Community Development - Blatchford

[feepa]

Originally Posted by Policy Wonk

I am strongly in favor of that, and given the extreme animosity between Edmonton Airports and small operators that will probably happen should this real estate scam come to pass.

These small operators are the ones who are scamming the city.

I often wonder when reading your posts on this thread if you even believe half the shift you are spewing.

[Policy Wonk]

So the operators at YEG and ZVL with their own list of grievances with Edmonton Airports are also scamming the city?

I don't believe that every urban airport, harbour and railyard should have to continually fight for its existence because somebody wants to build condos there. Call me a wild eyed extremist. Until 2004 YXD served its role admirably and it could do so once more free of Edmonton Airports policy of sabotage.

[feepa]

Still waiting for the Calgary City Center Airport proposal. Those poor people in the south are all dieing cause calgary has no city center airport.

Where were you when CN pull out the railyard downtown? And how about rail access over the CP High level bridge?

You still haven't identified a solid reason why we should keep the city center airport over, besides your itch to save 10 minutes in your commute between Edmonton and Calgary.

[Policy Wonk]

So Walker Yard has closed some time in the last couple of days? Damn, nobody said a thing! Are they building condos there too?

The CPR discontinued service North of High Level because they could fit their entire daily embarkment of Dayliner passengers in a yellow school bus with room to spare. And if Leduc is good enough for air passengers, what was wrong with Strathcona?

While by comparison YXD would continue to be well used were Edmonton Airports to allow it.

Back in the 1960's when it was proposed by the Department of Transport that Calgary build a new airport near Irricana everyone agreed that was a ridiculous idea, particularly in the context of the struggles in Leduc at that time. Deny all you wish but the FBO's from which service to Edmonton was offered are extremely accessible from downtown Calgary.

[feepa]

I was talking about the railyard downtown. You know, where Stationlands, Grant Macewan and a future arena sit.
I guess those were all just greedy developers in your mind. In my mind, it did a world of good change for Edmonton.

[Policy Wonk]

That isn't even similar. In the absence of any tangible number of passenger trains (6 a week I believe?) serving CN Tower Station the continued operation of the facilities around CN Tower Station couldn't be justified when Walker Yard was just on the other side of YXD.

While in 2006 YXD saw 86,574 aircraft movements,

[feepa]

In which most of those flights were training flights that return to yxd on the same movement or land at other area airport

[DAVEinEDMONTON]

Come one and all to the City of Edmonton's production of..."Chicken Little".

Starring in the title role as Chicken Little...."Envision Edmonton" and their cast of cronies.

Also starring as Loosie Goosie, Henny Penny, Ducky Lucky and the rest of the barn yard animals are played by those scared citizens of Edmonton who signed the petition on the spoken fears of Chicken Little.

And last but not least, starring in their biggest role to date as the big bad Foxy Loxy please welcome our very own Anne McLennan and the rest of the board of directors of the Edmonton Airport Authority.

Yes folks, the sky is indeed falling!!!!

[Policy Wonk]

Originally Posted by feepa

In which most of those flights were training flights that return to yxd on the same movement or land at other area airport

Training flights are a third to half of activity, it varies. Naturally their share has been increasing since Edmonton Airports began harassing the remaining tenants of YXD in 2004.

[bob1954]

Who's dying in South Calgary because there's no city center airport?

[DAVEinEDMONTON]

Originally Posted by bob1954

Who's dying in South Calgary because there's no city center airport?

No one and that is a good point.

The premier of Alberta has now gotten into the debate and ordered another new study about medivac services which if any reasonable person read anything about the issue would know that the City of Edmonton and the Edmonton Airports Authority are both working together to ensure a safe and reliable transfer of the medivac services to the Edmonton International Airport.

Once the report is finalized, fears about the closure will disappear.

[joeyedm]

anyone who still thinks this whole Envision Edmonton thing is a grass roots movement is a moron.

This is the elite of the elite of Edmonton and Alberta who are manipulating the population to their benefit.

Wake up people.

[feepa]

^ I wouldn't call them elite, and many of them aren't even Edmontonians. Most of the money, is Calgary Businessmen, and YYC.

EnvEdm won't open their books. Little wonder why.

[Airboy]

I quick note, which I hope will be added during the next Air ambulance review.And also a what the fuck moment.

Got behind an Air Ambulance ground unit leaving YXD Friday at 8:20 pm and followed it all the way to Sturgeon Hospital. Lights were going as well. Probably been closer to go to the Alex. Hmmmmmm

[Daveography]

Originally Posted by Policy Wonk

Until 2004 YXD served its role admirably and it could do so once more free of Edmonton Airports policy of sabotage.

Once again your choice of language is amusing. Edmonton Airports operates the airport on the land which the city of Edmonton owns. If the operator has decided that closing one of the airports under its purview allows it to better operate and serve Edmonton, and the landowner has agreed, then they are within their rights to close it.

All this talk about sabotage and freedom is idiotic and ignores - in fact attempts to rewrite - reality. The remaining businesses who continue to operate at ECCA and refuse to relocate despite the airport authority's attempts to help them transition have no rights to that airport. They do not own it or the land it sits on. And so far, they have shown no interest in trying to buy the land from the city to operate the airport privately, despite their claims that it is such a gem with so much potential (claims which you enjoy echoing).

I'll give you this much, P.W., at least you're not hiding behind medivac arguments and bogus claims of land contamination. You deserve a bit of credit for that.

[Policy Wonk]

Originally Posted by RTA

Once again your choice of language is amusing. Edmonton Airports operates the airport on the land which the city of Edmonton owns. If the operator has decided that closing one of the airports under its purview allows it to better operate and serve Edmonton, and the landowner has agreed, then they are within their rights to close it.

Yes, but they are also a municipal government and a significant proportion of the population has indicated their disapproval of the decision.

All this talk about sabotage and freedom is idiotic and ignores - in fact attempts to rewrite - reality. The remaining businesses who continue to operate at ECCA and refuse to relocate despite the airport authority's attempts to help them transition have no rights to that airport. They do not own it or the land it sits on.

Might you refuse my help relocating to Calgary?

So you dispute that from the moment of their creation Edmonton Airports has NOT done everything in their power to undermine YXD, including organized harassment of its tenants and lobbying for its closure?

Those fighting the closure of YXD have valid leases, signed on the reasonable assumption YXD would continue to operate until at the very least 2051 as set out in the previous plebiscite. It is going to cost the good people of Edmonton a fortune to break these leases.

And so far, they have shown no interest in trying to buy the land from the city to operate the airport privately, despite their claims that it is such a gem with so much potential (claims which you enjoy echoing).

This has come up before and Edmonton has never entertained proposals to sell YXD. This isn't an issue of the operation imposing a terrible burden on the city that might be alleviated in private hands. The city wants to turn it over to developers.

I'll give you this much, P.W., at least you're not hiding behind medivac arguments and bogus claims of land contamination. You deserve a bit of credit for that.

I am skeptical that the airport is anywhere near as tidy as it is being suggested, but that doesn't really come into it for me. As far as medivac goes I believe YXD is a more economical and practical location from which to operate such flights. However given wasting massive sums of money isn't seen to be a problem I am confident STARS will be delighted to fly patients between Leduc and various Edmonton area hospitals as needed - they do after all have a new helicopter to pay for.

[vid]

Originally Posted by Policy Wonk

Yes, but they are also a municipal government and a significant proportion of the population has indicated their disapproval of the decision.

And an even more significant portion has indicated their approval of the decision. If this was put to a vote, it would probably end up in favour of closing the airport. In my experience, referendums based on NIMBY concerns always end up voting against the NIMBYs and for whatever they oppose.

[Policy Wonk]

I would say the NIMBY's are the ones looking to close the airport, but in any event.

NIMBY's vote, but geezers vote more.

Who is going to show up more on election day?

Single issue anti-airport voters?

or geezers who remember the Muni as part of day to day life and thought building an airport in Leduc was stupid at the time?

[feepa]

^ want to wager?

[vid]

Geezers tend to be NIMBYs, so I am going to borrow your logic and say tens of thousands of elderly Edmontonians want to close the airport and will make that position known when they overwhelmingly vote to close it on referendum day.