HomeDiagramsDatabaseMapsForum About
     

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > United States > Pacific West > Sacramento Area


Reply

 
Thread Tools Display Modes
     
     
  #3321  
Old Posted Jul 1, 2008, 3:23 PM
Grimnebulin's Avatar
Grimnebulin Grimnebulin is offline
Got Good Grub?
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Midtown Sacramento
Posts: 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by wburg View Post
midtownup: If I only wanted to hear from people who agreed with me, do you really think I'd be posting here? I'm not here for accolades, and as you have no doubt seen if you have been lurking for a while, I certainly don't receive many.

I'm here to learn, as well as share information about ongoing development--and to learn from people whose ideas don't match my own. But I don't always disagree with those on here--there are plenty of projects I like, and publicly support. In a lot of ways, I'm just another development buff.

I'm just expressing my opinion, that's all, even if others don't necessarily agree with it.
wburg - Even though I sometimes disagree with your viewpoints on some preservation issues, I'm definitely glad you're here to present a different opinion as it tends to make me reassess my own opinions in a more critical manner.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #3322  
Old Posted Jul 1, 2008, 5:30 PM
otnemarcaS's Avatar
otnemarcaS otnemarcaS is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Sacramento
Posts: 395
Agree too. The forum is here to share similar or differing views on various developments affecting Sacramento. It is great to have wburg here because he certainly provides a differing perspective on preservation and other issues regardless of how many people disagree (or agree) with him. I mean, I completely agree if he wanted to save the buildings in the archive photos he posted (#3308), but wonder if he's gone cuckoo for cocoa puffs when he feels that the "Rex/Auto" building at 20th and Capitol is even worth saving.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #3323  
Old Posted Jul 1, 2008, 5:49 PM
wburg's Avatar
wburg wburg is offline
Hindrance to Development
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 2,411
Look, I liked the building. I'll miss it. The demo seemed a little hinky to me. Apparently, some think the fact that I liked the building and thought things were hinky will bring all development in Sacramento to a screeching halt forever, and destroy the American way of life utterly.

Personally, I doubt it.

Can we officially drop it and move on?

Last edited by wburg; Jul 1, 2008 at 10:45 PM. Reason: Insufficient screeching
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #3324  
Old Posted Jul 1, 2008, 8:48 PM
econgrad econgrad is offline
Closed account
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 795
Quote:
Originally Posted by wburg View Post
midtownup: If I only wanted to hear from people who agreed with me, do you really think I'd be posting here? I'm not here for accolades, and as you have no doubt seen if you have been lurking for a while, I certainly don't receive many.

I'm here to learn, as well as share information about ongoing development--and to learn from people whose ideas don't match my own. But I don't always disagree with those on here--there are plenty of projects I like, and publicly support. In a lot of ways, I'm just another development buff.

I'm just expressing my opinion, that's all, even if others don't necessarily agree with it.
Same here...
Without our debates, I would be bored on this forum.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #3325  
Old Posted Jul 1, 2008, 9:35 PM
Majin's Avatar
Majin Majin is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Downtown Sacramento
Posts: 2,221
Actually without me this forum would be boring.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #3326  
Old Posted Jul 1, 2008, 9:38 PM
Fusey's Avatar
Fusey Fusey is offline
Repeat!
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Honolulu
Posts: 4,346
Well, you did start a cult that is currently stalking us on sacbee.com.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #3327  
Old Posted Jul 1, 2008, 9:45 PM
Majin's Avatar
Majin Majin is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Downtown Sacramento
Posts: 2,221
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #3328  
Old Posted Jul 2, 2008, 4:10 AM
jsf8278's Avatar
jsf8278 jsf8278 is offline
Edge_City
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 211
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fusey View Post
Well, you did start a cult that is currently stalking us on sacbee.com.
Speaking of...I was just reading a Sacbee.com article about a Gavin Newsom run for governor when I read the comment bellow. Not only do you guys have stalkers, but you have stalkers that post comments that can't possibly be construed as a rational thought...not a good combo!

SkyscrapersForever at 8:45 PM PST Tuesday, July 1, 2008 said:
I'll be voting AGAINST Newsom. According to Majin, only Sacramentans can run for governor. That way all of these crappy old buildings can be demolished and replaced with skyscrapers shipped from Tokyo.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #3329  
Old Posted Jul 2, 2008, 6:36 AM
Majin's Avatar
Majin Majin is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Downtown Sacramento
Posts: 2,221
Damn that is hella crazy, he remembers every little thing I say. I think I am a god to him.

BTW that guy is right, if Newsom runs for Governor I will be voting against him and I expect everyone on this forum to do the same. There no way in hell we shoud let anyone from San Francisco run the state.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #3330  
Old Posted Jul 2, 2008, 1:38 PM
creamcityleo79's Avatar
creamcityleo79 creamcityleo79 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Robbinsdale, MN
Posts: 1,790
Quote:
Originally Posted by Majin View Post
Damn that is hella crazy, he remembers every little thing I say. I think I am a god to him.

BTW that guy is right, if Newsom runs for Governor I will be voting against him and I expect everyone on this forum to do the same. There no way in hell we shoud let anyone from San Francisco run the state.
I'd vote for him! That is, unless it was Villaraigosa running against him. Then, I'd have a tough time choosing between the two! Besides, what Sacramento politician are you REALLY going to vote for for governor? Darrell Steinberg? Fat chance he's even going to run. He likes his new seat as Senate President too much! So, we're left with people like Roger Dickinson () and Heather Fargo...HARDLY what I'd call a great candidate pool. So, yes, I will be doing what is best for California and voting for a good liberal mayor from either San Francisco or Los Angeles if they're running!
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #3331  
Old Posted Jul 2, 2008, 2:32 PM
Fusey's Avatar
Fusey Fusey is offline
Repeat!
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Honolulu
Posts: 4,346
Quote:
Originally Posted by neuhickman79 View Post
Besides, what Sacramento politician are you REALLY going to vote for for governor?
Dan Lungren ran 10 years ago.

So far I hate all of our options. This state has a love to vote for people who bankrupt us.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #3332  
Old Posted Jul 2, 2008, 5:22 PM
Majin's Avatar
Majin Majin is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Downtown Sacramento
Posts: 2,221
I rather vote for Fargo out of principal.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #3333  
Old Posted Jul 3, 2008, 12:30 AM
wburg's Avatar
wburg wburg is offline
Hindrance to Development
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 2,411
There's a rumor that Jerry Brown might run for governor again...now that would be interesting! And it's fair to say that he at least lived here for a while, and his parents did too!
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #3334  
Old Posted Jul 3, 2008, 1:09 AM
Pistola916 Pistola916 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: SAN FRANCISCO/SACRAMENTO
Posts: 634
Quote:
Originally Posted by wburg View Post
There's a rumor that Jerry Brown might run for governor again...now that would be interesting! And it's fair to say that he at least lived here for a while, and his parents did too!
Again.. you can do that??
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #3335  
Old Posted Jul 3, 2008, 2:18 AM
wburg's Avatar
wburg wburg is offline
Hindrance to Development
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 2,411
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pistola916 View Post
Again.. you can do that??
Term limits weren't in place when Brown was governor, so they don't apply to those terms.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #3336  
Old Posted Jul 3, 2008, 3:58 AM
Michael Kramer Michael Kramer is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by neuhickman79 View Post
I'd vote for him! That is, unless it was Villaraigosa running against him. Then, I'd have a tough time choosing between the two! Besides, what Sacramento politician are you REALLY going to vote for for governor? Darrell Steinberg? Fat chance he's even going to run. He likes his new seat as Senate President too much! So, we're left with people like Roger Dickinson () and Heather Fargo...HARDLY what I'd call a great candidate pool. So, yes, I will be doing what is best for California and voting for a good liberal mayor from either San Francisco or Los Angeles if they're running!

I'll take Newsom over Villaraigosa. The mayor down here seems to spend more time with photo ops than anything else. Of course I could blame our shallow media.

Michael
Los Angeles

formerly of

San Francisco 2000-2005
Sacramento 1983-2000
San Mateo Co. 1964-1983
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #3337  
Old Posted Jul 4, 2008, 4:32 PM
BrianSac's Avatar
BrianSac BrianSac is offline
CHACUN SON GOÛT
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 1,646
Downtown's projects rise in face of downturn
Hotels, offices, lofts in Sacramento's core are staying on track.

By Mary Lynne Vellinga - [email protected]
Published 12:00 am PDT Friday, July 4, 2008

Standing at the corner of 10th and K streets, in the heart of downtown Sacramento, there's little sign of the real estate free fall slamming the suburbs.

On one corner, dust rises from the construction site of a musical theater, restaurant and bar complex – The Cosmopolitan – scheduled to open in September in a former Woolworth's store. Across the street, crews are renovating another old department store into "office condos."

Corner by corner, the gradual metamorphosis of Sacramento's core continues to unfold, much as it has for the past decade.

"We're just percolating right along," said Leslie Fritzsche, city downtown development manager.

While developers predict activity will slow, they say it's unlikely to stop. Various forces are combining to keep the construction crews working.

Concern about traffic and global warming, combined with gas priced at nearly $5 a gallon, is driving interest in downtown, developers say.

"The region, along with the country as a whole, is starting to rethink how far away they want to be from the different destinations in their lives, with the goal of ideally living and working and playing in a more central kind of region," said Ellen Warner, a partner in David S. Taylor Interests, a prolific downtown developer.

The suburban lifestyle isn't about to disappear, but over time the central city will become an increasingly attractive option, agreed home industry consultant Greg Paquin, president of the Gregory Group in Folsom.

The growing collection of restaurants, shops and entertainment venues will create a draw of its own, he said. "It's going to be all this synergy."

Walkable projects sought

Public spending also plays a role. Increasingly, government at all levels is steering money to the central city – trying to foster transit-friendly, walkable places.

Millions of dollars in state and local funds will slosh into downtown in the next few years. It comes from property taxes captured by the Sacramento Housing and Redevelopment Agency and voter-approved state housing and transportation bonds.

Stan Thomas, developer of the Sacramento railyard, will get $47 million this year in state housing bond money to build streets into his proposed development.

Township 9, a planned development of 2,350 housing units in the Richards Boulevard area, is earmarked for $19.1 million. Another $23 million is destined for the Triangle area on the West Sacramento riverfront, which is approved for as many as 5,000 housing units and 2 million square feet of office space.

Downtown isn't immune to market forces. Projects opening now were mostly started during the real estate boom – and were too far along to stop when the bottom fell out. Housing has been particularly hard hit.

Downtown developers say they've had to heavily discount their product to move it, and they're making little, if any, profit these days.

"This is a depression in real estate; everybody who was really flying high isn't anymore," said developer Mark Friedman, who has sold 12 of his 26 Sutter Brownstones in midtown.

Friedman – whose family also owns Arden Fair mall – said urban developers are in better shape than those who placed all their bets on continued growth on the suburban edge.

Growth at moderate pace

Unlike the suburbs, downtown and midtown didn't experience a boom in housing in the past decade. They grew, but at a relatively modest pace, while the suburbs sprouted thousands of housing units every year.

Today, that slower growth has become an advantage: The central city isn't burdened with an enormous inventory of unsold or unrented properties.

"I'd much rather have my risk position be in downtown or midtown Sacramento than in the outlying suburbs," said developer Mike Heller, a partner of Friedman's whose portfolio includes downtown and suburban offices.

While huge condo towers touted for downtown didn't survive the market slump, other housing, office and entertainment venues did.

• At 10th and J, a 1920s, Beaux Arts office building will reopen as the Citizen Hotel, the city's first high-rise boutique hotel.

• David Taylor's new U.S. Bank Tower on Capitol Mall features a nighttime LED projection display of a flowing river across its 80-foot-tall, louvered top. Another office tower is going up across the street.

• The former Firestone tire dealership at 16th and L will reopen this fall as The Firestone – a complex with a Fleming's Prime Steakhouse, a California Pizza Kitchen, DeVere's Irish Pub and an upstairs lounge operated by the family that runs Mason's, Ma Jong's and The Ultra Lounge.

• The owner of the Firehouse restaurant in Old Sacramento is nearing completion on a replica of the Gold Rush-era Orleans Hotel. The five-story building has 24 loft-style apartments and a restaurant and retail space downstairs.

• On Sept. 26, The Cosmopolitan will debut with a party and opening of "Forever Plaid," a show staged by the California Musical Theatre, in the new, Cosmopolitan Cabaret. Restaurateur Randy Paragary will run a deli-inspired restaurant, Cosmo's, in the downstairs, and a Las Vegas-style nightclub with a rooftop patio overlooking K Street.

• Heller just converted an old Travelodge motel at 11th and H streets into Retrolodge, a complex of 50 tiny offices renting for about $600 to $1,500 a month. The two buildings are decorated in a 1950s style and named Elroy and Astro after the cartoon TV show "The Jetsons."

Even as these projects get finished, there are signs that some of downtown's tougher spots are about to get some attention.

K Street's ample collection of run-down buildings attracted the notice of Napa's Trancas Ventures, which renovated the former Roos Atkins department store at 10th and K streets into "office condos" and has bought other buildings nearby. The firm is negotiating to buy the Crest Theatre, and has been talking to the city about renovating into a hotel a closed bank at 10th and K.

"We've always made it a practice of finding buildings nobody wants and creating buildings everybody wants," said Trancas adviser Jim Brennan.

Shopping mall giant Westfield says it will start construction by early next year on a long-awaited face-lift for Downtown Plaza.

"I'm really encouraged," Fritzsche said. "They have indicated they want to move their construction crews from work they're doing in Roseville straight down to do work on Downtown Plaza."

http://media.sacbee.com/smedia/2008/07/03/20/92-5M4DOWNTOWN.xlgraphic.prod_affiliate.4.gif
__________________
C'est le moment ou jamais
C'est facile comme tout
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #3338  
Old Posted Jul 5, 2008, 5:42 PM
SacUrbnPlnr SacUrbnPlnr is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 59
Condos Atop New B Street Theater?

Bob Shallit: Condos may top new B Street Theatre center
By Bob Shallit - [email protected]
Published 12:00 am PDT Saturday, July 5, 2008
Story appeared in BUSINESS section, Page D2

An architect's rendering shows five floors of residential condominium units proposed to be built atop the new B Street Theatre complex at 27th Street and Capitol Avenue in midtown Sacramento. The condos would help subsidize about $15 million of the theater construction.
Ankrom Moisan / Associated Architects



There's a surprise second act in the works for the B Street Theatre's new midtown performance center: About 100 residential condo units could go atop the theater's proposed complex at 27th Street and Capitol Avenue.

The condos would help subsidize construction of the theater, slashing B Street's costs from at least $25 million to about $10 million, says Bill Blake, the company's managing director.

"It would fund a large portion of the building," Blake says of the five-story condo addition.

He credits housing developer Sotiris Kolokotronis – a longtime B Street backer – with the idea of topping the theater complex with condos.

The building's original plan called for a so-called "fly tower" at one end to accommodate theater backdrops and sets that must be raised and lowered during scenery changes.

Now, the plan is for a boxier look. But, Blake insists, "it's a really nice box," designed by Portland architecture firm Ankrom Moisan, which also worked on Kolokotronis' L Street Lofts project at 18th and L streets.

The goal is to complete the project – part of Sutter Medical Center's $600 million complex of hospital facilities, parking, housing and retail services – in 2012.

Condo prices would range from the mid-$300,000s to more than $1 million – similar to the L Street Lofts. But this project would be built on a not-for-profit basis; once construction costs are paid off, all condo profits would fund theater operations, Kolokotronis says.

The plans – submitted to Sacramento city planners this week – call for a two-story glassed-in lobby, with a coffee shop on the first floor and a second-floor bistro serving theater-goers, condo owners and the surrounding community.

The public lobby fits in with what Blake says is B Street's mission: To be "a populist theater that's embedded in the community … a place where everybody is welcome to hang out."
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #3339  
Old Posted Jul 5, 2008, 6:19 PM
L8 4 Tahoe L8 4 Tahoe is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Sacramento
Posts: 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianSac View Post
• The former Firestone tire dealership at 16th and L will reopen this fall as The Firestone – a complex with a Fleming's Prime Steakhouse, a California Pizza Kitchen, DeVere's Irish Pub and an upstairs lounge operated by the family that runs Mason's, Ma Jong's and The Ultra Lounge.
I thought I read somewhere that Flemings pulled from the building. Maybe on here....
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #3340  
Old Posted Jul 5, 2008, 10:49 PM
arod74's Avatar
arod74 arod74 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: east Sac
Posts: 358
Quote:
Originally Posted by L8 4 Tahoe View Post
I thought I read somewhere that Flemings pulled from the building. Maybe on here....
Yeah it was posted not too long ago. I would take the information posted here over the Bee article based on the amount of errors they have reported over the years concerning other various projects. Though Fleming's is a nice joint, I wouldn't be too heartbroken about losing a steakhouse. There seems to be plenty in town and something a little more exotic would be nice..
__________________
Damn you Robert Horry!!!
Reply With Quote
     
     
This discussion thread continues

Use the page links to the lower-right to go to the next page for additional posts
 
 
Reply

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > United States > Pacific West > Sacramento Area
Forum Jump



Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 12:46 AM.

     

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2026, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.