Highways in Canada

[eternallyme]

Part of it has to do with deplorable maintenance by Quebec governments in the 1970s and 1980s which made the structures much more vulnerable today.

[Nicko999]

Originally Posted by eternallyme

Part of it has to do with deplorable maintenance by Quebec governments in the 1970s, 1980's and 1990s which made the structures much more vulnerable today.

Fixed that for you.

The last decade have been better with record investment on roads/infrastructure but there is just too much work to be done.

[Acajack]

They were working it on when it collapsed and structures being worked on are often less stable and more dangerous. The one that collapsed a few years ago (Boul. du Souvenir) was also under construction, as was the bridge in Minnesota a few years ago. However, the Boul. de la Concorde was not being worked out if I recall.

It's still very troublesome and worrisome.

[MolsonExport]

More falling concrete in Montreal. Every year. Someplace. Overpass in Laval. The Big Owe. Another Laval overpass. Turcot interchange. Best Western Hotel. Now Ville Marie Tunnel.

Brutal winters + Mafia construction + lack of maintenance = Concrete blocks falling down

[eternallyme]

Originally Posted by Nicko999

Fixed that for you.

The last decade have been better with record investment on roads/infrastructure but there is just too much work to be done.

Agreed, the last 10-15 years (since the late 1990s) have been much better, but for many years especially under Levesque and Bourassa (both parties to blame), they did practically nothing. That means they can only play catch-up now.

[ToxiK]

Originally Posted by eternallyme

Agreed, the last 10-15 years (since the late 1990s) have been much better, but for many years especially under Levesque and Bourassa (both parties to blame), they did practically nothing. That means they can only play catch-up now.

Don't blame the parties, blame the people who vote for them. We are in a democracy and therefore we get the governments we deserve.

[mbeaumont]

Why campaign on infrastructure promises, when you can get more votes promising social programs and funding to cultural events? Thats the reality here, don't blame the parties, blame the people who voted for them

[eternallyme]

Originally Posted by mbeaumont

Why campaign on infrastructure promises, when you can get more votes promising social programs and funding to cultural events? Thats the reality here, don't blame the parties, blame the people who voted for them

That is especially true in Montreal, which values social programs and culture more than anywhere else in North America, yet throughout Quebec it is like that. Such explains partially why the NDP did so well in Quebec despite the Conservatives dominating in most of the rest of Canada.

[haljackey]

Looks like they're moving forward with the Windsor-Essex Parkway pretty aggressively.

Residential demolition:


Demolition of an outlet mall:


Reconstructed Highway 401 near Dougall PKWY:

Two ways to USA by Bun T. Pein Photography, on Flickr

[Blitz]

^ Luckily only a small portion of that outlet mall is being demolished.

[vid]

Hodder Avenue Interchange, Highway 11/17, Thunder Bay

Roadwork impact
Jodi Lundmark | tbnewswatch.com | July 29, 2011
http://www.tbnewswatch.com/news/Default.aspx?cid=157160

More than $600 million for highway improvements in Northern Ontario could mean up to 4,000 jobs over the next two years.

...

About 50 kilometres of highway between Thunder Bay and Nipigon is to be four-laned. Some of that work has already begun and the rest will start next year.

MPP Michael Gravelle (Lib., Thunder Bay-Superior North) said that by 2014, there will be a continuous stretch of four-lane highway all the way to Pass Lake, including a stretch of road from Nipigon to Red Rock.

One of the larger projects in the program is a new Nipigon River bridge, which will be a four-laned cable-stayed bridge with a pedestrian underpass.

Construction will begin next year and will take two years to complete.

...

http://www.tbnewswatch.com/news/Default.aspx?cid=157160

Proposed Nipigon River Bridge for Highway 11/17, Nipigon — this will be the first cable stayed bridge for Ontario's highway system.

Gravelle and Mauro Announce More Highways
Netnewsledger.com | July 29, 2011
http://netnewsledger.com/2011/07/29/gravelle-and-mauro-announce-more-highways/

...

The Northern Highways Program will include new passing lanes, signage and lighting improvements, as well as rehabilitation projects for roads, highways and bridges. Some key projects will continue the expansion of:

Highway 11-17 east of Thunder Bay
Highway 11 south of North Bay
Highway 69 south of Sudbury.

...

http://netnewsledger.com/2011/07/29/gravelle-and-mauro-announce-more-highways/

[eternallyme]

Originally Posted by vid

Hodder Avenue Interchange, Highway 11/17, Thunder Bay




Proposed Nipigon River Bridge for Highway 11/17, Nipigon — this will be the first cable stayed bridge for Ontario's highway system.

50 km down, about 65 km to go for that section. They should have also built an interchange at the 11/17 junction east of Nipigon just before the transition back. In Nipigon itself, what's going to happen - twinning/widening existing route or new bypass?

Shabaqua Corners to Nipigon (where 11 and 17 run together) definitely should be the highest priority in northwestern Ontario for upgrading.

[vid]

Shabaqua Corners to Thunder Bay is being studied, but probably won't progress for some time. There are alternate routes for that roadway so there is less of a need to twin it, as opposed to 11/17 east of the city which is the only possible roadway.

In Nipigon, they will probably twin the highway like they have at Hodder Avenue—build a new two lane road to carry westbound traffic, and turn the existing highway into eastbound lanes.

[Wharn]

So does this mean that they are planning to upgrade the Thunder Bay Expressway to a true freeway? If so congrats, you got your ring road before we did.

[vid]

There are no official plans or timelines for the Thunder Bay Expressway through the city. The city of Thunder Bay has put its Northwest Arterial plan back on the drawing board and that includes an interchange at the new intersection with the Expressway right from the start, so about 2018 will probably be the earliest we see an interchange in the city.



Since the NW Arterial was put back into capital forecasts, suburban development has picked up its pace in the NW part of the city. A new subdivision is about to be approved just north of where the new road connects to the post-2020 4-lane road. The 4-lane expansion for 2013 running parallel to the Expressway will include local servicing (currently that road has no services at all), and that corridor will become a new high density node.

[habfanman]

Originally Posted by mbeaumont

Why campaign on infrastructure promises, when you can get more votes promising social programs and funding to cultural events? Thats the reality here, don't blame the parties, blame the people who voted for them

But it needn't be an either/or. Unfortunately, we weren't presented with an infastructure party and the sad fact is that the people who scream and yell when something like this occurs are the same people who bitch incessantly when their commute is disturbed by.. wait for it.. infrastructure improvement.
It's a no-win situation. Close the road in order to fix it.. bitch, bitch, bitch. Big infrastructure fail.. bitch, bitch, bitch.

Fuck 'em I say. If they chose to make themselves dependant upon their cars- and that is a personal choice- then live with the consequences of that decision. And be prepared to pay because a lot of us who don't need cars are more than a little tired of paying for those who (make the choice) to do so.

[habfanman]

As far as I'm concerned, this infrastructure fail is the best possible thing that could have happened. No one was hurt and it underlines the fact that that we face a huge infrastucture deficit, not only in Québec, but all of Canada.

Most of our infrastructure was built in the 50's to 70's and 80% is reaching the end of its lifespan now. What are we doing about it? Fuck all, throwing chump change at an increasingly growing infrastructure deficit.

Unfortunately, people will die because of failing bridges, water supply, highways, buildings, sidewalks.. the list goes on.

But hey, so long as we continue to confuse 'skyline enhancements' and 'urban canyons' with actual city building, the deterioration of our public infrastructure will continue and we'll fall farther and farther behind countries who actually take this shit seriously.

You don't have to travel much to realize that we're turning into a First World nation with Third World infrastructure.

[go_leafs_go02]

I was shocked growing up in Ontario and crossing the border into Quebec how horrible their highways are, especially in and around Montreal. Deplorable conditions all over, and the driving conditions certainly took time to get used to as well.

[Wharn]

Originally Posted by habfanman

Fuck 'em I say. If they chose to make themselves dependant upon their cars- and that is a personal choice- then live with the consequences of that decision. And be prepared to pay because a lot of us who don't need cars are more than a little tired of paying for those who (make the choice) to do so.

I think that assessment is a little unfair. The STM and the TTC have farebox recovery ratios in the range of 55-65%, and even after advertising (which does not actually bring in much) they both incur significant losses- the TTC needed a $440 million subsidy in 2010, and for the STM in 2009 about $102 million came from direct government subsidies, on top of $332 million from the "municipal contribution" (ie property taxes). These stats are just from the country's two largest cities- I'm sure in places like London (where many transit users are students riding on a $180 unlimited 12-month pass) are far more heavily subsidized.

I think it's clear that the real situation is that motorists end up indirectly subsidizing transit users through property and gasoline taxes. Though this is not inherently undesirable, it certainly does not give transit users the right to bitch about "paying" for other people's choices.

[habfanman]

Originally Posted by Wharn

I think that assessment is a little unfair. The STM and the TTC have farebox recovery ratios in the range of 55-65%, and even after advertising (which does not actually bring in much) they both incur significant losses- the TTC needed a $440 million subsidy in 2010, and for the STM in 2009 about $102 million came from direct government subsidies, on top of $332 million from the "municipal contribution" (ie property taxes). These stats are just from the country's two largest cities- I'm sure in places like London (where many transit users are students riding on a $180 unlimited 12-month pass) are far more heavily subsidized.

I think it's clear that the real situation is that motorists end up indirectly subsidizing transit users through property and gasoline taxes. Though this is not inherently undesirable, it certainly does not give transit users the right to bitch about "paying" for other people's choices.

And what if car owners were to have to pay the true cost of their subsidies? The few cents of chump change that are tossed at public transit are nothing compared to the 100's of billions that we pay to keep drivers on the road. The few cents of gas tax that are diverted to public transit only increase the amount that drivers are being subsidized. That it comes as a gas tax makes it look as if drivers are paying for transit when in fact we're only paying more to subsidize drivers. How ridiculous.

What if all TTC and GO users, STM and AMT users suddenly flooded the roads? How many mega billions of dollars would we have to pay to expand highways, parking facilities.. deal with the resulting environmental and public health issues?

You should spend some time in cities where roads and parking lots don't dominate the scenery. Cities where fast and efficient transit make car ownership an expensive luxury rather than a necessity. Cities that aren't stuck in a 1950's frame of mind. Cities that aren't London ON.