Salt Lake MSA Development Thread

[DMTower]

A few more things the government can do:
-Run public awareness campaigns
-Legislate controls on emissions
-Offer tax breaks or rebates for the purchase of efficient vehicles and products
-Promote cleaner alternatives such as natural gas
-Place stricter controls on wood or coal burning
-Continue the conversion of government buildings, public utilities and vehicles to energy efficient standards

These are all just off the top of my head. There is a lot a government can do.

[Wasatch_One]

Guys, you can push legislation all you want but I honestly believe that there isn't much we can do at this point short of banning all cars or requiring electric only vehicles. There are too many people living here and we're growing faster than almost every other place in the country.

Using extreme measures at this point would probably only maintain what we have today. And even that will continue to worsen as more people make this their home.

Im just being real.

[Orlando]

Originally Posted by Makid

There are a few things the Governor could do to assist with limiting the amount of pollution that is trapped by the inversion.

1. Push legislation to reduce/eliminate fares on yellow/red burn days.
2. Push legislation to reduce transit fares year round.
3. Push legislation that limits urban sprawl.
4. Push legislation that encourages smart growth policies.
5. Push legislation that backs the WFRC growth policies.
6. Appoint people to the Division of Air Quality that will not just rubber stamp all items.
7. Push legislation to require 1% of all new funds be directed to transit operations/expansion.


There are 7 things the Governor could do. The problem is that he won't, not until it is researched and vetted for at least a year and he knows if it will hurt his re-election or not.

The only way things happen faster is if a large group of public leaders get together to push the idea through. Or if 1 large company states they would relocate to Utah only if something is done to help curb the pollution levels. Then and only then would the Governor push something quickly.

Well said.

[Orlando]

Originally Posted by Wasatch_One

Guys, you can push legislation all you want but I honestly believe that there isn't much we can do at this point short of banning all cars or requiring electric only vehicles. There are too many people living here and we're growing faster than almost every other place in the country.

Using extreme measures at this point would probably only maintain what we have today. And even that will continue to worsen as more people make this their home.

Im just being real.

You're also the one with a red hot rod as your avatatar. Just sayin.

[Makid]

I think the main point is that we need to start doing something to limit the increase in pollution levels.

Yes, the current level may not change but if we were to enact free rides on red air days, pollution next year will be lower. If we lower fares year round, pollution next year will be lower.

Rio Tinto and other large polluters are already working to lower their pollution levels. If we don't do anything, the pollution levels may even drop by 5 ro 10 percent for a couple of years. But then we will then equal and exceed current levels if we don't do anything else.

That is why if we don't act now, levels 5 years from now will be worse. If we were to act now, it is possible that pollution levels may be the same as they are now or even possibly lower.

The thing to remember is that if Utah doesn't find a way to get the 2.5 pollution levels down or have a 5 year plan to do it, Utah will see a complete stop to all federal funding for roads. That would be a big hit to the economy especially as we are growing so rapidly.

So, while any actions today may not affect today, tomorrow or even this year, the actions will have an effect next year and a bigger effect each year there after.

[Orlando]

Originally Posted by Makid

The thing to remember is that if Utah doesn't find a way to get the 2.5 pollution levels down or have a 5 year plan to do it, Utah will see a complete stop to all federal funding for roads. That would be a big hit to the economy especially as we are growing so rapidly.

So, while any actions today may not affect today, tomorrow or even this year, the actions will have an effect next year and a bigger effect each year there after.

That's why there needs to be tougher legislation against not just industrial pollution, but against sprawl. Then tough legislation that penalizes people who purchase gas guzzling trucks and SUV's.

I have some friends on Facebook who live over in Saratoga area, and I've been so tempted to call them out(politely of course). Every time I go down to Utah and drive on I-15, at least half or more of the vehicles seem to be big trucks and SUV's. A lot of jacked up trucks too. It just smacks of ignorance to me.

[John Martin]

On the plus side..


foggy salt lake city by John Martin K, on Flickr

[delts145]

We have a big storm moving in today and tomorrow. I imagine as usual, it will make it's way to the Wasatch next.

[delts145]

Okay, so let's do the obvious, no brainer math here. If 57 percent of the problem is coming from vehicles, then the quickest way to make a dramatic impact would be to convert the average car along the Wasatch to natural gas. So, if Natural Gas is 90% cleaner than the traditional gas powered engine, we can see how dramatic an impact just the conversion of say 20% of the vehicles along the Wasatch would be. Perhaps, Natural Gas is not the final answer, but it is DEFINITELY the most effective, quickest, and cleanest bridge for the Wasatch Front right now. A bridge that would carry the Wasatch toward a much cleaner environment for many years to come. All avenues of Federal and State aid should be pushed to ease consumers along the Wasatch into the latest CNG conversions for their commuter and family vehicles.

While improved Urban Planning is essential, in the real world CNG conversion is infinitely quicker and resulting in far more dramatic results in a very short period of time.

The discussion should be how to build the conversion infrastructure and number of fueling stations. Undoubtedly, it would cost billions to gear the Wasatch Front up for this major undertaking. The Wasatch Front is the perfect metro for the EPA and the White House to use as a lab for this undertaking. Even if just a small fraction of the wasted White House/EPA monies were used to further build a CNG infrastructure for the Wasatch Metro, the beneficial outcome to a major Metro, millions of people, and ultimately the nation as a whole would be enormous. Billions upon billions have been spent on local highways and mass transit these past five years. Isn't it time now to build a Natural Gas infrastructure. Also, Utah and the surrounding States are a Saudi Arabia of Natural Gas resource.

The average auto per gallon effiency of CNG is approximately the same per mile as conventional gasoline, and the cost of CNG per gallon is a fraction of conventional gasoline. I imagine as demand increases cost will go up, but at least for now, the savings are enormous for the average commuter, and would go a long way toward paying for the initial conversion very quickly.

As a side note here. Future Mayor posted an article recently regarding the French and the new Citroen, which runs on air/water. It will soon be unveiled. Now, until the average driver can afford to go out and buy these latest auto offerings, can Wasatch Fronters not afford to convert their personal/family vehicles to relatively inexpensive Natural Gas?

Govenor Huntsman set the Wasatch Front on an excellent course with CNG. However, the current trend of political talking points regarding CNG are not nearly loud enough. If Gov. Herbert fails to bring this issue of conversion to the top of the list of talking points as Huntsman did, then IMO he is a much diminished leader.

Tempest swirls around Utah's dirty air problem

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/8...blem.html?pg=1

...Smith remained firm that everyone has a part to play. She passed out statistics from her department that she said shows 57 percent of the air pollution is caused by vehicles, 32 percent comes from area sources such as small businesses, homes and other sources and 11 percent comes from industry.

Shutting down all industry, she said, won’t solve the overall air quality problem.

“We wish it were that easy. It is all of us.”...

[VelvetElvis]

There are some huge pollution costs on the production side of NG. Fracking, which the oil industry says accounts for 70% of NG production, is one of the biggest current threats to the environment. Pinedale, Wyoming regularly has the country's worst air, not because of the few thousand people that call the town home, but because of the substantial amount of fracking that goes on in that valley.
It will be interesting to see how quickly electric cars catch on, if at all... I do think, in time, Tesla will be regarded as one of the most progressive and innovative companies of the 21st century. I love their vision and hope it ends up providing practical solution for some of our most pressing contemporary problems. (I am currently saving towards a model x.)

[slc801]

I know that "tax" is a four letter word right now, but I was wondering what everyone would think on a gas tax. I could be wrong on my math, but I think with a 5 cent tax on gasoline bought in Salt Lake, Davis, Weber, and Utah counties, enough funds could be raised to allow for free public transit for 3 months out of the year. Here's my math:

• 532,812,000 gallons of gasoline in Utah per year

• I did a safe estimate that 60% of these gallons is purchased in Utah, Davis, Weber, and Salt Lake counties even though these counties account for 75% of Utah's population.

• In 2011, UTA collected $39,693,756 in fares and UTA projected to collect $43,736,000 in 2012

• A five cent tax would raise $15,984,360, which is more than the cost of replacing the revenues of around $11 million a year (which would be one fourth of the annual revenue to allow for 3 months of free UTA)

I got the UTA annual revenue from this site: http://www.rideuta.com/uploads/2013B...ublication.pdf
I got the gasoline consumption from this site:http://www.rideuta.com/uploads/2013B...blication.pdf; On this site, the stats are in barrels of oil, which is about 21 gallons per barrel

[StevenF]

Originally Posted by John Martin

On the plus side..


foggy salt lake city by John Martin K, on Flickr

That's actually pretty.

[John Martin]

Oh, it was awesome.

[Reachforthesky]

Originally Posted by StevenF

That's actually pretty.

Nice colors! kinda looks like fog rollin in, bay area

[SLC Projects]

Looks like Hale Centre Theatre is looking to move to Sandy.

West Valley City stops talks on Hale Centre Theatre expansion
Letter » “We want you to know that we are parting as friends,” city tells theater board.

By Pamela Manson

After months of negotiations, West Valley City has cut off talks to get Hale Centre Theatre to renew its lease on its venue in the Decker Lake area and to build a second, bigger facility on an adjacent parcel.

In a letter dated Wednesday to members of the theater’s executive committee, Mayor Mike Winder said the city has presented its best case for expanding in West Valley City, but has been unable to persuade Hale to accept the deal and believes it prefers to build in another location.

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/news/55...-west.html.csp

[Future Mayor]

That's too bad that they weren't able to come to an agreement, on an expanded theater or at least a lease extension. At some point Hale Center Theater is going to build to big and the resulting experience for the audience will be degraded.

HTC really has been a great addition to WVC and that Decker Lake Drive entertainment district. It's proximity to trax is great, and provides option. While I like the idea of it being place in the Sandy Civic Center I don't like that the distance from trax, and FrontRunner. If it does go there, I hope the city or HTC provide a courtesy shuttle between the three places.

I hope the WVC can transform that area where HTC is now into a mixed use area. Put in some condos/townhomes with street level retail, it could really become a nice mixed use neighborhood, with access to trax.

[Merewether]

Originally Posted by Reachforthesky

Nice colors! kinda looks like fog rollin in, bay area

Recent video of fog rolling...appropriate for this forum since shows skyline
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=IyzNQUtMaxA

Link via Wasatch Weather Weenies who, like this forum, have had lots on stagnant air recently

http://wasatchweatherweenies.blogspot.com/

[Reachforthesky]

Originally Posted by Merewether

Recent video of fog rolling...appropriate for this forum since shows skyline
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=IyzNQUtMaxA

Link via Wasatch Weather Weenies who, like this forum, have had lots on stagnant air recently

http://wasatchweatherweenies.blogspot.com/

That is Awesome! I love that angle of the skyline also!

[scottharding]

Originally Posted by SLC Projects

Looks like Hale Centre Theatre is looking to move to Sandy.

West Valley City stops talks on Hale Centre Theatre expansion
Letter » “We want you to know that we are parting as friends,” city tells theater board.

By Pamela Manson

After months of negotiations, West Valley City has cut off talks to get Hale Centre Theatre to renew its lease on its venue in the Decker Lake area and to build a second, bigger facility on an adjacent parcel.

In a letter dated Wednesday to members of the theater’s executive committee, Mayor Mike Winder said the city has presented its best case for expanding in West Valley City, but has been unable to persuade Hale to accept the deal and believes it prefers to build in another location.

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/news/55...-west.html.csp

The Hales are going to go anywhere that they can squeeze public money from. WVC has already given them so much, and they also slyly altered their books to go from a for-profit family biz to a non-profit (though family still collects everything) and get ZAP tax money. They're a bunch of bastards. It does suck if they leave WVC, because that theater and it's location is a major boon to that area and West Valley has invested so much in them, but as a patron of the arts, I don't care where they go, as I'll never pass through their doors anyway.

[delts145]

Wow, tell us how you really feel Scott...LOL...J/K. For sure, WV has been a tremendous partner to Hale.

Scott, something that was first on my mind when you mentioned it the other day, and now I see the question given some good press in the Trib...

S. Salt Lake has yet to close on movie studio plans for Granite High

South Salt Lake hopes to close on the deal in 30 days.

By Cimaron Neugebauer | The Salt Lake Tribune

South Salt Lake announced in October it had entered into plans to buy and rehab the historic Granite High School into a motion picture and television production facility — but no one has bought the property yet.

During the fall press conference, South Salt Lake Mayor Cherie Wood said developer Woodbury Corp. and partner Redman Movies and Stories had formed a joint venture. The plan was to preserve and renovate the roughly 45-year-old building and 27-acre site at about 3300 South and 500 East and use it as a setting and studio for films.

But the deal still hasn’t been finalized, according to city officials and the Granite School District, which has leased the property to the city since April 2011. In fact, there is no current lease agreement as of the end of January.

Resident Bob LeMone, who lives near the school, says the idea sounds great, but until papers are signed it is just a dream that is costing taxpayers.

"I think after that press conference everyone assumed Woodbury was taking over the payments of the building, and that is not what is going on," LeMone said, adding that he hasn’t been able to get any information from the city.

LeMone wasn’t the only one who thought the deal was final. KSL Newsradio’s commentator Doug Wright did a special TV editorial applauding the partnership between the three parties to open a studio very soon.

In the editorial video, Wright — an alumnus of the school — says "it looks like they are already moving in," as he walks past an archaic film projector assumed to be property of Redman Movies and Stories just inside the entrance of the school.

A lease agreement, obtained by an open records request, between the city and the school district shows in late October the city told the school district of its intent to purchase Granite with the involvement of Woodbury. The developer paid the school district $500,000 to extend the city’s lease — which would have ended in November — to Jan. 31. The city had already extended the lease once before.

Mayor Wood declined comment to an email from The Tribune asking what the October media event was for and if at that point a deal had been solidified.

"We are optimistic the property will be purchased in the next few weeks," said Granite School District spokesman Ben Horsley, adding it is moving forward "in good faith" that the city will finalize negotiations with the developer...

Read More...http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/news/55...anite.html.csp

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