PHILADELPHIA | Lowrise/General Developments Thread II

[PurpleWhiteOut]

Originally Posted by cardeza

everyone knows where Chinatown is located, suburbanites can go down there today via SEPTA or car. Most do not do so. What logical expectation would there be for thing to drastically change just because the sixers start playing nearby? I think one of the valid criticisms is the lofty predictions of public transportation usage just because its in center city. It is not easy or convenient to commute via public transportation to night events from the burbs- thats a fact. The majority of those from outside the city will continue to drive and the streets around the stadium will be paralyzed on game nights. The road network around the sports complex is far more capacious vs center city proper and traffic is rough before and after games. The % of city residents who take septa likely wont change much so the hope has to be the % of suburbanites grows significantly with CC location.

You're spot on with this one. I often dont even take the train to go out of the city because it's so inconvenient coming back at night. Having spent my whole life here, this is really the truth for how a vast majority of suburban people think and live, whether or not it fits people's fantasies. On top of that, for those going in groups (families/friends) paying roundtrip fares for each person isn't going to sound appealing compared to parking. People don't like to be constricted with SEPTAs extremely limited schedule, and the unpredictability of the lengths of a game will make it a nonstarter for most people.
EDIT: Just remembered the SEPTA passes that will supposedly be included. I still don't see it making a large difference, but would definitely be needed to make a dent.

[PHL10]

Originally Posted by PurpleWhiteOut

I often dont even take the train to go out of the city because it's so inconvenient coming back at night.

Agree here. Regional Rail “can’t” increase frequency because there aren’t enough riders; but there aren’t enough riders because the frequency is so poor. No RR lines should have 2 hour headways on Saturday and Sunday. We have one of the few (only?) commuter rails tunnels in the US that pass through as opposed to a terminus in the city center. We could legitimately have German S-Bahn type service if SEPTA, state and local governments, and the public really had the will to make that commitment.

[Jayfar]

Originally Posted by PHL10

Agree here. Regional Rail “can’t” increase frequency because there aren’t enough riders; but there aren’t enough riders because the frequency is so poor. No RR lines should have 2 hour headways on Saturday and Sunday. We have one of the few (only?) commuter rails tunnels in the US that pass through as opposed to a terminus in the city center. We could legitimately have German S-Bahn type service if SEPTA, state and local governments, and the public really had the will to make that commitment.

But SEPTA is hard-pressed to employ enough engineers and conductors to maintain even the present frequency of service. They regularly lose personnel to better paying railroads.

[yuryphilly]

Addition to the condo building at 615 S 24th St

[Jayfar]

Originally Posted by yuryphilly

Addition to the condo building at 615 S 24th St

Good to see Bloc24 moving ahead, as it was stalled for a while. There’s a good chance that the Giant Heirloom Market in adjoining Bloc23 will expand into the commercial space here. As one who shops there regularly I can attest to their need for a bigger space and developer Stephen Rodriguez did state previously that that was a strong possibility.

[Mr Saturn64]

Originally Posted by PHL10

Agree here. Regional Rail “can’t” increase frequency because there aren’t enough riders; but there aren’t enough riders because the frequency is so poor. No RR lines should have 2 hour headways on Saturday and Sunday. We have one of the few (only?) commuter rails tunnels in the US that pass through as opposed to a terminus in the city center. We could legitimately have German S-Bahn type service if SEPTA, state and local governments, and the public really had the will to make that commitment.

This really is the impossible catch 22 that SEPTA finds itself faced with. I've been commuting to a new job in Center City on both the MFL and Regional Rail, and I've noticed this problem a lot. The MFL at rush hour is excessively overcrowded. It's like being in Tokyo. There are people crowded in the aisles and there won't be an empty seat until you get to 56th Street or so.

RR runs so infrequently that it's sometimes standing room only, but it ties into the other issue that Jayfar pointed out that there's only one conductor so you'll only have two or three cars open at a time. And because of this, it defers people from going into the city, and because of that SEPTA's service is less frequent. It's like trying to put together a Jenga tower only you make it as twisted as it was before it fell.

[Skintreesnail]

Originally Posted by Jayfar

Good to see Bloc24 moving ahead, as it was stalled for a while. There’s a good chance that the Giant Heirloom Market in adjoining Bloc23 will expand into the commercial space here. As one who shops there regularly I can attest to their need for a bigger space and developer Stephen Rodriguez did state previously that that was a strong possibility.

I hope so too but i keep getting the feeling that they'll close after the full giant opens at broad and Washington. I noticed over the past couple years they've slowly phased out a bunch of the stuff that made them unique to a normal giant. Less local stuff. I'm hoping breezys covers that to some extent when they open.

[PHLtoNYC]

Deleted, dup.

[Jayfar]

Originally Posted by Skintreesnail

I hope so too but i keep getting the feeling that they'll close after the full giant opens at broad and Washington. I noticed over the past couple years they've slowly phased out a bunch of the stuff that made them unique to a normal giant. Less local stuff. I'm hoping breezys covers that to some extent when they open.

Perhaps, but this is a very busy store and about a dozen blocks from the new Broad St location (and on the eastern side of Broad). It’s also a comparable distance to a full-fledged Giant at 60 N 23rd St.

[PHLtoNYC]

A nice article and some interesting stats.

Boyd’s is hosting a holiday market to show customers that Center City is back
https://www.inquirer.com/business/re...-20231213.html

On Chestnut Street, upscale clothier Boyd’s is contributing to the festive atmosphere with a holiday market on their fourth floor that features a variety of small merchants selling high-end gifts.

“This is the relaunch of this space,” said Gushner, of the fourth floor that’s been closed to the public since before COVID

“Center City is definitely coming back, but it takes time,” said Andrew Gushner, whose family has owned and operated Boyd’s for four generations. “That’s why we’re doing this: to drive traffic for holiday shopping and get people to come back to the city.”

A recent report the Center City District, a downtown business advocacy group, found that retail occupancy downtown reached 84.5% in September — just 5% short of what it was in 2019.

Retail brokers who deal with clients across the region say that they are hearing more positive sentiments from merchants downtown than they did in recent winters. Weekends, including Friday, are especially strong, they say.

Now shoppers are more likely to be city residents he says — downtown’s residential population soared during the pandemic — and less likely to be suburbanites, who are not in town as much because of remote work and perceptions of Philadelphia that have soured since 2020. (Center City District’s data show that 22% of visitors to the Rittenhouse shopping area are still from the Philadelphia suburbs, along with 23% of visitors to Midtown Village.)

“The residential population is what’s supporting these retailers, we’re not getting a lot of destination traffic,” said Steinberg. “Suburbanites used to come into town and get those offerings [from high end sellers like Coach and Burberry] now, they go to King of Prussia for that kind of fashion.”

But incidences of violent and property crime in Center City were similar in 2019 and 2022, despite a tragic surge in homicide in many of the city’s lower-income neighborhoods. Center City District reported that in the first nine months of 2023 serious crime downtown was 5% lower than in the same period in 2019.

“The media portrays an image about Center City as a whole that seems a little exaggerated, as someone who works here and is a resident here,” said Gushner.

“It’s been nice to see retail come back in the city,” said Gushner. “We’re just looking for ways to do events and activations and things like this to help bring it back.”

[PHLtoNYC]

Originally Posted by Skintreesnail

I hope so too but i keep getting the feeling that they'll close after the full giant opens at broad and Washington. I noticed over the past couple years they've slowly phased out a bunch of the stuff that made them unique to a normal giant. Less local stuff. I'm hoping breezys covers that to some extent when they open.

Broad & Wash. is a schlep from that Heirloom.

And Giant is likely responding to purchasing habits. A range of unique and local products is great, but people also like traditional grocery stores, which are finally expanding around the city.

Greater Center City could easily support 3 or 4 more Heirlooms. Rittenhouse area definitely needs one.

[Broadcastthatboom]

Originally Posted by PHLtoNYC

Broad & Wash. is a schlep from that Heirloom.

And Giant is likely responding to purchasing habits. A range of unique and local products is great, but people also like traditional grocery stores, which are finally expanding around the city.

Greater Center City could easily support 3 or 4 more Heirlooms. Rittenhouse area definitely needs one.

Forever salty about the Heirloom falling through at 2nd and South after years of being stalled....why can't Society Hill/Queen Village get more than the horrid half-sized Acme at 5th and Pine is beyond me.

[Redddog]

Originally Posted by Broadcastthatboom

Forever salty about the Heirloom falling through at 2nd and South after years of being stalled....why can't Society Hill/Queen Village get more than the horrid half-sized Acme at 5th and Pine is beyond me.

That Heirloom was doomed by a total D-Bag landlord. The entire holdup was that they refused to provide the type of electricity service needed to run a grocery store. Giant eventually had to pull out. I think that space is about the only one down there that was large enough for that place.

The landlords in this town are responsible for a lot of the issues.

[BroadandMarket]

Originally Posted by Mr Saturn64

This really is the impossible catch 22 that SEPTA finds itself faced with. I've been commuting to a new job in Center City on both the MFL and Regional Rail, and I've noticed this problem a lot. The MFL at rush hour is excessively overcrowded. It's like being in Tokyo. There are people crowded in the aisles and there won't be an empty seat until you get to 56th Street or so.

RR runs so infrequently that it's sometimes standing room only, but it ties into the other issue that Jayfar pointed out that there's only one conductor so you'll only have two or three cars open at a time. And because of this, it defers people from going into the city, and because of that SEPTA's service is less frequent. It's like trying to put together a Jenga tower only you make it as twisted as it was before it fell.

The El has super short platforms so there's no room for more cars. Then the layouts of the trains are really silly with too many rows and narrow aisles. They should have just 2 long benches like NYC has. This would also limit addicts from taking up those front seats with their belongings.

[PhilliesPhan]

Originally Posted by PHL10

Agree here. Regional Rail “can’t” increase frequency because there aren’t enough riders; but there aren’t enough riders because the frequency is so poor. No RR lines should have 2 hour headways on Saturday and Sunday. We have one of the few (only?) commuter rails tunnels in the US that pass through as opposed to a terminus in the city center. We could legitimately have German S-Bahn type service if SEPTA, state and local governments, and the public really had the will to make that commitment.

Trust me, we want to run additional service. The decision to keep headways at approximately 77% of pre-COVID levels has more to do with staffing issues and, to a lesser extent, the completion of State of Good Repair projects. We were having issues staffing trains prior to the pandemic, but situation became much worse once engineers started to retire at the beginning of 2020. Along with engineers, we also need more conductors. This is why you may have noticed that not all doors on a trainset will open during peak travel times. Finally, we need to replace our Silverliner IVs. They have been absolute workhorses over their nearly 50 year lifespans, but they're starting to show their age just a bit. The Silverliner VIs should help alleviate some of the issues we've been experiencing lately.

[Mr Saturn64]

You work for SEPTA? That's cool.

Originally Posted by PhilliesPhan

\The Silverliner VIs should help alleviate some of the issues we've been experiencing lately.

Speaking of, it's been a while since we heard anything about that. Since March, I think. Is there anything new to report on them?

[PhilliesPhan]

Originally Posted by Mr Saturn64

You work for SEPTA? That's cool.



Speaking of, it's been a while since we heard anything about that. Since March, I think. Is there anything new to report on them?

Yes I do! As for the Silverliner VIs, we released an Expression of Interest regarding procurement on November 9th. Bids will open in mid-January. The new EMUs should enter revenue service between 2028 and 2032.

[cardeza]

Originally Posted by PhilliesPhan

Trust me, we want to run additional service. The decision to keep headways at approximately 77% of pre-COVID levels has more to do with staffing issues and, to a lesser extent, the completion of State of Good Repair projects. We were having issues staffing trains prior to the pandemic, but situation became much worse once engineers started to retire at the beginning of 2020. Along with engineers, we also need more conductors. This is why you may have noticed that not all doors on a trainset will open during peak travel times. Finally, we need to replace our Silverliner IVs. They have been absolute workhorses over their nearly 50 year lifespans, but they're starting to show their age just a bit. The Silverliner VIs should help alleviate some of the issues we've been experiencing lately.

People would be lucky to see those new cars in 5-6 years considering how long it takes to get new rolling stock procured and produced. They still havent rolled out the bilevel cars that were supposed to be in service 2-3 years ago.

[El Duderino]

Updates and renderings for Thomas Paine Plaza. Bummer that the budget was cut so much.

Conceptual Design for Thomas Paine Plaza Receives Praise, Approval
https://www.ocfrealty.com/naked-phil...aise-approval/
Naked Philly, 12/14/2023

[Mayormccheese]

Originally Posted by El Duderino

Updates and renderings for Thomas Paine Plaza. Bummer that the budget was cut so much.

Conceptual Design for Thomas Paine Plaza Receives Praise, Approval
https://www.ocfrealty.com/naked-phil...aise-approval/
Naked Philly, 12/14/2023

They should develop the east side of the plaza into a hotel or something. There’s enough plazas in the area.