CHICAGO | General Discussions

[lakeshoredrive]

Originally Posted by thegoatman

i'm afraid the tribune plan gets cancelled and they instead build some generic garbage 600 ft glass residential tower there instead

if they dare to do that, we need to attend the meeting for it and call out the developer and tell them to build the Tribune East tower instead. Put pressure on them to make sure nothing generic gets built here.

[Kngkyle]

With the cost of borrowing and materials skyrocketing there is slim to nil chance Tribune Tower East moves forward as previously envisioned anytime soon. About the only thing that might pencil out in this spot over next year or two is a generic ~500ft apartment tower.

[Zapatan]

Originally Posted by Kngkyle

With the cost of borrowing and materials skyrocketing there is slim to nil chance Tribune Tower East moves forward as previously envisioned anytime soon. About the only thing that might pencil out in this spot over next year or two is a generic ~500ft apartment tower.

I'd rather wait several years for even another 300+ meter building than for that to happen. If that were true then probably nothing is getting built over the next year or two.

I get sick of mediocrity and blown opportunities. Mexico, Brazil and Egypt all have buildings at or near the 400 range either U/C or under serious consideration but Chicago can't?

I guess construction costs are cheaper in those places but is that really the only reason?

It's kind of a take on the dead Waldorf Astoria proposal the way it ascends/descends.

I'd much prefer that over the current 400LSD proposal. Reminds me of SWFC but without the hole.

[southoftheloop]

Originally Posted by Zapatan

I get sick of mediocrity and blown opportunities. Mexico, Brazil and Egypt all have buildings at or near the 400 range either U/C or under serious consideration but Chicago can't?

Mexico, Brazil and Egypt are all major world economies, Chicago is a city. Chill

[Zapatan]

Originally Posted by southoftheloop

Mexico, Brazil and Egypt are all major world economies, Chicago is a city. Chill

Should've compared the cities they were being built in and not the countries but the point still stands. The US is a more major economy so it could be doing better, although I guess the downside of this is increased construction costs.

[thegoatman]

The 400 LSD design is fine, i like the twin towers. Just dislike the height. Literal prime location, no reason for it not to be a supertall. Save the 600 feet towers for the West/South Loop.

I really hope 1000M isn't the last 800 ft+ tower Chicago gets for awhile. This is Chicago, best skyline in America, a building doesn't get into that skyline changing range until bout that 700-800 ft range here. I mean Salesforce is 850 ft and barely peaks out in the skyline (from the lake atleast).

I keep up with developments in other city and see that cities like NYC, Miami, even fucking Austin has multiple supertalls in the pipeline, Chicago needs atleast another one. Believe it or not, Chicago was literally keeping up with New York skyscraper wise until the 2010s decade. Chicago defintely produced some great towers that decade, but New York absolutely exploded development wise and left the city in the dust.

Anyway, i'm optimistic...i'm bullish on Chicago and definitely see a bright future for construction this decade..

[Zapatan]

Anyway, i'm optimistic...i'm bullish on Chicago and definitely see a bright future for construction this decade..

Based on... ?

It's kind of like post vacation blues coming out of this cycle. Chicago built some great projects but seemingly nothing in the pipeline for a while.

[twister244]

Originally Posted by Zapatan

Based on... ?

It's kind of like post vacation blues coming out of this cycle. Chicago built some great projects but seemingly nothing in the pipeline for a while.

As mentioned previously, costs are skyrocketing and most big players are expecting a recession to develop, so it's not surprising we aren't seeing any risky big proposals being announced right now.

[Mr. Chicago]

Mr. Chicago here,
I know it may seem pointless and yes that garage could have used more lighting and a painting but it was part of an architecture very symbolic of a different time and a different Chicago. Modernity was functional, open and brought life to the machine age. I know Fulton Market will look good, (it already does), but talk to the architectural historian of the future and even an anthropologist decades from now and explain the meaning of buildings going up right now. Well there are other projects around and for me Chicago is still a magic place. Besides there are more important issues, e.g. Banana Republic is closing its Mag. Mile location I hear. I still say international Mag. Mile is the way to go.

[Rizzo]

Originally Posted by Mr. Chicago

Mr. Chicago here,
I know it may seem pointless and yes that garage could have used more lighting and a painting but it was part of an architecture very symbolic of a different time and a different Chicago. Modernity was functional, open and brought life to the machine age. I know Fulton Market will look good, (it already does), but talk to the architectural historian of the future and even an anthropologist decades from now and explain the meaning of buildings going up right now. Well there are other projects around and for me Chicago is still a magic place. Besides there are more important issues, e.g. Banana Republic is closing its Mag. Mile location I hear. I still say international Mag. Mile is the way to go.

Retail closures are bad, but I wouldn’t say that serious of an issue since there will always be new stores to replace it. Gap brands have not been doing well. Doesn’t help that BR was the go-to affordable clothing store for business casual before the pandemic. Even returning to work a few days a week, the dress code has really become far more casual with my peers. Magnificent mile was mall stores for decades. It’s finally getting over that and will eventually be something different and possibly better. Now the south end of state street, that needs help

As for the parking garage, it’s limited in its function. Functional modernity means it could be converted to something else. That garage was crudely built, the formwork sloppy and it’s incapable of being adapted or supporting heavier floor loads to become any other purpose. Demolish it so we can say we did something correct for urbanity when the anthropologists look back

[marothisu]

Originally Posted by Rizzo

Retail closures are bad, but I wouldn’t say that serious of an issue since there will always be new stores to replace it. Gap brands have not been doing well. Doesn’t help that BR was the go-to affordable clothing store for business casual before the pandemic. Even returning to work a few days a week, the dress code has really become far more casual with my peers. Magnificent mile was mall stores for decades. It’s finally getting over that and will eventually be something different and possibly better. Now the south end of state street, that needs help

As for the parking garage, it’s limited in its function. Functional modernity means it could be converted to something else. That garage was crudely built, the formwork sloppy and it’s incapable of being adapted or supporting heavier floor loads to become any other purpose. Demolish it so we can say we did something correct for urbanity when the anthropologists look back

It's mind blowing how big of a deal some people are making over a Banana Republic, a generic mid tier store, is closing. They announced over 2 years ago that they were closing over 100 locations in the US by end of 2023. This type of brick and mortar retail in most places has been dying for a long time. People need to wake up, stop thinking it's only their city, and start thinking more intelligently. It could be slow, but Mag Mile will change and be fine eventually. Just hope they get more restaurants right on Michigan Ave

[SamInTheLoop]

Originally Posted by marothisu

It's mind blowing how big of a deal some people are making over a Banana Republic, a generic mid tier store, is closing. They announced over 2 years ago that they were closing over 100 locations in the US by end of 2023. This type of brick and mortar retail in most places has been dying for a long time. People need to wake up, stop thinking it's only their city, and start thinking more intelligently. It could be slow, but Mag Mile will change and be fine eventually. Just hope they get more restaurants right on Michigan Ave

Maybe there's a little of that reaction, but I think that folks are largely having a justified reaction to another in a long line of recent closings that are taking a while to backfill. The mag mile is at its absolute lowest point in memory - maybe ever? I don't think that people are saying it's doomed/never going to be reinvented/recover either (it will)....it's just a largely rational assessment of current market conditions which are pudding-soft, without any indiation of a substantialk near-term turnaround.

And yes, the ave does need a more unique identity and draw in tenant mix, but the comparison to the more niche upscale streets just to the west is of course off base, as one of the issues with the Mag Mile is the sheer area of space that is still retail. It's of course been (necessarily) declining with the 'decommissioning' (from a retail perspective) of a lot of that higher floor space in some of the malls, but it's still just too much space to be that upscale. Yes, there are a lot of luxury-destined discretionary dollars out there from tourists, business travelers and locals alike, I'm sure you'll come back with......but simply not enough.

[thegoatman]

Originally Posted by SamInTheLoop

Maybe there's a little of that reaction, but I think that folks are largely having a justified reaction to another in a long line of recent closings that are taking a while to backfill. The mag mile is at its absolute lowest point in memory - maybe ever? I don't think that people are saying it's doomed/never going to be reinvented/recover either (it will)....it's just a largely rational assessment of current market conditions which are pudding-soft, without any indiation of a substantialk near-term turnaround.

And yes, the ave does need a more unique identity and draw in tenant mix, but the comparison to the more niche upscale streets just to the west is of course off base, as one of the issues with the Mag Mile is the sheer area of space that is still retail. It's of course been (necessarily) declining with the 'decommissioning' (from a retail perspective) of a lot of that higher floor space in some of the malls, but it's still just too much space to be that upscale. Yes, there are a lot of luxury-destined discretionary dollars out there from tourists, business travelers and locals alike, I'm sure you'll come back with......but simply not enough.

Yeah there's THREE banana republic stores within walking distance of Times Square in New York, and the fact that the Mag Mile can't even support a single one is concerning. I have yet to see any single proposals from the city to reimagine Michigan ave, seems like they're just content with the status quo of all these companies leaving. It's not a good look

[Kngkyle]

I'm actually a bit happy to see these generic national chains close up shop on Michigan Ave. I'd rather see them on State, which is suffering far more than Michigan Ave.. or at least it feels that way if you walk down S State. There is potential for so much better on Michigan Ave. Either make it a distinct flagship experience or just stick to suburban shopping malls. Michigan Ave should be unique. No loss in my book.

[marothisu]

Originally Posted by Kngkyle

I'm actually a bit happy to see these generic national chains close up shop on Michigan Ave. I'd rather see them on State, which is suffering far more than Michigan Ave.. or at least it feels that way if you walk down S State. There is potential for so much better on Michigan Ave. Either make it a distinct flagship experience or just stick to suburban shopping malls. Michigan Ave should be unique. No loss in my book.

There's a reason why areas like Rush/Oak/Walton nearby, or Armitage (and to an extent....Southport) do well. At least Armitage and Oak St area have more high end and unique brands that aren't a dime a dozen everywhere like Banana Republic or Gap is.

[mh777]

Originally Posted by Kngkyle

I'm actually a bit happy to see these generic national chains close up shop on Michigan Ave. I'd rather see them on State, which is suffering far more than Michigan Ave.. or at least it feels that way if you walk down S State. There is potential for so much better on Michigan Ave. Either make it a distinct flagship experience or just stick to suburban shopping malls. Michigan Ave should be unique. No loss in my book.

Totally agree. So much potential. It’s also crazy to me that even with the current 30% vacancy rate on the Mag Mile, every single weekend the streets are absolutely packed with people. On that note, is there zoning against having bars/restaurants directly on Michigan on the mag mile? There are literally none, and I’d think those would be gold mines.

[rivernorthlurker]

Originally Posted by twister244

You bring up a good point. The problem isn't a lack of foot traffic, it's the business model. Mag Mile worked in an era when you couldn't easily buy shit online. I'm sure there's a few higher-end stores that may go on since some folks like to go try on expensive stuff before purchasing it. However, the rest of that area needs to pivot towards businesses that draw people in for experiences you can't get anywhere else.

Totally agree, and they'll figure it out. More 'experiences' than shopping. Eg the Prince Museum, the Museum of Ice Cream, and the Starbucks Roastery are all good recent additions. And flagship stores like Ralph Lauren.

[ithakas]

Originally Posted by rivernorthlurker

Totally agree, and they'll figure it out. More 'experiences' than shopping. Eg the Prince Museum, the Museum of Ice Cream, and the Starbucks Roastery are all good recent additions. And flagship stores like Ralph Lauren.

Does anyone have any insight on why cities like Paris, Rome, London seem to have far less retail vacancy than American peers? I just got back from a trip to Paris where I walked probably 10 miles a day and saw only a handful of vacant storefronts across the city the whole time. Same with Rome last fall...

[galleyfox]

Originally Posted by ithakas

Does anyone have any insight on why cities like Paris, Rome, London seem to have far less retail vacancy than American peers? I just got back from a trip to Paris where I walked probably 10 miles a day and saw only a handful of vacant storefronts across the city the whole time. Same with Rome last fall...

The U.S. has a lot more retail space than other countries. The sector is overbuilt.

[Randomguy34]

Open House Chicago is really amazing this year. If you're not participating, you're missing out