AUSTIN | Waterline | 1,034 Feet | 73 Floors | T/O

[davidtexan]

Crown progress as of this weekend

[gillynova]

[gillynova]

Question, are they still going to build that mini-Waterline tower in the parking lot or is that still TBD?

Anyone have info and screenshots of that project?

[Urbannizer]

Originally Posted by gillynova

Question, are they still going to build that mini-Waterline tower in the parking lot or is that still TBD?

Anyone have info and screenshots of that project?

Timeline TBD. It was meant to be an office building, I'd expect a new concept.

https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=244847

[wwmiv]

Originally Posted by Urbannizer

Timeline TBD. It was meant to be an office building, I'd expect a new concept.

https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=244847

Seeing those original renderings again… makes me both glad that we got something else entirely (the final product has only passing resemblance to the original …awful… proposal) and mad that what we got ended up being value engineered to within an inch of its already ugly life.

The building is a poor example of a poor style of architecture. Quite honestly, I am over the “lowest common denominator” architecture. Bring back actually beautiful styles.

Make Architecture Beautiful Again.

[ahealy]

Originally Posted by wwmiv

Seeing those original renderings again… makes me both glad that we got something else entirely (the final product has only passing resemblance to the original …awful… proposal) and mad that what we got ended up being value engineered to within an inch of its already ugly life.

The building is a poor example of a poor style of architecture. Quite honestly, I am over the “lowest common denominator” architecture. Bring back actually beautiful styles.

Make Architecture Beautiful Again.

I'll wear a MABA hat with you, WWMIV

Right there with you. Waterline is cool for the height, but not exactly blowing my socks off with he final touches coming into place. Thew crown is always a decider, and this one is quite meh.

[Croon]

I'm seeing Roman numerals on the crown. Will those column accents (or whatever they are) light up at night?

[wwmiv]

Originally Posted by Croon

I'm seeing Roman numerals on the crown. Will those column accents (or whatever they are) light up at night?

Lipstick on a pig boar roach.

This thing is an unmitigated disaster on every level. As is nearly everything built in America nowadays.

[ahealy]

Originally Posted by Croon

I'm seeing Roman numerals on the crown. Will those column accents (or whatever they are) light up at night?

VI Lean-To Tower

[Geckos_Rule]

Originally Posted by wwmiv

Lipstick on a pig boar roach.

This thing is an unmitigated disaster on every level. As is nearly everything built in America nowadays.

I'm not sure it's entirely miserable (the ground levels seem to be turning out fairly nice), but by and large I agree. Look at the tallest buildings in the U.S.: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_tallest_buildings_in_the_United_States

In my obviously subjective view, there are only a few buildings over 900' tall I'd say are uglier than the Waterline, all of which are either on Billiionaire's Row or Hudson Yards in NYC. (If anyone is curious, those I'm thinking of that are probably uglier are 432 Park Avenue, One57, 35 Hudson Yards, 1 and 2 Manhattan West, 50 Hudson Yards, and arguably "the Spiral".)

Funny enough, you could say the same thing about 6xGuad and buildings over 800' tall if it weren't for two hideous condos in Miami.

[BrBlu]

I agree that the ground level is turning out nicely! I think the problems stems from two things: everyone trying to hire local and local talent sadly is just not up to par with high rises like the rest of the world. We really are a society of copying the Jones’. We are very trendy, and trends are not timeless. Other countries that missed americas golden era with class and spires, have since leaped ahead of us with new styles and forms and textures. We either need to draw from our past or dip into more international influence from international firms like Zaha Hadid, Arcadia, Ateliers, Foster and Partners.. bla bla or even the smaller less known ones . There’s definitely small pockets of great small commercial and residential design standards in areas of the US but we are more focused on the bottom line rather than creating a visual masterpiece. It’s not like we wake up and say I wanna give my client somthing mediocre lol money talks. I would say the second biggest half of the issue at hand is just we don’t usually have a visionary developer, specifically in Austin, that wants to create a landmark sadly. We had many awesome proposals if u all recall but the economic timing did a cleanse of them or VE versions.

[wwmiv]

Originally Posted by BrBlu

I agree that the ground level is turning out nicely! I think the problems stems from two things: everyone trying to hire local and local talent sadly is just not up to par with high rises like the rest of the world. We really are a society of copying the Jones’. We are very trendy, and trends are not timeless. Other countries that missed americas golden era with class and spires, have since leaped ahead of us with new styles and forms and textures. We either need to draw from our past or dip into more international influence from international firms like Zaha Hadid, Arcadia, Ateliers, Foster and Partners.. bla bla or even the smaller less known ones . There’s definitely small pockets of great small commercial and residential design standards in areas of the US but we are more focused on the bottom line rather than creating a visual masterpiece. It’s not like we wake up and say I wanna give my client somthing mediocre lol money talks. I would say the second biggest half of the issue at hand is just we don’t usually have a visionary developer, specifically in Austin, that wants to create a landmark sadly. We had many awesome proposals if u all recall but the economic timing did a cleanse of them or VE versions.

This is an awful take.

The architects themselves are rarely the problem. The clients are the problem.

Furthermore (and this is true for every major city in America outside of the big 5): major towers are designed, funded, and constructed by non-local talent. There’s NOTHING LOCAL anymore.

[ahealy]

I think both of y'all have valid points.

KPF isn't exactly known to make shit projects, yet the team behind this was probably only able to pony-up a certain amount of cash to get what we got. I know all too well how that repeated formula for Austin (and other cities) makes it easy to assume it's a local issue.

At the end of the day, I'm glad Austin has a supertall, though I wish we had more inspiring skyscrapers.

[wwmiv]

I’d actually go further down the line and take many (not all) developers at face value:

The problem isn’t actually entirely them, the problem is that the zoning, permitting, taxation, and economic systems major American cities have set up bleeds them dry of funds and they can’t actually afford to give us anything nice. If the problem is the local governments, and those governments are “doing what their people want” (dubious)…

… then part of the ultimate problem is the really bad ideas of the people (well… at least those who vote) themselves being reflected in who they elect passing policies that drive up costs for everyone and of everything.

[to be clear: I still think value engineering is a major problem irrespective of the above dynamic]

[wwmiv]

Originally Posted by ahealy

I think both of y'all have valid points.

KPF isn't exactly known to make shit projects, yet the team behind this was probably only able to pony-up a certain amount of cash to get what we got. I know all too well how that repeated formula for Austin (and other cities) makes it easy to assume it's a local issue.

At the end of the day, I'm glad Austin has a supertall, though I wish we had more inspiring skyscrapers.

Let’s use this tower as a test case for Blu’s “local talent” point.

Involved parties:

Kohn Pederson Fox: New York City
DPR Construction: Bay Area
Lincoln Property Company: Dallas
Kairoi: San Antonio
Public Sector Pension Investment Board: Canadian Govt

Very local.

[Armybrat]

Too bad some of our local billionaires don’t take a greater interest investing in downtown properties.

[Urbannizer]

https://www.skyscrapercity.com/threads/a...page-44?post_id=195793403#post-195793403

[Geckos_Rule]

Originally Posted by wwmiv

I’d actually go further down the line and take many (not all) developers at face value:

The problem isn’t actually entirely them, the problem is that the zoning, permitting, taxation, and economic systems major American cities have set up bleeds them dry of funds and they can’t actually afford to give us anything nice. If the problem is the local governments, and those governments are “doing what their people want” (dubious)…

… then part of the ultimate problem is the really bad ideas of the people (well… at least those who vote) themselves being reflected in who they elect passing policies that drive up costs for everyone and of everything.

[to be clear: I still think value engineering is a major problem irrespective of the above dynamic]

I agree on value engineering. Though while the overall economic side of things is different, it seems like NYC has it pretty rough when it comes to zoning, permitting, and taxation. And they certainly end up with some stinkers (IMO, most of billionaire's row and Hudson Yards), but there's still no shortage of great looking developments as well: One Vanderbilt, the new JPMorgan Chase HQ, 520 5th Ave (under construction), the Brooklyn Tower (a strong contender for most evil-looking building), 30 Park Place/the Four Seasons, 56 Leonard, and 425 Park Avenue all came in the last 10 years and look good.

[IluvATX]

Unfortunately this doesn’t appear much taller than 6x, which is the ugly duckling in that shot.

[ahealy]

Well I suppose there's always hope for Post Office or Hobby to be another supernal that's stunning and has a spire or antenna.