O-Train Line 1/3 [ Stage 2 | East Extension | Blair to Trim] | U/C

[1overcosc]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

Stations that don't get built as part of the original construction usually never get built. They never rise to the top of the priority list.

When Toronto built the northern section of the Yonge subway in the 1970s (from Eglinton to Finch) they originally planned for 6 stations in between Eglinton and Finch; at Lawrence, Glencairn, York Mills, Glen Echo, Sheppard, and Empress. However, someone calculated that downsizing the plan to 3 stations and retaining a local bus paralleling it for access from intermediate points was cheaper. So Glencairn, Glen Echo, and Empress stations were removed from the plan, but they decided to rough them in for future construction. The Empress station was eventually opened 15 years later (named North York Centre station) but the other two have never happened.

[acottawa]

It seems to me part of the problem here is that the stations are too elaborate (and therefore too expensive). Surely they could find some money for some bare-bones stations.

[McC]

Ottawa does have a track record of adding infill stations: Bayview and Dominion on the Transitway, and Gladstone and Walkley soon to come on the O-Train.

The Canada Line in Vancouver has two planned-for future stations, and given the land rush and rapid development going on along the Cambie Corridor, I would expect those to become a reality at some point in the not so distant future. Unfortunately Jasmine Cres lacks that same pressure from developers/speculators.

[roger1818]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Is there any way that ramp could be repurposed into a new onramp for regular traffic going eastbound on the 174 from Blair?

An interesting idea. It would mean crossing both the LRT line and the 174 off ramp, so I don't know if it would be worth the cost.

[lrt's friend]

When will Phase 2 construction begin? How soon after Phase 1 opens?

[1overcosc]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

When will Phase 2 construction begin? How soon after Phase 1 opens?

It's in tendering right now. I presume whoever wins the contract will decide when construction starts.

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by 1overcosc

They did confirm that the alignment revisions still protect for a Gloucester High School station in the future. Gloucester High School, Orleans Town Centre, and Tenth Line are the 3 stations that are being protected for in the future, but not being built as part of the initial line.

That is ridiculous! Three suburban stations within 1.5 kilometers. That is closer spacing than downtown. IMO, they should drop Orleans Boulevard in favour of Jasmine Crescent and Tenth Line. Orleans Town Centre would be well served equal distance between Place d'Orleans and Tenth Line (just as the new arena will be well served between high volume Bayview and Pimisi).

Originally Posted by acottawa

It seems to me part of the problem here is that the stations are too elaborate (and therefore too expensive). Surely they could find some money for some bare-bones stations.

I'm hoping that Jeanne d'Arc, Orleans Boulevard and Montreal will be bear bones while Place d'Orleans and Trim could be more in line with phase 1 since they will be high volume transfer stations. Same in the west, where money could be saved on Iris and Queensview.

Originally Posted by McC

Ottawa does have a track record of adding infill stations: Bayview and Dominion on the Transitway, and Gladstone and Walkley soon to come on the O-Train.

The Canada Line in Vancouver has two planned-for future stations, and given the land rush and rapid development going on along the Cambie Corridor, I would expect those to become a reality at some point in the not so distant future. Unfortunately Jasmine Cres lacks that same pressure from developers/speculators.

Canada Line is nearing capacity as is and they didn't leave much room for expansion (40 meters to 50 meters ), so I doubt they will add any stations.

[J.OT13]

What's even more ridiculous is that some freakin' field west of Moodie where minor events are held once in a while will probably get a "special events" station.

[lrt's friend]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

What's even more ridiculous is that some freakin' field west of Moodie where minor events are held once in a while will probably get a "special events" station.

for 25 passengers a year and every train will have to stop there.

[1overcosc]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

for 25 passengers a year and every train will have to stop there.

Last time I heard, the idea for that station was to have it closed except when events are running. Either way, a really silly idea.

[PHrenetic]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Is there any way that ramp could be repurposed into a new onramp for regular traffic going eastbound on the 174 from Blair?

Good Day....

Highly doubtful.... virtually all of the BRT transitway west of the BRT flyover, into Blair station, will be reused for the LRT guideway. The flyover would be an orphan 'bridge to nowhere'.

[PHrenetic]

Originally Posted by Multi-modal

... Where are they going to build Gloucester High School Station?..... or in the median adjacent to Jasmine Crescent.

.......

As far as I read the plans (acknowledged as ever-changing, ever-flexible), the station protection is for 'Jasmine Station' east of the LRT transition into the median, east of the High School. The flyover is opposite the oval, and the 'station' is beside Sutton Pl. parking/road, between the two triangle towers. And yes, correct, that does mean a ped overpass to get to it. <yippee><snort> I agree - we'll never see it !

[roger1818]

Originally Posted by 1overcosc

Last time I heard, the idea for that station was to have it closed except when events are running. Either way, a really silly idea.

The two best options in my mind are to protect for a station (with side platforms to not increase cost) and never built it or better yet drop the ridiculous idea all together.

I guess a third acceptable option would be to have Wesley Clover fully pay for the station and close it except during events, though the first two options are better.

[eltodesukane]

Too bad there's no station near Jasmine Crescent.
And the Montreal station is at an inconvenient location.

[acottawa]

Why all the Wesley Clover haters?

It isn't my thing (I think I have been there once) but that sort of rural attraction is exactly the kind of thing many visitors to Ottawa would dig. What's wrong with making it available by transit when the transit line goes right through the park anyway?

[kmcamp]

Originally Posted by acottawa

Why all the Wesley Clover haters?

It isn't my thing (I think I have been there once) but that sort of rural attraction is exactly the kind of thing many visitors to Ottawa would dig. What's wrong with making it available by transit when the transit line goes right through the park anyway?

If it's a special events station, and is really just a bus shelter and a platform like the old O-Train stations I also say why not. I would imagine it would have no ticket gates, just staff and some presto readers for the occasions when it's in use.

[roger1818]

Originally Posted by PHrenetic

As far as I read the plans (acknowledged as ever-changing, ever-flexible), the station protection is for 'Jasmine Station' east of the LRT transition into the median, east of the High School. The flyover is opposite the oval, and the 'station' is beside Sutton Pl. parking/road, between the two triangle towers. And yes, correct, that does mean a ped overpass to get to it. <yippee><snort> I agree - we'll never see it !

Interesting. Your description of the location of the flyover matches what is shown in geoottawa.



The issues I see with this station location are:

• The median is very narrow here and I don't even think there would be room for a centre platform, which could potentially be narrower than two side platforms. As a result they will likely plan for two side platforms and not move the highway when they build the station (ya right).
• The highway starts to curve east of the flyover. It is highly desirable for stations to be on a straight section of track to allow a smaller gap between platform and train.

They could put it just west of the flyover with paths to Jasmine, Gloucester High School and the Wave Pool. Side platforms would likely be necessary as it looks like they are planning for a third centre track for trains to layover there.

[roger1818]

Originally Posted by acottawa

Why all the Wesley Clover haters?

I have nothing against Wesley Clover. I just don't want the city to pay lots of money for a fancy station that would see fewer riders in a year than Jasmine would see in a day.

Originally Posted by kmcamp

If it's a special events station, and is really just a bus shelter and a platform like the old O-Train stations I also say why not. I would imagine it would have no ticket gates, just staff and some presto readers for the occasions when it's in use.

Unless they only have a platform on one side of the tracks, they would also need to build an overpass (they won't want people cutting across the tracks). My fear is there will be feature creep and what starts as a modest station grows to become a full fledged, all singing and dancing station. Next thing you know, a few people who want to go there once or twice a week petition the city to have all trains stop at the station (using the argument that there isn't a bus).

IMHO, for the few events that are held there a year, a shuttle bus to Moodie and Eagleson would be a better option.

[acottawa]

Originally Posted by roger1818

I have nothing against Wesley Clover. I just don't want the city to pay lots of money for a fancy station that would see fewer riders in a year than Jasmine would see in a day.



Unless they only have a platform on one side of the tracks, they would also need to build an overpass (they won't want people cutting across the tracks). My fear is there will be feature creep and what starts as a modest station grows to become a full fledged, all singing and dancing station. Next thing you know, a few people who want to go there once or twice a week petition the city to have all trains stop at the station (using the argument that there isn't a bus).

IMHO, for the few events that are held there a year, a shuttle bus to Moodie and Eagleson would be a better option.

I agree that it should be a lower priority than Jasmine and I agree that there is no need to build a fancy station and there is a risk of mission creep. Although I would not see its primary benefit as a special events station but as a station to serve the park itself (the campground, sports fields, etc.) A huge number of the attractions in the Ottawa area are car-only (or primarily car-only).

[lrt's friend]

I find this conversation ironic. We are talking about building a station that will seldom be used while not building a station that will be used all the time. Shakes head in amazement.