The Canadian Electric Vehicle thread

[whatnext]

The genius that is Musk strikes again:

Elon Musk's Cybertruck is already a production nightmare for Tesla
Musk says Tesla is digging its own grave with the Cybertruck, full of 'a lot of bells and whistles'
Author of the article: Bloomberg News
Bloomberg News
Dana Hull
Published Nov 28, 2023

The Cybertruck hasn’t even hit the market yet, and Elon Musk already is lamenting that Tesla Inc. has dug its own grave.

Its stainless steel body may be able to withstand bullets and arrows, but it’s going to be a bear putting the panels together. It will be Tesla’s first high-voltage vehicle, offering the benefit of faster charging, but also potential pitfalls. And it will be Tesla’s only product dependent on in-house battery cells that are years behind schedule...

....In late August — three months before Tesla’s scheduled start of deliveries — Musk wrote an email to Tesla employees that leaked to an online forum. “Due to the nature of Cybertruck, which is made of bright metal with mostly straight edges, any dimensional variation shows up like a sore thumb,” the CEO noted. He ordered all parts for the vehicle to be designed and built to sub-10 micron accuracy, or 10 millionths of a metre.

The problems that are very evident with the Cybertruck are problems with the concept itself

When Franz von Holzhausen, Tesla’s chief designer, showed up to a car enthusiasts’ event in Southern California early this month with a Cybertruck prototype, photos quickly surfaced showing misaligned fender flares and panel gaps wide enough to stick a finger through....

https://financialpost.com/commoditie...ightmare-tesla

[Wigs]

Originally Posted by whatnext

I prefer not to enrich an antisemitic douchebag with an EV purchase.

whatnext, did you not see where Netanyahu helped him wash the gross antisemitism away?

https://x.com/MairavZ/status/1729088304421683504?s=20

[travis3000]

Originally Posted by whatnext

The genius that is Musk strikes again:

Elon Musk's Cybertruck is already a production nightmare for Tesla
Musk says Tesla is digging its own grave with the Cybertruck, full of 'a lot of bells and whistles'
Author of the article: Bloomberg News
Bloomberg News
Dana Hull
Published Nov 28, 2023

The Cybertruck hasn’t even hit the market yet, and Elon Musk already is lamenting that Tesla Inc. has dug its own grave.

Its stainless steel body may be able to withstand bullets and arrows, but it’s going to be a bear putting the panels together. It will be Tesla’s first high-voltage vehicle, offering the benefit of faster charging, but also potential pitfalls. And it will be Tesla’s only product dependent on in-house battery cells that are years behind schedule...

....In late August — three months before Tesla’s scheduled start of deliveries — Musk wrote an email to Tesla employees that leaked to an online forum. “Due to the nature of Cybertruck, which is made of bright metal with mostly straight edges, any dimensional variation shows up like a sore thumb,” the CEO noted. He ordered all parts for the vehicle to be designed and built to sub-10 micron accuracy, or 10 millionths of a metre.

The problems that are very evident with the Cybertruck are problems with the concept itself

When Franz von Holzhausen, Tesla’s chief designer, showed up to a car enthusiasts’ event in Southern California early this month with a Cybertruck prototype, photos quickly surfaced showing misaligned fender flares and panel gaps wide enough to stick a finger through....

https://financialpost.com/commoditie...ightmare-tesla

Everybody always underestimates Tesla. Every new product they've launched has been a fast pass to the grave. All nonsense.

[Wigs]

I dislike Musk, but Tesla has been successful. Everyone doubted them and they are the EV benchmark.

[ssiguy]

Seems like Mr. Battery himself, who once referred to hydrogen as "fool cells" has had a change of heart. Now he is exclaiming the virtues of hydrogen and plans to introduce Tesla's first hydrogen car aptly named the Model H in 2024 and potentially another larger SUV type hydrogen vehicle in 2026 for the 2027 model year.

[Changing City]

Originally Posted by ssiguy

Seems like Mr. Battery himself, who once referred to hydrogen as "fool cells" has had a change of heart. Now he is exclaiming the virtues of hydrogen and plans to introduce Tesla's first hydrogen car aptly named the Model H in 2024 and potentially another larger SUV type hydrogen vehicle in 2026 for the 2027 model year.

Thanks for that. You should open a new thread about the future Telsa Model H, rather than posting on the Canadian Electric Vehicle thread. In the meantime you've confirmed your grasp on reality.

Musk has recently reiterated his Financial Times conference 2022 view: “It’s important to understand that if you want a means of energy storage, hydrogen is a bad choice”. As recently as August he said “Bizarrely, government funding is still being directed to hydrogen trucks,” Musk said. “It is idiotic.”

In March this year he mentioned he's looking at using green hydrogen to make steel, and said then, “My personal opinion is that hydrogen will not be used meaningfully in transport. It shouldn't be.”

[SFUVancouver]

Originally Posted by ssiguy

Seems like Mr. Battery himself, who once referred to hydrogen as "fool cells" has had a change of heart. Now he is exclaiming the virtues of hydrogen and plans to introduce Tesla's first hydrogen car aptly named the Model H in 2024 and potentially another larger SUV type hydrogen vehicle in 2026 for the 2027 model year.

You are going to have to cite a source for that.

[homebucket]

Looks like Tesla is still king here when it comes to EVs.

EVs Are Far More Reliable Than PHEVs, But Still More Problematic Than ICE Cars
CR’s 2023 Annual Auto Reliability Survey found that EVs have 79% more reliability problems on average than combustion cars.

Nov 29, 2023 at 10:00am ET
By: Iulian Dnistran

...

According to the survey, EVs have 79% more reliability problems on average than combustion cars, with the biggest issues relating to the charging experience and the high-voltage battery.

...

Plug-in hybrids (PHEVs) fared even worse in the survey with an average of 146% more problems, while hybrids were on the other end of the spectrum with 26% fewer problems than ICE cars on average.

With this being said, Tesla–the biggest player in the American EV market–was a bright spot in the survey with comparatively fewer issues in the charging and battery categories. Additionally, the Model 3 and Model Y are good enough to be recommended by Consumer Reports, while the more expensive Model S and Model X have been tagged as having below-average reliability.

The Austin-based EV manufacturer continues to have issues with body hardware, paint, trim, and the climate system on its models, but the motor, charging, and battery categories are not as problematic as with other carmakers, according to Consumer Reports.

Overall, Tesla is the second-highest-ranked domestic car manufacturer in CR’s brand rankings. Sitting in 14th place, the Elon Musk-led American company is surpassed only by Buick which sits in 12th place overall.

On the other hand, some EV models from other automakers had fewer reported problems related to build quality but higher rates of powertrain, battery, and charging issues, although CR doesn’t mention what those models are.

...

Rivian is in 28th place on CR’s list, with both the R1T pickup and R1S SUV scoring below average when it comes to reliability. Owners complained about issues with the drive system, climate control system, body hardware, and EV charging.

Likewise, the Ford F-150 Lightning is below average, while the F-150 Hybrid is described by CR as being among the least reliable models overall. Both F-150 Lightning and F-150 Hybrid owners noted issues with their batteries, while Hybrid owners added transmission, drive system, and exhaust problems to the list. On the list of most reliable brands, Ford sits in 22nd place.

https://insideevs.com/news/698277/ev...sumer-reports/

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by SFUVancouver

You are going to have to cite a source for that.

Yep. I wanna see this too.

As recently as August, Musk was criticizing US Government funding and tax credits for hydrogen vehicles.

https://hydrogen-central.com/teslas-...truck-triumph/

[homebucket]

Is ssguy's calendar perpetually stuck on April 1? This guy's takes on this thread are always so preposterous you'd think it was a parody account or something.

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by homebucket

Is ssguy's calendar perpetually stuck on April 1? This guy's takes on this thread are always so preposterous you'd think it was a parody account or something.

He actually believes every automaker is going to suddenly ditch BEVs and go to FCEVs. This bias leads him to conflate comments on industrial hydrogen applications with transport applications.

[SpongeG]

Hyundai, Kia's Uni Wheel electric drive system could revolutionize EV design
Reduced size, greater efficiency, improved ride comfort and more

JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI
Nov 29th 2023



The massive worldwide focus on electric vehicle technology has already introduced noteworthy changes to automobile design, notably due to the flat floor design with one large battery pack popularized by Tesla and thereafter adopted by nearly every other major automaker. The reduction in size of drive components has made the term "frunk" part of our regular vernacular, as well. And now Hyundai and Kia have introduced the world to what they say is the next major paradigm shift in EV architecture: the Universal Wheel Drive System, or Uni Wheel for short.

Basically, the Korean automaker conglomerate has figured out a way to replace the standard constant velocity (CV) joint with an arrangement of gears that reside directly inside the wheel hub. We could do our best to explain the arrangement — the short version: a single sun gear transfers power through a pair of packaged pinion gear arms that can move independently to an outer ring gear in a unique and flexible planetary design — but it makes the most sense after looking at the pictures and especially the animated video that we've embedded just below.

...

https://www.autoblog.com/2023/11/29/...ehicle-design/

[whatnext]

Toyota Prius (including the PHEV Prime) is Motor Trend's car of the year:

https://www.motortrend.com/news/toyo...r-of-the-year/

[homebucket]

Anyone watching the Cybertruck livestream?

[SFUVancouver]

Originally Posted by homebucket

Anyone watching the Cybertruck livestream?

"It's not just some grandstanding showpiece, like me. It's actually very useful."

That line cracked me up.

[homebucket]

Finally pricing has been released. Looks like they're going after both Ford F-150 Lighting base buyers and Silverado EV/Rivian R1T buyers.

And some specs:

RWD $60,990
- 250 mi range
- 0-60 mph in 6.5s

AWD $79,990
- 340 mi range
- 0-60 in 4.1s
- 11,000 lbs towing capacity

Cyberbeast $99,990
- 320 mi range
- 0-60 in 2.6s
- 11,000 lbs towing capacity

Finally and officially, the Cybertruck will start at $60,990. That's for the base rear-wheel-drive version, which Tesla says is due out in 2025. The all-wheel-drive version is due out next year, Tesla claims, and that will start at $79,990. Finally, the top-trim "Cyberbeast" model, also due out in 2024, will begin at $99,990.

...

For comparison's sake, that puts the Cybertruck against the Chevrolet Silverado EV, which starts at $74,800 for the base 3WT model and goes up to the top-trim RST First Edition at $106,895; the Ford F-150 Lightning, which starts at $49,995 for the base Pro and tops off at $91,995 for the Platinum model; and the Rivian R1T, starting at $73,000 and going all the way up to about $94,000 if you opt for its top Max Pack battery.

https://insideevs.com/news/698701/te...fficial-price/

[homebucket]

Originally Posted by SFUVancouver

"It's not just some grandstanding showpiece, like me. It's actually very useful."

That line cracked me up.

It's also got bulletproof panels.

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by homebucket

It's also got bulletproof panels.

Exactly what your average pickup driver needs.

[WarrenC12]

Sky high pricing, I guess we'll see what demand truly is (and what they can produce).

Tesla is not shy about making dramatic price changes either. This should be interesting.

[homebucket]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Sky high pricing, I guess we'll see what demand truly is (and what they can produce).

Tesla is not shy about making dramatic price changes either. This should be interesting.

I'm not surprised at the price increase. There's no way they could sell it at $40k or whatever they initially announced it as. If you compare spec to spec, the middle trim AWD CT actually undercuts the Rivian R1T. I could easily see potential R1T buyers jumping ship over to the CT.

The other intriguing trim is the base model. It's similarly specced to the base F-150 Lighting but costs $11k more, so I wonder if the allure is something different will be enough to poach would be Lightning buyers despite a wide price gap. I don't see any other manufacturers making base spec RWD EV pickups, so Tesla is clearly going after the Lightning here.