure 5, minutes however, I've seen countless traffic jams where buses (or any motor vehicle) don't move at all. In those times, it could take 30-40 minutes for that 3 km ride.

Then there's reliability. Will the bus actually show up? Maybe a platoon of 2-3-4 buses will arrive all at once 45 minutes (and 30 minutes, and 15 minutes) later than scheduled.
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  #25  
Old Posted Apr 11, 2022, 7:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Uhuniau View Post
It will not cast a shadow over the same place for the entire day.

Even if it did - which it won't, because the planet rotates - so what? Shade is exaggerated as a problem.
One tall tower, yes, but when it's a wall of towers, it casts a much wider shadow, so those shadows last much longer. In a City with below 0 temperatures for 4-5 months, it's nice to have a little sunshine to warm you up.
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  #26  
Old Posted Apr 11, 2022, 7:48 PM
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Williamoforange Williamoforange is offline
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Originally Posted by J.OT13 View Post
One tall tower, yes, but when it's a wall of towers, it casts a much wider shadow, so those shadows last much longer. In a City with below 0 temperatures for 4-5 months, it's nice to have a little sunshine to warm you up.
Its not a wall of tower, seriously can you stop with the hyperbole of what a single picture is suggesting.

Last edited by Williamoforange; Apr 11, 2022 at 8:47 PM.
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  #27  
Old Posted Apr 11, 2022, 7:49 PM
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Originally Posted by OTownandDown View Post

Bus-frequency is not yet at maximum capacity during day-to-day operation, and it's a 5 minute bus ride to the CBD, if that's what you're worried about.
For years I travelled from Westboro Transitway Station to McLeod/Bank. I would get on/off the transitway at Bank St. I always walked down Bank, and always took note of when one of the Bank St buses passed me.. and how much time it would have saved if I caught it. Bottom line, 95% of the time it was faster to do the 11 minute walk, than wait and catch a bus.

Exactly the same with McLeod/Bank to Landsdowne. Was almost always faster to do the 15 minute walk rather than waiting for a bus, and then chugging ever-so-slowly along Bank.

5 minutes in an on-demand air-taxi.. maybe.
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  #28  
Old Posted Apr 11, 2022, 8:27 PM
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waterloowarrior waterloowarrior is offline
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Trinity has removed the render from their website... oops!
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  #29  
Old Posted Apr 11, 2022, 8:30 PM
LRTeverywhere LRTeverywhere is offline
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Originally Posted by waterloowarrior View Post
Trinity has removed the render from their website... oops!
They can't remove it from the video on their home page as easily
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  #30  
Old Posted Apr 11, 2022, 10:23 PM
lrt's friend lrt's friend is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OTownandDown View Post
If Bank Street in the Glebe HAS a density cap, this would not be it.

Sorry if there's traffic, you live in a City. Move closer and walk.

Bus-frequency is not yet at maximum capacity during day-to-day operation, and it's a 5 minute bus ride to the CBD, if that's what you're worried about.

Current underground parking for residents at Lansdowne should be minimized, and new parking for games should also be minimized. I know it's not a popular sentiment, but here we are. I've never had a problem parking 6-7-8 blocks away, on the street, and attending a game. (although I prefer to walk)
Why are you encouraging people to drive to major events at Lansdowne?

"Sorry if there's traffic, you live in a City. Move closer and walk. " That just tells people not to bother going there and that is exactly what has been happening with all of downtown for decades.
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  #31  
Old Posted Apr 11, 2022, 10:34 PM
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They can't remove it from the video on their home page as easily
Great catch, I never bothered to watch the whole thing
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  #32  
Old Posted Apr 12, 2022, 11:28 AM
Friedrich Nietzsche Friedrich Nietzsche is offline
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With the stands full of people, there is absolutely no discernible difference between the north side from the 1960s, 70s, 80s & 90s and today's "refurbished" north side. Not on TV anyway. Every time the camera pans over to the north side, I cringe. Such a shame. The novelty of this mess will be wearing off very very quickly. You can bank on it.
"The novelty of this mess will be wearing off very very quickly. You can bank on it". They called him crazy lol
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  #33  
Old Posted Apr 27, 2022, 11:02 AM
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$330M 'Lansdowne 2.0' proposal would knit arena into berm, add 1,200 new homes
https://ottawacitizen.com/news/local...1200-new-homes
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  #34  
Old Posted Apr 27, 2022, 11:47 AM
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Originally Posted by waterloowarrior View Post
$330M 'Lansdowne 2.0' proposal would knit arena into berm, add 1,200 new homes
https://ottawacitizen.com/news/local...1200-new-homes
Well, there it is. I'm glad it's Hobin/BBB and not RLA at least. I still don't get how that many units will work at Lansdowne but we'll see...
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  #35  
Old Posted Apr 27, 2022, 11:48 AM
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Originally Posted by waterloowarrior View Post
$330M 'Lansdowne 2.0' proposal would knit arena into berm, add 1,200 new homes
https://ottawacitizen.com/news/local...1200-new-homes
$330M 'Lansdowne 2.0' proposal would knit arena into berm, add 1,200 new homes
On May 6, the city's finance and economic development committee will be asked to make a recommendation to council on OSEG's proposal, plus any city-led improvements to the urban park.

Jon Willing, Ottawa Citizen
Publishing date: Apr 27, 2022 • 1 hour ago • 5 minute read




Lansdowne Park’s next transformation will include a replacement arena on the property, new north-side stands and 1,200 additional residential units, if city council accepts a $330-million proposal by the Ottawa Sports and Entertainment Group.

Mark Goudie, president and CEO of OSEG, said the company had delivered a “Lansdowne 2.0” plan meeting city council’s criteria for another phase of redevelopment at the historic property.

“They asked us to come back with a proposal that updated their facilities, that respected the Lansdowne guiding principles that are as still relevant now as they were back in 2012 and do it on a self-financing basis,” Goudie said. “A lot of hard work went into this with our partner, but I’m really excited for where we got to.”

Goudie said the proposal was designed to protect municipal taxpayers and to ensure the site’s financial viability.

On May 6, the city’s finance and economic development committee will be asked to make a recommendation to council on OSEG’s proposal, plus any city-led improvements to the urban park.

In July 2021, council directed staff to work with OSEG on the next revitalization plan for Lansdowne on the understanding that the proposal wouldn’t financially hurt the city and wouldn’t require city tax money to prop up OSEG operations.

The Lansdowne 2.0 proposal aims to tackle key projects left out of the first $425-million redevelopment, most significantly the aging structure holding both the north-side stands of the stadium and the arena, which opened in 1967.

The city’s partnership with OSEG lasts until Dec. 31, 2054, reflecting a 10-year extension approved by council in 2020. The two partners have been working on making their arrangement more financially sustainable, especially as sports and entertainment events return during the COVID-19 pandemic.

Part of the solution is refreshing and slimming down the city-owned sports facilities for better fan experiences.

The proposed event centre arena would have 5,500 seats for hockey and a larger capacity for concerts, compared to the 9,500 seats under the current arenas roof. OSEG took advice from consultants who had assessed the Ottawa market.

The green roof on the event centre would roughly follow the highest point of the berm as it exists today. The facility would be inserted into a replaced berm so that, aesthetically, it would appear as an extension of the landscaping feature. (The Moving Spaces art installation on the berm would be retained).

However, the green roof wouldn’t be designed so it was accessible to the public. OSEG has found that additional load-bearing infrastructure would increase the construction price.

New north-side stands with 11,200 seats, but capable of holding 12,000 spectators, would be the other half of the sports amenities upgrade. The demolition and construction schedule would mean there would be two football seasons without north-side stands; OSEG would use temporary stands to handle 35 per cent of the current north-side capacity.

The 1,200 new homes would be built in a configuration still to be determined, but three towers are penciled into the plan for now. Two towers would have rental units and one tower would have condos. OSEG is classifying 10 per cent of residential units as “affordable,” created in partnership with an affordable housing provider. The “air rights” sale would be the subject of a city-led competitive procurement process.

The proposal includes 720 additional underground parking spaces to serve the residential units.

The current 41,000 square feet of commercial space behind the north-side stands would be replaced with 100,000 square feet of mixed-use retail space in a podium for the towers. The podium would be pulled in from the sidewalk, creating a clearer view of the Aberdeen Pavilion from Bank Street.

The residential development would help fund the bulk of the larger redevelopment project thanks to the development air rights and increased property taxes. A third stream of revenue would be event ticket fees.

OSEG and the city have also been talking about revising the financial “waterfall” scheme to ensure an even split of net revenue flowing from Lansdowne.

The city would continue to own the sports facilities.

Hobin Architecture and Brisbin Brook Beynon (BBB) Architects have teamed with OSEG on the proposal. BBB is designing the municipal facilities, while Hobin is taking care of the site plan and mixed-use buildings.

OSEG is ready to break ground on a new event centre as early as November if council gives the go-ahead. The 23-month project would be the first phase of Lansdowne 2.0.

Phase 2 would include the north-side stands, retail podium and parking, lasting between December 2024 and May 2027. The residential towers are slated as Phase 3, starting in 2024 and ending in 2029, though the first residents would arrive in 2027.

Part of the Great Lawn would be required for construction staging.

There’s still plenty of public consultation required for the project, especially when it comes to the residential development since that would be subject to a land-use planning process.

Anthony Carricato, who chairs a Glebe Community Association committee on Lansdowne, said he was disappointed there hadn’t been more consultation leading up to a proposal for council consideration.

While the community association supports the city’s intensification goals, it questions how much residential density is suitable for Lansdowne Park and whether there will be enough deeply affordable homes, Carricato said.

Carricato said the community association still had major concerns about transportation to and from Lansdowne, and members also questioned why the city and OSEG were hurrying to get a plan approved when ideas should be batted around during the municipal election campaign.

“There’s a lack of faith that this time around it’s going to work,” Carricato said. “Concepts should come with alternatives, not just, ‘Here’s the best option.'”

On the other hand, the city’s main tourism agency likes what OSEG has drafted.

“Every piece of this has some opportunities,” said Michael Crockatt, president and CEO of Ottawa Tourism.

The OSEG proposal is “so well-aligned” with the desires of Ottawa Tourism, said Crockatt, who talked up the potential of attracting new events with upgraded amenities at Lansdowne.

“The events that come to Lansdowne can’t be held anywhere else,” Crockatt said.

Businesses at Lansdowne are eager for another round of improvements.

Sunset Grill franchise owner Dean Stresman said businesses would benefit from more people living at the site. Many of his most loyal customers live in the Rideau condo tower next to the stadium.

Stresman said residents needed something to be excited about after more than two years of life upended by COVID-19.

“It gives the whole City of Ottawa something to look forward to,” Stresman said.

jwilling@postmedia.com
twitter.com/JonathanWilling

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  #36  
Old Posted Apr 27, 2022, 1:02 PM
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Interesting. There is a lot to digest in this proposal. It appears that the idea of putting the arena on the end is to allow them to build it without closing the existing arena. That may be sacrificing good design for practicality. Same thing with taking away the north side roof, which is not ideal in our climate.

I also wonder how much of the park will be taken up and how much space they will lose for festivals and events. It looks like a lot. The berm is a pretty popular spot and a cool feature for concerts, and it's clear that won't be accessible anymore. I can't imagine them fitting in an arena without eating into a big chunk of the great lawn.

I definitely support the additional housing, which really should have been part of the first phase. I am wondering how they will get 720 more parking spots there, and how much they will need to expand the entrance/exit. Ideally they will just make everything pedestrian only, or pedestrian only evenings and weekends, which will make it more of a people place.
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  #37  
Old Posted Apr 27, 2022, 1:07 PM
c_speed3108 c_speed3108 is offline
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The biggest concern I see is that if the Green Roof on the arena (aka the replaced berm) can not support a few people sunbathing or having a picnic lunch then it certainly would not support adding temporary seating for a larger event such as a Grey Cup game.
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  #38  
Old Posted Apr 27, 2022, 1:08 PM
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First off, this strikes down many of our Sens-67s LeBreton arena speculation.

That said, I like the proposal to bury the arena east of the stadium, with entrances both on the Canal side and Lansdowne. Wonder if shipping and receiving will all be done via the underground garage from the current ramp between the (now) Civic and office building.

Again though, I'm puzzled how they did not include a hotel component. The place would be booked solid all year considering the various sports teams and events.
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  #39  
Old Posted Apr 27, 2022, 1:11 PM
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Originally Posted by c_speed3108 View Post
The biggest concern I see is that if the Green Roof on the arena (aka the replaced berm) can not support a few people sunbathing or having a picnic lunch then it certainly would not support adding temporary seating for a larger event such as a Grey Cup game.
I agree that the green roof should be open to the public, thus losing a minimal amount of usable green space. Probably not realistic to build it so it can accommodate temporary seating through, which is problematic.

I agree with Phil about the roof. Even if it only covered the upper tier. That said, Montreal Calgary and Edmonton also don't have any sort of roof structure.
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  #40  
Old Posted Apr 27, 2022, 1:20 PM
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FutureWickedCity FutureWickedCity is offline
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Would this plan require the demolition of the Goodlife gym and all those other businesses attached to the arena? Seems like an awful waste and a lot of people would really miss that Goodlife
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