PITTSBURGH | Development Rundown II

[Buzz Pittsburgh]

Originally Posted by Steel City Scotty

My point is...I really like the idea of having a hockey-themed sports bar close to Consol Energy Center, but there are some examples of businesses located near sporting venues in the city that went from popular to non-existent in less than a year.

I probably don't have to tell many of you that the Penguins are a lot more successful than the Pirates. So, hopefully, "poor quality hockey" won't have a negative impact on this new place.

I think the Blue Line will do well not only because of Pens fans but also because of all of the activity aside from those games being held at Consol. You have the PIHL Penguins cup, Pittsburgh Hockey Showcase, and high profile concerts making any restaurant around that area a potential after-show stop. With the Marriott City Center and Cambria Suites nearby, you can have potential customers just walking by.
With the North Shore, you really didn't have any hotels near the stadiums until about 3-4 years ago. Even with that potential customer base, there are not as many events (or high profile/high attendance events) at PNC Park as are held at Consol.

[Steel City Scotty]

Originally Posted by Jonboy1983

Agreed on all counts regarding the PPG Place proposals. I hated the comments on the Post-Gazette. People, at least PG readers, seem to have a problem with a little class in Downtown, especially in/near Market Square. Um, it's in a prominent office complex right smack in the middle of Downtown. What the hell do they expect? Sorry, but home-grown affordable to me is not the best use for the Winter Garden. Really folks? I actually posted my 2cents at the end of that PG article and mentioned how a car dealership was discussed.

Regarding the article about the housing boom, I'm thinking Pittsburgh's population could be about to take off really soon...

Haha, it's funny you mention that because I always read the comments below the articles in the Post-Gazette, and they're usually filled with cynical remarks and negativity. Yours' stood out because it was actually positive and supportive of the subject being discussed in the story.

I also took notice that it said you work for Marriott. I don't know much about hotels, but any reference to that company catches my attention because my sister-in-law works at one of their properties in Oakland. When my wife and I travel, we always find the Marriott hotel in each city so we can take advantage of the family discount.

[Evergrey]

Originally Posted by Private Dick

You think a sports bar across the street from the Consol Arena will only be nearly full on a game day?

The place will be packed pre and post Pens game, pre and post any event.

Add in the adjacent proximity of proposed developments on the Civic Arena site, Duquesne, hotels, lunch and happy hour crowd, rooftop atmosphere... the place has the potential to be a goldmine.

Agreed. They're making the right decision to GO BIG at this location. 'Just another bar' would likely fail.

[Jonboy1983]

Originally Posted by Steel City Scotty

Haha, it's funny you mention that because I always read the comments below the articles in the Post-Gazette, and they're usually filled with cynical remarks and negativity. Yours' stood out because it was actually positive and supportive of the subject being discussed in the story.

I also took notice that it said you work for Marriott. I don't know much about hotels, but any reference to that company catches my attention because my sister-in-law works at one of their properties in Oakland. When my wife and I travel, we always find the Marriott hotel in each city so we can take advantage of the family discount.

I'm glad you liked it.

Btw, thanks for just about giving me a heart attack with that info on the High Point Park dream atop US Steel!

I would LOVE for that to come to fruition!!!

[BrianTH]

I'm not sure where the notion of a "three story bar" came from. The project has a bar on the ground floor, two levels of apartments, then an indoor/outdoor lounge on the top floor.

[Steel City Scotty]

Originally Posted by Jonboy1983

I'm glad you liked it.

Btw, thanks for just about giving me a heart attack with that info on the High Point Park dream atop US Steel!

I would LOVE for that to come to fruition!!!

You're very welcome. I think it sounds like a truly awesome idea.

After reading that article, I followed the link the writer mentioned (www.highpointpittsburgh.com) and checked out the virtual tour. I had to add Unity Player to my computer, and it took several minutes for the simulation to download, but it was pretty cool once I got to use my keyboard to move around the top of the U.S. Steel Tower.

[bruchaus]

Originally Posted by Buzz Pittsburgh

Even with that potential customer base, there are not as many events (or high profile/high attendance events) at PNC Park as are held at Consol.

The Pirates play 81 home games a year and over the 12 year history of PNC Park has average around 23,000 people per game. Every now and then they have a concert or some other event, but mainly baseball. Consol's website claims 150 events per year. Pens average a sell out at 18,000 per game. So Consol most likely gets more traffic over the year.

A big difference between the drinking habits of the two fans is that many folks like to tailgate in the parking lots for baseball games. You don't have much of that at Pens games. This definitely hurts the bar scene around PNC Park, at least before the game.

[East Edge]

Originally Posted by Steel City Scotty

You're very welcome. I think it sounds like a truly awesome idea.

After reading that article, I followed the link the writer mentioned (www.highpointpittsburgh.com) and checked out the virtual tour. I had to add Unity Player to my computer, and it took several minutes for the simulation to download, but it was pretty cool once I got to use my keyboard to move around the top of the U.S. Steel Tower.

This is what I mean by "World Class City!". Very cool.

[Evergrey]

In nerdy statistical news, the government has released updated Metropolitan Area definitions today. The Pittsburgh CSA is growing.. in land mass.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/defa...013/b13-01.pdf

The Pittsburgh-New Castle CSA has added the Weirton-Steubenville WV-OH MSA and the Indiana, PA micropolitan area. Of course, our additions are pretty modest compared to some other CSAs... this "mega-metro" definition is getting so broad that it's beginning to lose all meaning (for example, Cleveland adds New Philadelphia to its CSA, which is 86 miles away).

So based on the latest population estimates...

Pittsburgh CSA

2010: 2,447,393
2011: 2,450,281
Change: +2,888

Weirton-Steubenville MSA

2010: 124,454
2011: 123,243
Change: -1,221

Indiana County

2010: 88,880
2011: 89,298
Change: +418

New Pittsburgh CSA

2010: 2,660,727
2011: 2,662,822
Change: +2,095

Increase over previous definition: +212,541

One problem with adding Weirton-Steubenville is that area is still in population freefall... so it will be harder for the expanded Pittsburgh CSA to squeak out overall population growth with the WV/OH drag.

On the plus side, WheelingMan (who lives in Weirton) can now officially claim to be a Pittsburgh CSA resident.

[themaguffin]

It makes sense for Steubenville, but it will be a drag. Unless the Allegheny county really starts to pick up steam, it's only going to be harder to show a net overall gain.

[Brentsters]

Bike Share is Coming to Pittsburgh

http://bikepgh.org/2013/03/11/mayor-...to-pittsburgh/

[BrianTH]

Cell phone pics of a few facade projects Downtown that are coming along very nicely:

[Found5dollar]

Originally Posted by Brentsters

Bike Share is Coming to Pittsburgh

http://bikepgh.org/2013/03/11/mayor-...to-pittsburgh/

YES!!!!! THIS IS AWSOME!!!!!

there is a bike share in Boston and it works awesomely... i am a little put off by proposed station placement (no Squirrel Hill?), but this should be a big improvement over all for transit int he city.

[Topher51]

Originally Posted by Found5dollar

YES!!!!! THIS IS AWSOME!!!!!

there is a bike share in Boston and it works awesomely... i am a little put off by proposed station placement (no Squirrel Hill?), but this should be a big improvement over all for transit int he city.

The Bikeshare worked really well in DC too. I used it a couple of times just for the heck of it and really enjoyed it. Awesome for Pittsburgh.

[BrianTH]

Originally Posted by Found5dollar

i am a little put off by proposed station placement (no Squirrel Hill?)

They have a heat-map thingy that purports to explain the logic by the locations, with Squirrel Hill (and Regent Square, another possibility I would have thought) not making the cut. I'm OK with that for now, but I would hope that if this takes off, and in general biking interest in Pittsburgh continues to grow, they will be able to expand their location map.

[Jonboy1983]

Originally Posted by Steel City Scotty

You're very welcome. I think it sounds like a truly awesome idea.

After reading that article, I followed the link the writer mentioned (www.highpointpittsburgh.com) and checked out the virtual tour. I had to add Unity Player to my computer, and it took several minutes for the simulation to download, but it was pretty cool once I got to use my keyboard to move around the top of the U.S. Steel Tower.

Originally Posted by East Edge

This is what I mean by "World Class City!". Very cool.

Amen! I also saw a lot of positive feedback from the PG readers for this proposal. I really hope it continues to build and gain steam; enough to convince the building's owners to get on board.

Originally Posted by Evergrey

In nerdy statistical news, the government has released updated Metropolitan Area definitions today. The Pittsburgh CSA is growing.. in land mass.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/defa...013/b13-01.pdf

The Pittsburgh-New Castle CSA has added the Weirton-Steubenville WV-OH MSA and the Indiana, PA micropolitan area. Of course, our additions are pretty modest compared to some other CSAs... this "mega-metro" definition is getting so broad that it's beginning to lose all meaning (for example, Cleveland adds New Philadelphia to its CSA, which is 86 miles away).

So based on the latest population estimates...

Pittsburgh CSA

2010: 2,447,393
2011: 2,450,281
Change: +2,888

Weirton-Steubenville MSA

2010: 124,454
2011: 123,243
Change: -1,221

Indiana County

2010: 88,880
2011: 89,298
Change: +418

New Pittsburgh CSA

2010: 2,660,727
2011: 2,662,822
Change: +2,095

Increase over previous definition: +212,541

One problem with adding Weirton-Steubenville is that area is still in population freefall... so it will be harder for the expanded Pittsburgh CSA to squeak out overall population growth with the WV/OH drag.

On the plus side, WheelingMan (who lives in Weirton) can now officially claim to be a Pittsburgh CSA resident.

Originally Posted by themaguffin

It makes sense for Steubenville, but it will be a drag. Unless the Allegheny county really starts to pick up steam, it's only going to be harder to show a net overall gain.

Steubenville, at least as recently as perhaps 7 years ago, has marketed itself as a bedroom community for Pittsburgh, especially with the "newly" opened Findlay Connector cutting travel time to KPIT to a 20 minute trek. Hopefully this could spark some kind of renaissance for the Steubenville-Weirton area since it now officially has ties to the greater Pittsburgh region, which is a burgeoning metro as a whole. Hopefully now the CSA can lure extra funds to improve infrastructure to better connect this region with itself.

I know the Turnpike's next phase in the Southern Beltway project, the link from US22 to I-79 is picking up. That would provide better access from Steubenville to the growing parts of Washington County, particularly around Peters and Southpointe.

Originally Posted by BrianTH

Cell phone pics of a few facade projects Downtown that are coming along very nicely:

Il Pizzaiolo? Don't they have a Mt. Lebanon location? Still, nice to see the facade improvements. It will really improve the streetscape of downtown.

[themaguffin]

Steubenville, at least as recently as perhaps 7 years ago, has marketed itself as a bedroom community for Pittsburgh, especially with the "newly" opened Findlay Connector cutting travel time to KPIT to a 20 minute trek. Hopefully this could spark some kind of renaissance for the Steubenville-Weirton area since it now officially has ties to the greater Pittsburgh region, which is a burgeoning metro as a whole. Hopefully now the CSA can lure extra funds to improve infrastructure to better connect this region with itself.

Like I said, from a practical stand point, it makes sense. I was one of those commuters years ago. I lived a good portion of my life there and know it well, but despite the improved connections, the area itself, is in a sad state and bleeding people.

[Jonboy1983]

Originally Posted by themaguffin

Like I said, from a practical stand point, it makes sense. I was one of those commuters years ago. I lived a good portion of my life there and know it well, but despite the improved connections, the area itself, is in a sad state and bleeding people.

Oh, you're right that it is bleeding people. I'm just saying that since it's officially linked with a burgeoning metro area, maybe some of the growth can shift over to Steubenville-Weirton. Maybe something else can happen to encourage growth -- better access in some form between Steubenville and the greater Pittsburgh area...

Youngstown is bleeding people considerably. I wonder if that will be added at some point, either to Cleveland or Pittsburgh's CSA.

[BrianTH]

Originally Posted by Jonboy1983

Il Pizzaiolo? Don't they have a Mt. Lebanon location?

Yep, and I believe the Executive Chef is moving to the Downtown location. It is also has a second floor bar (another nice evening-oriented addition for Market Square):

http://www.pgplate.com/openings/281-...open-this-week

As a random aside: how various local population numbers get presented in terms of CSA definitions and such doesn't matter to me. What does matter is the underlying facts, but those will be the same regardless of how the CSA is defined.

[Jonboy1983]

Originally Posted by BrianTH

Yep, and I believe the Executive Chef is moving to the Downtown location. It is also has a second floor bar (another nice evening-oriented addition for Market Square):

http://www.pgplate.com/openings/281-...open-this-week

As a random aside: how various local population numbers get presented in terms of CSA definitions and such doesn't matter to me. What does matter is the underlying facts, but those will be the same regardless of how the CSA is defined.

by underlying facts, I guess you mean things like the percentage of those with a college degree, average household income, racial breakdown, etc?

Regarding Il Pizzaiolo, I had a friend from high school who used to work at the Mt. Lebanon location. She since got married and is now living in Toronto.