Federal Government & Politics II

[MolsonExport]

Imagine if other groups had access to a thousand transport trucks to occupy Ottawa for advancing or protesting at any cause that they deemed worthy. Homophobia? Let's occupy downtown Ottawa for weeks and weeks. Racism? Same. Don't like the look of Kevin O'Leary's bald head? Let's strangle the city out of spite.

I'll just bet you a shiny new dime that the so called libertarian freedom fighters would be baying for arrests.

[Build.It]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

No property damage? Your hindsight is poor at best. Not hurting anyone? Just driving them crazy with noise and fumes.

The government will appeal this, we'll see what the final ruling is. This is nowhere near the gotcha you think it is.

If you consider dressing Terry Fox in a t-shirt and a scarf to be property damage, then I guess you could say there was property damage.

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

Imagine if other groups had access to a thousand transport trucks to occupy Ottawa for advancing or protesting at any cause that they deemed worthy. Homophobia? Let's occupy downtown Ottawa for weeks and weeks. Racism? Same. Don't like the look of Kevin O'Leary's bald head? Let's strangle the city out of spite.

I'll just bet you a shiny new dime that the so called libertarian freedom fighters would be baying for arrests.

Should save some of these posts for the inevitable hypocrisy during the next government's term.

Whether one agrees with the cause or not, certain tactics should be off limits.

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by Build.It

If you consider dressing Terry Fox in a t-shirt and a scarf to be property damage, then I guess you could say there was property damage.

Apparently, graffiti, pissing and shitting everywhere, breaking windows, etc is not property damage in your books.

[someone123]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

Imagine if other groups had access to a thousand transport trucks to occupy Ottawa for advancing or protesting at any cause that they deemed worthy. Homophobia? Let's occupy downtown Ottawa for weeks and weeks. Racism? Same. Don't like the look of Kevin O'Leary's bald head? Let's strangle the city out of spite.

For me the trucker protest was such a low point. The policies were bad, the protests were bad, and the response to the protests was bad. The country had largely lost the plot, with many people taking one side in a deeply screwed up situation.

As other said at that point covid was endemic in Canada, the truckers had previously had an exemption, and we already had very high compliance with vaccination.

The protesters had a right to protest and express their views but not to cause public disorder.

The government should have affirmed the right to protest while upholding public order. The Ottawa police dropped the ball and then higher levels of government didn't respond well. I think it is emblematic of messed up values, with an underlying idea that the police should only do stuff if they feel safe and that there is always some preferable nonphysical alternative like shutting down bank accounts. Police who are unwilling to assume risk are not police and upholding liberties should carry some weight against avoiding violence.

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

No property damage? Your hindsight is poor at best. Not hurting anyone? Just driving them crazy with noise and fumes.

The government will appeal this, we'll see what the final ruling is. This is nowhere near the gotcha you think it is.

Claims to be a libertarian. Then argues it's okay for randos to deprive citizens of enjoyment of their homes for weeks on end.

This whole incident was a good test to see whose principles are real and whose are flexible.

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by someone123

The protesters had a right to protest and express their views but not to cause public disorder.

And this is the point. Ottawa has seen all kinds of protests before. Most residents recognize that this is part and parcel of living in the nation's capital. Never before though, have people had to leave home because air downtown was unbreathable and the noise wouldn't let them sleep. They weren't here to protest. They were here to simply take ake out their frustrations on the residents of the city.

[O-tacular]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

Imagine if other groups had access to a thousand transport trucks to occupy Ottawa for advancing or protesting at any cause that they deemed worthy. Homophobia? Let's occupy downtown Ottawa for weeks and weeks. Racism? Same. Don't like the look of Kevin O'Leary's bald head? Let's strangle the city out of spite.

I'll just bet you a shiny new dime that the so called libertarian freedom fighters would be baying for arrests.

Not only baying for arrests, but fantasizing about police brutality and murder. Just look at the response to pipeline protesters. Force is acceptable to be deployed against "Wokists" like BLM. But when right wing bullies use violence or intimidation to further their pet causes and there are consequences they drop like a soccer player diving for a penalty and play the victim card. I'm so tired of this BS. When it comes down to it they're just pussies like any other bully. Whiny tantrum throwing toddlers who believe they can hold the rest of society hostage. All the culture war stuff is merely projection.

[casper]

Originally Posted by Truenorth00

And this is the point. Ottawa has seen all kinds of protests before. Most residents recognize that this is part and parcel of living in the nation's capital. Never before though, have people had to leave home because air downtown was unbreathable and the noise wouldn't let them sleep. They weren't here to protest. They were here to simply take ake out their frustrations on the residents of the city.

A protest is about getting your message out and making others aware of your cause.

This convoy protests was an attempt to blackmail. This group did not like the decision make by the democratically electric government so they were going to "force" the government to not only listen to them but to adopt their policy or they were not leaving. They were going to hold the citizens of downtown Ottawa hostage and people at the border. Period.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by Build.It

If you consider dressing Terry Fox in a t-shirt and a scarf to be property damage, then I guess you could say there was property damage.

Is that why they closed the Rideau Centre? Because the convoy people were too nice?

[Hackslack]

Originally Posted by O-tacular

Not only baying for arrests, but fantasizing about police brutality and murder. Just look at the response to pipeline protesters. Force is acceptable to be deployed against "Wokists" like BLM. But when right wing bullies use violence or intimidation to further their pet causes and there are consequences they drop like a soccer player diving for a penalty and play the victim card. I'm so tired of this BS. When it comes down to it they're just pussies like any other bully. Whiny tantrum throwing toddlers who believe they can hold the rest of society hostage. All the culture war stuff is merely projection.

You mean these pipeline protests?

RCMP investigate alleged attack on Coastal GasLink pipeline worksite in B.C.

https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.6356257

RCMP are investigating a "violent confrontation" at a pipeline construction site involving an unidentified group of about 20 people.

Police said they were called to Marten Forest Service Road about 60 kilometres south of Houston, B.C., shortly after midnight on Feb. 17. They said CGL security reported violence at the site, where workers are helping build part of a 670-kilometre natural gas pipeline.

RCMP said around 20 people allegedly attacked security guards and employees.

"So these individuals, the 20 or so masked individuals, took these employees by surprise in a very aggressive and calculated method," Chief Supt. Warren Brown told CBC Friday morning.

"They confronted the employees, threatened them with axes and flares and other incendiary-type devices."

[Loco101]

Originally Posted by Build.It

Illegal is illegal brother. You can't just pick and choose when to follow the charter out of personal convenience.

The protesters were annoying, but they weren't hurting anyone, nor did they cause any property damage.

Some of them sure did hurt local residents and cause property damage to private homes, some businesses and public facilities.

My friend's daughter and her friend were sexually harassed by drunk protesters while they were working at a fast food restaurant. A number of residents were yelled at by protesters for no good reason. And we're not even getting into the noise, fumes, blocking access and so much more.

[Loco101]

Originally Posted by theman23

There was a lot of blind faith during the pandemic about our policies being rooted in science and professional expertise, but much of it was ideological. We likely clamped down too late and then for too long. I argued for months (years?) that our border restrictions were mostly theatre since the virus was long endemic here.



https://www.newswire.ca/news-release...813481354.html

By 2022 I agree that the measures weren't really going to help once the Omicron variant was rampant. But before that you just have to look at the number of Covid cases per capita on each side of the border. It was incredibly higher everywhere in the U.S. compared to Canada. I think that the border issue was also more supported in Canada when Trump was president as he made such ridiculous statements about Covid.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by Hackslack

You mean these pipeline protests?

RCMP investigate alleged attack on Coastal GasLink pipeline worksite in B.C.

There's a few sides to this story, plenty of RCMP abuse of peoples' rights. I don't see you defending them. Quite the opposite in fact.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/indigenous/r...link-1.7086861

https://www.cbc.ca/news/indigenous/r...ence-1.6710639

https://www.terracestandard.com/news...estors-6072555

https://bc.ctvnews.ca/rcmp-arrest-5-...camp-1.6334960

https://www.aptnnews.ca/national-new...ten-territory/

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/briti...suit-1.6498022

https://www.aptnnews.ca/national-new...n-territories/

[Loco101]

The vast majority of Canadians didn't support the convoy protesters. They actually ended up losing even more public support for whatever it was they were trying to stand for. To me if consisted of a lot of uneducated individuals who were almost entire white and mostly male. The phony patriotism reminded me of Trump supporters. There were no good spokespeople and the messages were bizarre. All I could think of was that I don't people like that running our country. I wonder how some people will feel when they are reminded that PP supported them.

[Truenorth00]

Enviro-nuts go both ways.

Swedish manufacturer Northvolt says the site of its future electric vehicle battery plant near Montreal was sabotaged after nails were driven into trees that are set to be cut down.

Northvolt spokesperson Emmanuelle Rouillard-Moreau says nails or metal bars were inserted into about 100 trees Monday night at its 170-hectare site, which straddles the communities of McMasterville and Saint-Basile-le-Grand, on the South Shore.

The company said in an email that such tactics can carry "significant risks for the safety of workers and surrounding communities."

An anonymous group claimed responsibility on an anarchist website, saying the motive for its "sabotage" was to protest a megaproject it says will destroy woods and wetlands and perpetuate car culture.

Writing on website Montreal Counter-Information, the group said putting the "steel bars and nails" in the tree trunks was an attempt to damage heavy machinery and make the forest tougher and costlier to log.
...

https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.7092789

[Hackslack]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

There's a few sides to this story, plenty of RCMP abuse of peoples' rights. I don't see you defending them. Quite the opposite in fact.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/indigenous/r...link-1.7086861

https://www.cbc.ca/news/indigenous/r...ence-1.6710639

https://www.terracestandard.com/news...estors-6072555

https://bc.ctvnews.ca/rcmp-arrest-5-...camp-1.6334960

https://www.aptnnews.ca/national-new...ten-territory/

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/briti...suit-1.6498022

https://www.aptnnews.ca/national-new...n-territories/

Huh, quite the opposite? I just posted a story and pictures about how a bunch of protestors caused tens of millions in damage and threatened the lives of workers and security with axes and flares…. F’n people… seems like you’re defending their violent protests.

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by Hackslack

Huh, quite the opposite? I just posted a story and pictures about how a bunch of protestors caused tens of millions in damage and threatened the lives of workers and security with axes and flares…. F’n people… seems like you’re defending their violent protests.

Weren't they charged? If not, they should have been.

[casper]

Originally Posted by Hackslack

Huh, quite the opposite? I just posted a story and pictures about how a bunch of protestors caused tens of millions in damage and threatened the lives of workers and security with axes and flares…. F’n people… seems like you’re defending their violent protests.

Protestors who should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law when they put the safety of others at risk.

You need to separate the actions of the protestors from the cause. Blocking border crossings, blocking all traffic in downtown core of cities, threating the safety of others, damaging construction equipment are all things that should not be tolerated.

If you want to compare and contrast....

Elizabeth May, leader of the Green Party was charged for standing with protestors blocking a construction site for an hour.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/briti...wart-1.4587631

Were any of the conservative party members who visited, supported and encouraged the Convoy protesters charged?

Perhaps the Ontario Crown is less strict than the British Columbia one?

[Hecate]

It’s literally irrelevant if the people were acting like fools during the trucker protests, the issue here is the government violated Canadians charter rights. Doesn’t matter what side of the fence you’re on, this should bother you. There were other legal measures that should and could have been taken. Just because you’re in a pickle, doesn’t mean you get to violate people and their charter rights. The charter is there for a reason, to protect us from things like what this government did. It was borderline fascism.