The Great Canadian Transit Thread

[Innsertnamehere]

I will repeat, while compared to other metro systems worldwide, Sheppard performs well, on a Toronto scale it performs horridly.

The spadina extension isn't perfect. The TTC wanted it extended only to Steeles west, where it would have had essentially the same ridership as today. York region offered to add 2 stops to it, adding roughly 3k to the line, so the TTC said yes. The DRL wasn't on a one a radar on 2006 as Yonge wasn't near capacity and any capacity increases could be handled by the new trains ad signalling system. Now we realize that even that won't be enough if the Yonge extension is built, thus the sudden scramble for the DRL. The DRL wasn't really necessary in 2006, so it wasn't considered. Now it is, and it just so happens to have higher ridership than spadina.

[dleung]

Originally Posted by miketoronto

...At 50,000 riders a day on 5.5km of track, the Sheppard subway carries more people than many metro lines double or triple the length in other cities. The Sheppard subway line also attracts more riders per km than many subway lines in other world cities, including many of the London Tube lines.

The least-used Tube line (Waterloo) is a 2-station stub built in 1898 that carries 55,000 passengers daily. The next-least-used line (Metropolitan) carries 230,000 passengers daily.
We know developing countries can build rapid transit very cheaply; irrelevant here.
It's too easy to point out lines in the US that have lower ridership that operate at heavy losses, which isn't exactly helpful

It's as if you have no idea what and where the Spadina extension is, and are simply expounding generalities promoting the virtues of rapid transit.

[miketoronto]

Originally Posted by dleung

The least-used Tube line (Waterloo) is a 2-station stub built in 1898 that carries 55,000 passengers daily. The next-least-used line (Metropolitan) carries 230,000 passengers daily.
We know developing countries can build rapid transit very cheaply; irrelevant here.
It's too easy to point out lines in the US that have lower ridership that operate at heavy losses, which isn't exactly helpful

It's as if you have no idea what and where the Spadina extension is, and are simply expounding generalities promoting the virtues of rapid transit.

Are you aware how long the Metropolitan line is? Some Tube lines are double the length of the Bloor-Danforth line, and carry slightly more riders a day as the Bloor-Danforth line.

Take outer portions of the Tube or some of the outer branches, and the ridership is probably very similar to Sheppard.

I am well aware of where the Spadina line is, and it the line will provide much needed rapid transit to an area of the GTA that lacks a fast transit option, including serving one of the largest universities in the metro area.

Like most Toronto transit projects, the line will probably be much more patronized than projections, and it will be a hit from day one.

My gosh the mess we would be in today, if planners had the thinking of today, and did not extend the subway out to North York, Etobicoke, and Scarborough when they did. These areas were no different than the Vaughan extension.

And who said anything about the USA?

I posted a list showing that even in Europe, many metro lines do not have high ridership on all subway lines.
Oslo's Metro at something like 80km, only carries 250,000 riders a day.
Milan's small 6 km M4 Metro only carries 27,000 riders a day, and they are not calling that a failure, like we do to Sheppard.
Any by the way, very few Metro lines pay for themselves through fares. Toronto's does thanks to the high ridership brought by suburban feeder bus routes, but most European systems do not. They are very heavily subsidized, as are the ones in NYC and others.

[WhipperSnapper]

I don't think dleung knows where the Spadina extension outside of aerial photographs considering he calls the Pioneer Village Station at Jane & Steeles the middle of no where.

I am curious the effect this extension will have on the student occupied condominiums in the north end of NYCC over the decade after opening.

[Coldrsx]

[eemy]

Not exactly Canadian transit-related, but I think some of the people in this thread might enjoy playing Mini Metro. I think it could have broader appeal beyond just transit-geeks, but there is something immensely satisfying about building up a Tube-style network map. It's only in the alpha stage right now, so it should see improvements over time.

[Aylmer]

Beware - it's a lot more addictive than you'd think!

[GreaterMontréal]

Latest APTA Q4 2013 ridership

Montréal HR (metro)
Average weekday : 1 256 200
Trips Thru Dec'13 : 356 096 000

STM
Average Weekday : 2 242 000
TOTAL : 648 939 700

http://www.apta.com/resources/statistics/Documents/2013-q4-ridership-APTA.pdf

[Chadillaccc]

Wow Calgary is at 298 000 per day on the LRT

Getting really close to 600 000 for total trips on transit. Amazing!

[Coldrsx]

Funding announced today for the SE-LRT 'Valley' Line for Edmonton. Projected is 60,000/day I believe.

2016 start, 2021 open.


(http://sohi.ca/img/gallery/LRT_2.JPG)

Will eventually connect to the next expansion west from downtown past WEM to a park and ride at the west edge of the City.


(http://mastermaq.s3.amazonaws.com/public/images/new/lrt_wse.gif)

[Black Star]

Awesome news. Over the next 5-6 years this city will be a huge construction zone of exciting projects

[Chadillaccc]

Thank the tranist gods!!! WOOOT!



Underground C-train Tunnel gets top marks in new report on Green Line
By Bryan Weismiller

Tunnelling under downtown is being hailed the top-option in plans to build and connect Calgary’s next CTrain lines, according to a new report.

This week, city councillors will preside over a report on different ways to bridge the north-central and southeast legs of a future cross-town LRT known as the Green Line.

The highest-ranked route in the report — albeit one of the priciest — sees underground rail service starting at 16 Avenue N. Moving south, it eventually meets 2 St. SW around Eau Claire and carries on through the core to the CP Rail train tracks.

William Hamilton, with advocacy group TransitCamp YYC, sided with calls for the downtown portion to be buried below grade to avoid big-time traffic complications.

“The moment you turn the Green Line to a north-south axis through the city centre, you have to run it underground,” Hamilton said, noting the low-floor-style train cars are too long to sync up with traffic lights.

He did admit: “Light-rail tunnels do not, however, come cheaply.”

As a general rule, Calgary Transit planner Jon Lea said constructing underground rail tunnels costs 10 times more than street-level lines. Lea noted there could be other hurdles in going underground including utility hazards, soil conditions and flood-related fears.

“Everything is a challenge,” Lea said. “ Especially building an LRT in existing communities in centre city and downtown.”

Some of the alternatives LRT alignments pitched in the report by Edmonton-based consultants, such as meandering routes further west through the Beltline, were shot down earlier in the process in favour of lines geared toward moving more people in and out of the core.

A city committee will review the update this week, and further consultations are planned in late April or May.

Until now, debate on the upper half of the Green Line has mostly raged over picking a north-south corridor from Beddington Trail to 16 Avenue N. However, planners have now narrowed the options to Edmonton Trail or Centre Street.

That was the “big decision” up for discussion this week for Ward 9 Coun. Gian-Carlo Carra, who applauded the move to put public transit closer to where people live, and away from previous plans around Nose Creek.

“We’re trying to create a new transit rider who uses transit on a daily basis,” Carra said.

Full story: http://metronews.ca/news/calgary/967676/...s-top-marks-in-new-report-on-green-line/

[GreaterMontréal]

STL (Laval) : 20 638 802 total (2012)
RTL (Longueuil) : 34 000 000 total (2012)
AMT (Montréal) : 19 000 000 total (2013)

720M+ for urban Montréal.

with the LRT and the SRB in 2018-2020, we should be close to 800M.

[GreaterMontréal]

nice to see Calgary say

“We’re trying to create a new transit rider who uses transit on a daily basis,”

[J.OT13]

Congratulations Calgary! One step closer to joining the Subway Club!!

[Aylmer]

In order of the date of admission

Subway Club: Toronto, Montréal, Edmonton, Vancouver, Ottawa, Calgary
Surface LRT Club: Edmonton, Calgary, KW
Potential candidates (places with proposals): Hamilton, Mississauga, Gatineau (here's hoping!), Longueuil, Québec City, Richmond

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by Aylmer

In order of the date of admission: Toronto, Montréal, Edmonton, Vancouver, Ottawa, Calgary.

Who will be next?

It's a battle between Québec City and Winnipeg! With Hamilton's double down on surface LRT, I think they're out of the running. Winnipeg saw the return of the NHL first, so my money's on them.

[Chadillaccc]

Delete

[Innsertnamehere]

We won't see another for a long time I don't think, Unless Quebec city starts to get serious. Hamilton is going for a surface LRT and Winnipeg seems content with its bus system currently.

[GlassCity]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

It's a battle between Québec City and Winnipeg! Hamilton would be in there if they wouldn't have doubled-down on surface lrt.

Are there any plans at all for rapid transit in Quebec City? Looks like Winnipeg has committed to BRT and Hamilton to street-running LRT