Metro Vancouver Bike/Pedestrian Discussion

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by city-dweller

The big question is about public facilities. What if I want to bike to a meeting downtown?

That's a tough one... but are you going to change mid-day to your bike clothes then back when your meeting is done?

Using your bike as the "last mile" after a skytrain ride is always an option too. A bike share would be perfect for that.

[WBC]

The new separated bike lane section of BC Parkway between Joyce-Collingwood and Rupert is now open (you can enter and exit the path at either end, but the fence is still around it for whatever reason).

[NetMapel]

What we definitely need is a bike lane that cuts through Yaletown west to east that preferably connects to Cambie bridge. Maybe it will be an extension along Helmcken street's already existing bike lane. That way, it'll be fully connected to the west end so you can just bike there all the way cutting through downtown. Or, maybe it can be along Smithe and we will just take away that one lane on the side that's always parked with cars all the way to Hornby. Either way, Yaletown is definitely lacking a bike lane that cuts through it west to east even though it has decent bike lanes going north/south.

[CanSpice]

Originally Posted by NetMapel

What we definitely need is a bike lane that cuts through Yaletown west to east that preferably connects to Cambie bridge. Maybe it will be an extension along Helmcken street's already existing bike lane. That way, it'll be fully connected to the west end so you can just bike there all the way cutting through downtown. Or, maybe it can be along Smithe and we will just take away that one lane on the side that's always parked with cars all the way to Hornby. Either way, Yaletown is definitely lacking a bike lane that cuts through it west to east even though it has decent bike lanes going north/south.

Yaletown has the seawall and Pacific Street/Boulevard though, both of which connect to the Cambie Bridge.

[Large Cat]

Originally Posted by CanSpice

Yaletown has the seawall and Pacific Street/Boulevard though, both of which connect to the Cambie Bridge.

Coming from the west end, it would take a lot longer to dip all the way to the Seawall, travel it to Cambie at a safe speed for pedestrians, then ascend the 5 story switchback to get on the bridge. A direct route would let you stay on top of the elevation.

Pacific's bike lane isn't protected and feel super dangerous for most riders.

[dandor31]

Originally Posted by Large Cat

Coming from the west end, it would take a lot longer to dip all the way to the Seawall, travel it to Cambie at a safe speed for pedestrians, then ascend the 5 story switchback to get on the bridge. A direct route would let you stay on top of the elevation.

Pacific's bike lane isn't protected and feel super dangerous for most riders.

I can attest that biking from the West End over the Cambie St bridge can be terrifying. In fact, for about 6 months I commuted from Comox and Bidwell to Cambie and Broadway everyday. Now this was before the Comox-Helmcken Greenway so I took Nelson the entire route. Once you crest the ridge after Thurlow, you can make it the entire way onto the bridge without stopping. Because it is downhill, you go just as fast as cars. However once you get onto the bridge it gets a bit dodgy. I've always used the car lane (as I'm entitled to) but I've had more than one occasion with cars honking at me. And it can be a bit scaring with cars passing you at 70+km/h.

Returning I alternated between the bridge and multi-use path. The loop to get back on to Smithe is super annoying, but you get to avoid cars. Once you get onto Smithe, you feel like a huge jerk because you are going so slow up the hill in a full lane. But it really is the most direct route back to the West End. I wouldn't mind even painted bike lanes on Nelson/Smithe leading on/off the bridge into Downtown.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by CanSpice

Yaletown has the seawall and Pacific Street/Boulevard though, both of which connect to the Cambie Bridge.

Going along the seawall only to try and climb the ridiculous hill on Hornby is a non-starter.

A good E-W between Yaletown and Hornby is required somewhere between Drake and Nelson IMO.

[s211]

Originally Posted by Large Cat

Pacific's bike lane ... feel[s] super dangerous for most riders.

Umm, and how exactly do you know that?

[Porfiry]

Originally Posted by NetMapel

What we definitely need is a bike lane that cuts through Yaletown west to east that preferably connects to Cambie bridge. Maybe it will be an extension along Helmcken street's already existing bike lane. That way, it'll be fully connected to the west end so you can just bike there all the way cutting through downtown.

Right now (well, as of 2012) the plan is to run a cycle track along Drake between Hornby and the seawall. I'd personally prefer to have the connection along Helmcken just because it's a more central routing.

http://vancouver.ca/files/cov/Comox-...2012-09-28.pdf

[Large Cat]

Originally Posted by s211

Umm, and how exactly do you know that?

Because I'm a tall able-bodied young male who is a confident and experienced cyclist with a good bike, and it still feels dangerous to me. So I'm not going to go making any assumptions that it feels okay for someone else until I hear from them otherwise. But I challenge you to find someone who doesn't find it dangerous that isn't a MAMIL/MAWIL, a messenger, or someone similarly fearless/rugged/able. So many people talk about cycling infrastructure as if it's good enough if it's good enough for them to tolerate using it. The idea behind finding AAA cycling solutions is that "good enough" infrastructure is actually just as exclusive as car-based planning solutions which force everyone to have a driver's license just to get around, when in reality only a subset of the population can attain to that. What the city of Vancouver wants is for an 80-year old and his 8-year old great-granddaughter to be able to cycle to and across the Cambie bridge safely and comfortably from the West End. If you feel that isn't important, then that's where we need to have a discussion.

[s211]

Originally Posted by Large Cat

Because I'm a tall able-bodied young male who is a confident and experienced cyclist with a good bike, and it still feels dangerous to me. So I'm not going to go making any assumptions that it feels okay for someone else until I hear from them otherwise. But I challenge you to find someone who doesn't find it dangerous that isn't a MAMIL/MAWIL, a messenger, or someone similarly fearless/rugged/able. So many people talk about cycling infrastructure as if it's good enough if it's good enough for them to tolerate using it. The idea behind finding AAA cycling solutions is that "good enough" infrastructure is actually just as exclusive as car-based planning solutions which force everyone to have a driver's license just to get around, when in reality only a subset of the population can attain to that. What the city of Vancouver wants is for an 80-year old and his 8-year old great-granddaughter to be able to cycle to and across the Cambie bridge safely and comfortably from the West End. If you feel that isn't important, then that's where we need to have a discussion.

You're right. Let's bubble wrap the city for the lowest common denominator.

[dreambrother808]

Originally Posted by s211

You're right. Let's bubble wrap the city for the lowest common denominator.

You're going to be biking that way sometime soon?

[NetMapel]

I absolutely do not feel safe biking on Pacific Blvd. Coming from say, somewhere around St. Paul hospital towards the city hall will require that I bike down to the seawall on Hornby. Then take the loop thing up to Cambie bridge to bike through. I mean, that's fine and all, but if I am able to bike more or less straight through Yaletown W-E, it cuts down that part of the commute time by a minimum of 15 minutes. That's not considering the less able individuals who would have a tough time going up the hills on Hornby or maybe even the Cambie bridge loop. The easier you make it for people to bike all around the major parts of Vancouver, the more popular it will be. Currently my suggestion is still to extend the Helmcken road like so:



The red line down along Helmcken would be great to have a dedicated bike lane on. Then it sort of turn itself into Beatty if you follow the residential road. After you reach Beatty, then it has a painted bike lane so that isn't too bad and it connects to Smithe and onto the bridge. I'm going to give this route a try maybe this weekend to test it out.

I biked around Kits through the Burrard bridge recently. Having not been in that part of town for a year or two on my bike, I was very impressed with the upgrades that area received. Now I felt quite safe accessing Kitsilano on my bike and I've been biking that area more and more. In fact, I was able to take a friend of mine, who is very new to biking in Vancouver, around Kits and it was very comfortable.

[s211]

Originally Posted by dreambrother808

You're going to be biking that way sometime soon?

Yes, actually, but why do you ask? What's the point of a question like that?

I bike downtown several times a month, live near Cambie/Broadway and never seem to seem to go brown-trousers like most of the Mary's on this board.

Just keep your eyes on the road, resist the urge to read your phone while riding (see far too many wags doing that), chill and enjoy the ride.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by Porfiry

Right now (well, as of 2012) the plan is to run a cycle track along Drake between Hornby and the seawall. I'd personally prefer to have the connection along Helmcken just because it's a more central routing.

http://vancouver.ca/files/cov/Comox-...2012-09-28.pdf

Helmcken is great on a map, but from Homer through to Pacific, it gets very narrow, goes through a private(?) parking lot with the infamous chain. Then through Helmcken park which has very little space.

I walk Helmcken all the time, as much as it would be nice to have a direct cycling route, I just don't think there's enough space.

Nelson has space but is a direct downtown exit route onto the Cambie Bridge.

Davie would be "ok" but is already pretty busy and a lane would have to go.

Drake has more space and is fairly quiet.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by Large Cat

Because I'm a tall able-bodied young male who is a confident and experienced cyclist with a good bike, and it still feels dangerous to me. So I'm not going to go making any assumptions that it feels okay for someone else until I hear from them otherwise.

I find Pacific ok for a road with a painted line. The car lanes are wide and there's plenty of space. When a painted bike lane gets added to an already narrow street, it feels more dangerous. Like Richards before it was moved between the sidewalk and parked cars.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by NetMapel

That's not considering the less able individuals who would have a tough time going up the hills on Hornby or maybe even the Cambie bridge loop. The easier you make it for people to bike all around the major parts of Vancouver, the more popular it will be. Currently my suggestion is still to extend the Helmcken road like so:

I biked around Kits through the Burrard bridge recently. Having not been in that part of town for a year or two on my bike, I was very impressed with the upgrades that area received. Now I felt quite safe accessing Kitsilano on my bike and I've been biking that area more and more. In fact, I was able to take a friend of mine, who is very new to biking in Vancouver, around Kits and it was very comfortable.

Yes those improvements around Burrard and Kits are awesome, and need to be duplicated.

On a similar note, using lanes on Dunsmuir and/or Hornby to access both English Bay and Coal Harbour seawalls are great.

All that said, my comments around the Hornby hill were more about getting to work sweaty rather than ability. The biggest issue with cycle commuting right now is showers and change facilities at the employer end of the ride. With more flat lanes, maybe having a shower when you arrive isn't such a requirement any more.

See my other post for Helmcken feasibility. Let me know what you think after riding it.

[Porfiry]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Helmcken is great on a map, but from Homer through to Pacific, it gets very narrow, goes through a private(?) parking lot with the infamous chain. Then through Helmcken park which has very little space.

I suppose you're right. I've always been disappointed by how that area was designed. What could have been a nice promenade connecting the warehouses to the seawall is so mediocre.

[NetMapel]

Checked the route I mentioned earlier out today. That chained road at Maitland or whatever is really BS. What the heck, is that all about ?

[Large Cat]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Helmcken is great on a map, but from Homer through to Pacific, it gets very narrow, goes through a private(?) parking lot with the infamous chain. Then through Helmcken park which has very little space.

Hahaha that freaking chain.