CHICAGO | Da Bears | New Domed Lakefront Stadium Proposal

[ardecila]

Originally Posted by nomarandlee

You mean south of McCormick Place? I never imagined they would try to squeeze it in that space. I always assumed that if built there, you build the stadium orienting east-west above grade over the tracks and the Marshalling yards. Underneath the football plaza around the stadium, you could also have a ton of underground parking.

The stadium would also essentially use the same 55 and LSD ramps that McCormick Place uses. The only major issue I see with that parcel is that an Advocate outpatient care center is there, but I think the Bears/city could help rebuild that nearby for 30-50 million dollars.

So Metra Electric would run under the 50-yard line? Typically a stadium field is depressed below grade to reduce the size of the structure - in this scheme the field would end up about 30' above grade to clear the Metra tracks, making the stadium 4-5 stories taller than it needs to be and creating a bunch of empty space on the lower levels. East-west stadiums are also pretty rare because the sun's glare can be an issue.

More broadly, this kind of crayon exercise ignores the very real challenges of big urban development projects. The more stakeholders, the more likely you get a big delay, the more your costs go up. The Bears have shallow pockets, the politicians are (commendably) very resistant to use taxpayer money, and Chicago has sky-high construction costs. Given all that, the Bears really need to start from a nice "clean" patch of dirt, not something involving lakefront protection, transit agencies, parks groups, private landowners/eminent domain, etc.

[ithakas]

At the risk of getting this thread locked, here’s my pie in the sky idea, with absolutely no due diligence behind it:

Build the new Bears stadium on a manmade island just south of Northerly Island and east of Lakeside Center.

Turn Lakeside Center’s roof into a kind of open area for tailgating, small bars and retail structures, games, etc. (not unlike Gallagher Way) that becomes the entry way from the city to the island. Build a wide pedestrian bridge from the SE corner of Lakeside’s roof down to the Bears’ island.

The existing Soldier Field, along with Huntington Bank Pavilion–relocated to the north side of SF as shown by recent city plans–along with the roof of Waldron Deck and the Lucas Museum parking lot, which are converted into grassy fields, become the city’s new music festival grounds, shifting a lot of programs from Grant Park and neighborhood parks (where desired).

Grant Park is freed up to act more as a park than a large festivals ground, save for one or two signature events each summer (probably Lollapalooza and Taste of Chicago), and the park gets a major road diet and much more active casual use, like the Hutchinson Fields scene in the summer of 2020.

Cermak becames the major entry point for transit users to Bears games, and it helps bolster Motor Row’s bar/entertainment scene, perhaps with a blues music focus.

[nomarandlee]

Originally Posted by ardecila

So Metra Electric would run under the 50-yard line? Typically a stadium field is depressed below grade to reduce the size of the structure - in this scheme the field would end up about 30' above grade to clear the Metra tracks, making the stadium 4-5 stories taller than it needs to be and creating a bunch of empty space on the lower levels. East-west stadiums are also pretty rare because the sun's glare can be an issue.
.

I envision the ME would run approximately near the east end zone. Essentially, it would act like McCormick South Building over the rail tracks and how it interfaces with MLK Drive. The Vikings stadium plaza (which the Bears President Kevin Warren oversaw) is also built partially above grade. I think the Viking stadium (hopefully) will be the model for the stadium. The Jets were originally going to build their stadium over Hudson Yards (a much more cumbersome and expensive proposition than building over the IC tracks).

If you had a larger horseshoe indoor stadium, the east end could be more open, lessening load requirements. The whole west end would be enclosed, so any issues about sun-glare during late-day games would be a non-issue. There will not be any 7am start times for sun glare to be an issue on the east end.

More broadly, this kind of crayon exercise ignores the very real challenges of big urban development projects. The more stakeholders, the more likely you get a big delay, the more your costs go up. The Bears have shallow pockets, the politicians are (commendably) very resistant to use taxpayer money, and Chicago has sky-high construction costs. Given all that, the Bears really need to start from a nice "clean" patch of dirt, not something involving lakefront protection, transit agencies, parks groups, private landowners/eminent domain, etc

I agree in principle with almost all of this. Trying to bring McPier is probably bringing in too many cooks into the kitchen. I am skeptical that Brandon Johnson will be the shrewd negotiators that Lightfoot or Emanuel were. For the taxpayer's and city's sake, I hope that he somehow gets the Bears (and White Sox) to put a lot more skin in the game than their last sweetheart deals they walked away with.

Again, I can't imagine the Bears are daft or bold enough to try to push through a highly controversial lakefront stadium plan on a very tight squeeze of a parcel on the south lots or the Soldier Field footprint.

[Mr Downtown]

If someone found that kind of money—ha!—it would be smarter to put a new stadium over the Amtrak & Metra yards at Canal & Roosevelt.

Creating land in the lake, as we already know very well from the caselaw, means there can be no private ownership or control of it.

[pullmanman]

NBC 5 Chicago

At his annual Super Bowl press conference Monday, the NFL commissioner weighed in on the Chicago Bears' quest for a new stadium, saying that a new venue in the city would be in line to host Super Bowls and other marquee events in the future.

“I think it’s important to the Chicago Bears, and their fans,” Goodell said. “I think it’s also important to that community. I think as we’ve seen here (in Las Vegas), a great stadium can host additional events, (and) I think that’s true in Chicago.”

Goodell also backed the idea of the team building a domed stadium, either in the suburbs or in the city.

“I think the domed stadium that they’re talking about – both downtown and potentially in Arlington – I think that those are both great opportunities that they need to explore. The good news is they've got quite a bit of time on their lease."

Goodell went on to say that he had spoken to Mayor Brandon Johnson about the project, and hinted that the team is set on staying in the city.

"The Bears are committed to being in Chicagoland," Goodell said. "I've talked to the Mayor of Chicago recently, he wants them in the city."

This doesn't really mean much, but it does show the conversations about keeping the Bears in the city are ongoing.

[bnk]

Originally Posted by ithakas

At the risk of getting this thread locked, here’s my pie in the sky idea, with absolutely no due diligence behind it:

Build the new Bears stadium on a manmade island just south of Northerly Island and east of Lakeside Center.

Turn Lakeside Center’s roof into a kind of open area for tailgating, small bars and retail structures, games, etc. (not unlike Gallagher Way) that becomes the entry way from the city to the island. Build a wide pedestrian bridge from the SE corner of Lakeside’s roof down to the Bears’ island.

The existing Soldier Field, along with Huntington Bank Pavilion–relocated to the north side of SF as shown by recent city plans–along with the roof of Waldron Deck and the Lucas Museum parking lot, which are converted into grassy fields, become the city’s new music festival grounds, shifting a lot of programs from Grant Park and neighborhood parks (where desired).

Grant Park is freed up to act more as a park than a large festivals ground, save for one or two signature events each summer (probably Lollapalooza and Taste of Chicago), and the park gets a major road diet and much more active casual use, like the Hutchinson Fields scene in the summer of 2020.

Cermak becames the major entry point for transit users to Bears games, and it helps bolster Motor Row’s bar/entertainment scene, perhaps with a blues music focus.

Nice Idea but your comment should not shut the thread down.

But the Lakeside center cannot accommodate any more loads on its roof.

It was not designed for that... nor ever envisioned in the future. Its roof is susceptible as it is currently and not built like the BCBS building that thought ahead.

I don't even think that a massive snowstorm would not collapse that susceptible weakness.

Even a thousand cars have the potential to cave the whole structure in unless massive amounts of steel I beams were strategically placed, and in the meantime lose its open space that would compromise the entire Idea of an open Lakeside Center that IMO should never have been built on the lake and I am no proponent of save the Bears parking lots of the idiots that blocked the Lucas Museum.

Blair K is less relevant now, but his article still has some points. https://www.chicagotribune.com/2015/...cormick-place/

[twister244]

Btw - To whomever renamed the thread - Love it.

I almost spit my coffee out this morning seeing it for the first time.

With respect to the ongoing news - Happy to see the NFL is getting behind the idea of keeping the team in the city.

[le_brew]

Forgive me if I didn’t get the Memo, but why isn’t South Works ideal? Even Stevie Wonder can see it!

[dropdeaded209]

why don't the bears just go somewhere else entirely, like a new state? Who would miss them after a season or two? Eight home games per year... just drop them completely!

[BruceP]

Originally Posted by le_brew

Forgive me if I didn’t get the Memo, but why isn’t South Works ideal? Even Stevie Wonder can see it!

Well, maybe because it's about as far away from the Bears base you can get while remaining in the Chicago Metro area? It's practically in Indiana.

[Busy Bee]

Originally Posted by le_brew

Forgive me if I didn’t get the Memo, but why isn’t South Works ideal? Even Stevie Wonder can see it!

A couple things I wrote a few years ago on that topic:

...a lakefront stadium at South Works would look awesome, but wouldn't necessarily be ideal for a number of reasons nor meet the Bears other goals or requirements, largest of which is their need for year round revenue from a stadium being part of a multi-use campus. South Works has wonderful potential, but I'm not sure its isolated location, geographically surrounded by economically struggling neighborhoods is at all the kind of site that would be desirable for sports, entertainment, convention, amusement or retail activity.

... if and when Bears brass push for a new stadium, it's highly likely they will want to maximize the ROI by having the stadium as multi-purpose as possible and likely anchoring a complex of some sort that can host other events or even conventions - basically keeping it an active money maker as much as possible. For this reason, possible concept locations just based on the availability of vacant land start to make less sense. As amazing as a South Works Bears stadium would look, ask yourself how likely it is that it would get much additional use as a standalone stadium than Soldier does now. And it's pretty questionable whether the additional aforementioned functions would have much potential for success at a relatively isolated site like South Works that is ringed with neighborhoods of questionable desirability. Same thing with other areas of the far south side adjacent to Bishop Ford.

[SIGSEGV]

If the Bears didn't consistently shit on the field, perhaps they could build a stadium on top of the water purification plant by Navy PIer.

[le_brew]

Originally Posted by BruceP

Well, maybe because it's about as far away from the Bears base you can get while remaining in the Chicago Metro area? It's practically in Indiana.

That’s a short-sighted view. The southside museums: SciIndust; Obama center; south shore cultural, are situated quite conveniently if it’s well developed and tied into existing transit. Fan base is regional as well. Demographics are changing and Chicago needs to get over the stigma of development south of 18th. This ‘Far Away’ concept is what creates the great divide here, stagnating. Reality is, it’s very close-in. Say, Arlington Heights is further, right?

[Steely Dan]

Distance from State/Madison, as the crow flies:

South Works: 11 miles

Arlington Racetrack: 24 miles

[BrinChi]

Yeah let's be real... South Works site is plenty close to the city, but it's not a desirable location for far northsiders or northern suburbs. But I'd also imagine the team would consider an Indiana site just over the border before South Works if they could get public financing or tax benefits in Indiana.

[BruceP]

Originally Posted by le_brew

That’s a short-sighted view. The southside museums: SciIndust; Obama center; south shore cultural, are situated quite conveniently if it’s well developed and tied into existing transit. Fan base is regional as well. Demographics are changing and Chicago needs to get over the stigma of development south of 18th. This ‘Far Away’ concept is what creates the great divide here, stagnating. Reality is, it’s very close-in. Say, Arlington Heights is further, right?

No, it's a realistic view. The institutions you mentioned, along with the U. of Chicago & Hospitals, form a critical mass. They also have convenient transportation by CTA bus & rail & Metra and via LSD & the Dan Ryan. A Bears stadium at South Works will consist of a total of 11 events a year and that's it. South Works has only the extended LSD & a Metra stop near a mile away. Do you really think Hoosiers would flock to South Works when the Indy Colts are only 2 1/2 hours away. The Bears local base is north and west; that's why they're looking at AH. And much as I hate the McCaskey's, they're not a charity or government and can't be expected to do "urban renewal." Also, read Busy Bee's comments above.

[r18tdi]

Larry Booth sent some conceptual images to Crain's for a Chicago-based Bears stadium at a few locations including The 78, United Center parking lot, and Goose Island.

Purely conceptual, but interesting none the less:

https://www.chicagobusiness.com/spor...-bears-chicago

[brian_b]

Originally Posted by Steely Dan

Distance from State/Madison, as the crow flies:

South Works: 11 miles

Arlington Racetrack: 24 miles

State/Madison doesn't mean anything to the Suburban Bears.

Distance from Halas Hall, as the car drives

Arlington Park: 20 miles
Foxconn Boondoggle: 34 miles
Soldier Field: 38 miles
South Works: 49 miles

Bears should be all in the city or all out of the city.

[Ahoi]

I have another suggestion:
A few years ago a stadium was proposed on the site of the current Lincoln Yards would this still be a possibility today?

[Rizzo]

This is an oversimplified take. But NFL games require a great deal of disposable income and if you google "chicagoland income map' you'll find the majority of wealth at the city northside, inner north suburbs, and far west and far southwest suburbs. The Arlington Heights location make sense because you basically have a straight shot there 355/290 and 90 and driving to an NFL stadium is common.

For Solider Field, Metra is a direct shot from many suburbs and a stress free and reliable option. Some may see walking from the metra terminals a problem, but I really doubt that it is for a dedicated fanbase. Plus from the furthest at Ogilvie, 2/3 of the walk is through the parks. Then you have the whole benefit of Chicago's northside accessible from the red line and buses. You can capture the last minute ticket buyers that you'll rarely get in the suburbs. But the lakefront is at least totally centralized and accessible to everyone.

I see the two above options as the most logical

The 78 concept is nice, but I'm skeptical it would actually fit since newer stadiums seem to require even larger footprints for ancillary amenities. However, a good example example with Detroit, two stadiums with shared parking next to expressway works out nicely for a compact footprint.

I can't imagine Southworks being an option. It's just too remote for everyone in that it requires more routes of travel by car from the suburbs, more routes of travel by mass transit for suburban and city dwellers, lacks proximity to major hotels and shopping for non-NFL events and would diseprese traffic load on a street system designed for industry and residential, not major events.