Sacramento: 301 Capitol Mall: A New Plan for The Towers Site

[enigma99a]

Will those rusty piles be fine if they resume construction?

[jbradway]

Might be a good lot to stage arena project construction materials and/or trailers temporarily.

Although I think the railyards lots along 7th street will be bigger staging area.

[ltsmotorsport]

Originally Posted by enigma99a

Will those rusty piles be fine if they resume construction?

The piles won't be rusty...they were/are concrete. Just need a little cleanup and wouldn't take much to use what's in the ground already.

[urban_encounter]

Originally Posted by SoCal Alan

Hope they build the first one, when the market conditions are correct, rather than just dump the plans. Hopefully, all that work with the pile driving would incentivize them to go that with that option.

well said..


Plus while a 50 story building my look nice (or not depending on who's building it) the most important aspect of any downtown development is what happens on the ground floor.

[Mr. Ozo]

Originally Posted by urban_encounter

well said..


Plus while a 50 story building my look nice (or not depending on who's building it) the most important aspect of any downtown development is what happens on the ground floor.

Yes. I'd like to see 3-5 story townhouse style buildings and smaller storefronts around the edge of the block with the towers back towards the middle of the block. It would create a more active street level.

[urban_encounter]

Originally Posted by Mr. Ozo

Yes. I'd like to see 3-5 story townhouse style buildings and smaller storefronts around the edge of the block with the towers back towards the middle of the block. It would create a more active street level.

That was a recommendation from urban design architects from a conference held here about 8 years ago. Their observation is that we should demand less storefront and retail space because we have had too much in new development. They suggested the same idea you posted above which I think adds that human scale.

[creamcityleo79]

Headed in the right direction...

Former Towers site -- known as that hole in the ground -- to get new look from CIM

http://m.bizjournals.com/sacramento/...4-03-27&r=full

[urban_encounter]

Originally Posted by creamcityleo79

Headed in the right direction...

Former Towers site -- known as that hole in the ground -- to get new look from CIM

http://m.bizjournals.com/sacramento/...4-03-27&r=full

This is exactly what many of us who have promoted the ESC felt that it could do. The great thing is that these proposals are breaking just as the local economy downtown is picking up more steam. We've seen a number of properties change hands because of the ESC and now things are warming up. Let's hope it all works out this time for a scaled quality project that can work.

[CAGeoNerd]

Originally Posted by urban_encounter

This is exactly what many of us who have promoted the ESC felt that it could do. The great thing is that these proposals are breaking just as the local economy downtown is picking up more steam. We've seen a number of properties change hands because of the ESC and now things are warming up. Let's hope it all works out this time for a scaled quality project that can work.

Yup. And this is only the beginning. Been arguing for years now about an arena downtown and the impact it would have. Every week it seems something pops up just confirming what we've been trying to argue this entire time. We need civic amenities located in strategically good places in order to attract business, investment, residents, etc..

Of course, I highly doubt the most staunchly anti-arena or "arenas/stadiums don't help cities" thinkers will ever acknowledge it. It will be written off as "the economy was improving anyway".

[creamcityleo79]

The fact that there is more buzz in the Sacramento forum than there has been for years has got to mean SOMETHING, right!?

[Majin]

Originally Posted by CAGeoNerd

Of course, I highly doubt the most staunchly anti-arena or "arenas/stadiums don't help cities" thinkers will ever acknowledge it. It will be written off as "the economy was improving anyway".

http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/member.php?u=25993

[Majin]

Originally Posted by creamcityleo79

The fact that there is more buzz in the Sacramento forum than there has been for years has got to mean SOMETHING, right!?

Yup, just wait when dirt starts flying at the DTP, I predict you will start seeing tons of proposals around the arena site.

[creamcityleo79]

Originally Posted by Majin

Yup, just wait when dirt starts flying at the DTP, I predict you will start seeing tons of proposals around the arena site.

I agree! Something I find interesting is that Milwaukee (my 2nd hometown) is actually going through something similar to what Sacramento has over the past 5+ years with their aging, too small arena. The NIMBYs there are tax NIMBYs (at least, they are on skyscrapercity.com and the editorial pages of the Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel). They don't want ANY tax dollars spent on a new arena as they feel the Bradley Center is just fine (a quick view on StreetView will find that not to be the case). They are under the impression that Seattle feels bad for them because they know how it feels to lose their team and wouldn't try to poach the Bucks (). I feel like I should tell them that they are woefully incorrect. But, I think I'll just let them see how it plays out.

[jbradway]

Originally Posted by creamcityleo79

I agree! Something I find interesting is that Milwaukee (my 2nd hometown) is actually going through something similar to what Sacramento has over the past 5+ years with their aging, too small arena. The NIMBYs there are tax NIMBYs (at least, they are on skyscrapercity.com and the editorial pages of the Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel). They don't want ANY tax dollars spent on a new arena as they feel the Bradley Center is just fine (a quick view on StreetView will find that not to be the case). They are under the impression that Seattle feels bad for them because they know how it feels to lose their team and wouldn't try to poach the Bucks (). I feel like I should tell them that they are woefully incorrect. But, I think I'll just let them see how it plays out.

Speaking from experience here. Most of the Seattle fans are pretty good and feel as you described. However there are more than a few who will flood your news forums with comments about tax dollars and anything else to turn opinion on building a new arena. They feel justified in stealing a team because that's what happened to them.

[creamcityleo79]

Originally Posted by jbradway

Speaking from experience here. Most of the Seattle fans are pretty good and feel as you described. However there are more than a few who will flood your news forums with comments about tax dollars and anything else to turn opinion on building a new arena. They feel justified in stealing a team because that's what happened to them.

Ironically, the first time a team was poached from Seattle, it was to Milwaukee.

[urban_encounter]

Originally Posted by Majin

Yup, just wait when dirt starts flying at the DTP, I predict you will start seeing tons of proposals around the arena site.

Is it too late to get on the Majin bandwagon.

[urban_encounter]

Originally Posted by creamcityleo79

Ironically, the first time a team was poached from Seattle, it was to Milwaukee.

Interesting

[urban_encounter]

Originally Posted by CAGeoNerd

Yup. And this is only the beginning. Been arguing for years now about an arena downtown and the impact it would have. Every week it seems something pops up just confirming what we've been trying to argue this entire time. We need civic amenities located in strategically good places in order to attract business, investment, residents, etc..

Of course, I highly doubt the most staunchly anti-arena or "arenas/stadiums don't help cities" thinkers will ever acknowledge it. It will be written off as "the economy was improving anyway".

You're right, unfortunately they're mostly wrong. Sacramento will get a lot of use from an arena and use it as a catalyst to help market DT as safer, more vibrant and something that will be a good ROI. If this were a $1.2 billion NFL stadium that gets used for 16/2 games a year it wouldn't pencil out.

[snfenoc]

I am happy to "admit" that I am one of those people. Post hoc ergo propter hoc.

I don't hate arenas, but I really don't think they are the economic boon that those who are desperate to put their hometowns on the map think they are. But I could be wrong. Maybe a down town arena will put us on the same level as Los Angeles and New York, and maybe monkeys will fly out of my butt.

[jbradway]

Originally Posted by snfenoc

I am happy to "admit" that I am one of those people. Post hoc ergo propter hoc.

I don't hate arenas, but I really don't think they are the economic boon that those who are desperate to put their hometowns on the map think they are. But I could be wrong. Maybe a down town arena will put us on the same level as Los Angeles and New York, and maybe monkeys will fly out of my butt.

Nice straw man.

What it will do is exactly what you are seeing it do now. Adjacent properties are being bought up and projects are getting kicked around again.

Nobody wants to be LA or NY. We just want Sacramento to have a better urban core. And the last 8-10 years, space available and bail bonds signs have dominated that end of town.