YVR Airport & Sea Island Developments Discussion

[sacrifice333]

If it's an early-booked Allegiant flight, a Bellingham trip can be worth while.

If you're not booking well in advance it seems that it's best to either stick with YVR or head farther south to SEA.

If flying Allegiant you do have to know the game though. When booking they will auto-option you out the ying-yang to the point that your flight is way more than the one you were comparing to our of YVR. Be aware, click with care!

When considering a trip on Allegiant you also need to be well aware of their baggage policies and fees. I.e. all checked baggage is paid, including golf clubs, etc. Carry-on baggage measurements are quite small and can be viciously monitored. For Allegiant I'd recommend a stuff-able duffel bag without wheels if you want to try to carry-on, lest you be sorely disappointed. (Note if they measure... challenge them and stuff it entirely into their measuring device!)

NOTE: Rumour has it that Allegiant will start service to Hawaii from Stockton and BELLINGHAM later this fall with new (to them) 757s!

[SpongeG]

they talked about that on TV the other day - or was it the radio... - that claire chick was talking about how bellingham is adding hawaii flights in the fall and expect to get some great deals - bellingham is shutting down in september to extend its runway... so allegiant had a big seat sale a couple months ago for the summer i guess to make up for the week or two they can't fly

i'd recommend priority boarding - you are guaranteed a spot at your seat for your carry on - the people who got on last had to seat miles away from where they had to put their stuff

[trofirhen]

Bellingham is ramping up for inexpensive flights to Hawaii ..... Seattle is ramping up for more flights to Asia and Europe ..... Toronto is making sure it becomes THE only real hub in Canada ..... Calgary, booming with oil revenue, is drawing more airlines .....

Is the sun setting ever so slowly on YVR? Pray not ............

[Johnny Aussie]

Originally Posted by trofirhen

Bellingham is ramping up for inexpensive flights to Hawaii ..... Seattle is ramping up for more flights to Asia and Europe ..... Toronto is making sure it becomes THE only real hub in Canada ..... Calgary, booming with oil revenue, is drawing more airlines .....

Is the sun setting ever so slowly on YVR? Pray not ............

Bellingham - Back in the 80s both US Airways and Alaska Airlines used to fly mainline jets about 6x daily. Allegiant is an interesting player, but the BLI thing is nothing new. Note YVR transborder traffic actually increased over 9% in May.
Seattle - always has surprised me they haven't had more international flights. I think SEA has finally caught up. Not so sure about "ramping" up though. I would say they have "ramped" up.
Toronto - AC will aways protect their mega-hub of course and the feds, well despite what anyone says, yes, they will always favour the Toronto fortress.
Calgary - that is always the perception...but maybe this statement would have been true a few years ago, but definitely not booming right now. example - employment has actually shrunk here by 0.5% since last year. And not noticing any more airlines (LH is actually reducing service this winter). "Drawing more airlines?" what are you referring to?

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by Johnny Aussie

Bellingham - Back in the 80s both US Airways and Alaska Airlines used to fly mainline jets about 6x daily. Allegiant is an interesting player, but the BLI thing is nothing new. Note YVR transborder traffic actually increased over 9% in May.
Seattle - always has surprised me they haven't had more international flights. I think SEA has finally caught up. Not so sure about "ramping" up though. I would say they have "ramped" up.
Toronto - AC will aways protect their mega-hub of course and the feds, well despite what anyone says, yes, they will always favour the Toronto fortress.
Calgary - that is always the perception...but maybe this statement would have been true a few years ago, but definitely not booming right now. example - employment has actually shrunk here by 0.5% since last year. And not noticing any more airlines (LH is actually reducing service this winter). "Drawing more airlines?" what are you referring to?

Being out of the country for over a decade, I guess I got my facts wrong. Excuse me. That Calgary is "drawing more airlines" came from an announcement I read that JAL is going to fly into there. (Not that it would hurt YVR much.) What rankles me is the feds allowing airlines into Toronto that they WON'T allow into Vancouver, forcing a change-of-plane in Toronto, when it sometimes shouldn't be necessary.

[Gordon]

JAL is an interesting they are in horrible financial trouble. i'm sort of surprised that they would be expanding seeing as they have 2 daily flights out of YVR.

What we need is is a balanced air policy in this country. One super hub may work in a European country that doesn't have the geographical footprint that Canada does.

Is the Federal government interfering with YVR's ability to get the China Southern Guangzhou & the Kingfisher Mumbai services going?

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by Gordon

What we need is is a balanced air policy in this country. One super hub may work in a European country that doesn't have the geographical footprint that Canada does.

Is the Federal government interfering with YVR's ability to get the China Southern Guangzhou & the Kingfisher Mumbai services going?

You betcha! (If in doubt, ask Don Baird)

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by trofirhen

Being out of the country for over a decade, I guess I got my facts wrong. Excuse me. That Calgary is "drawing more airlines" came from an announcement I read that JAL is going to fly into there. (Not that it would hurt YVR much.) What rankles me is the feds allowing airlines into Toronto that they WON'T allow into Vancouver, forcing a change-of-plane in Toronto, when it sometimes shouldn't be necessary.

I don't believe JAL's in a position to start flying to YYC. Perhaps you're thinking of the the Flight Air Canada added from YYC to NRT?

Of course if YVR is worried about their competitiveness, they could abolish their Airport Improvement Fee. like that will ever happen.

[Hourglass]

Originally Posted by Gordon

JAL is an interesting they are in horrible financial trouble. i'm sort of surprised that they would be expanding seeing as they have 2 daily flights out of YVR

JAL only flies daily out of Vancouver to Narita now (http://www.jal.co.jp/inter/time/pdf/america0328_0831.pdf.

Trofirhen, I don't believe there are any plans by JAL to start Calgary. As Gordon points out, they're in bankruptcy protection right now and axing routes. I think ANA used to -- or maybe still does -- run 1x weekly charter flights to Calgary during the summer, and Air Canada has launched Narita flights. Maybe you're thinking Korean Airlines? They've started Calgary during the summer months 3x/weekly to Seoul.

The number of flights between Japan and YVR have really shriveled up in recent years, I guess partly due to the stagnant Japanese economy. Not so long ago the summer peak season would see something like 25 flights per week between Vancouver and Tokyo Narita, Osaka and Nagoya. Now only Narita is left.

[Yume-sama]

JAL flies to Vancouver 2x daily 3x per week. They initially axed their MEX - YVR - NRT run... then a couple of weeks later re-instated it.

I don't believe they have any plans to fly to YYC. AC, however, is looking at making it daily year round, and not seasonal.

The Japanese economy is still in recession, for the 19th straight month, and shows no signs of rebounding.

The Japanese Yen, however, is still oddly high to the Canadian Dollar, compared to 2 years ago or so.

Speaking of NRT, when did AC start using the 777-300 for YVR - NRT?

[Hourglass]

Yume, yeah, I don't understand the strong currency either.

Whatnext, if YVR completely eliminated the AIF, fees somewhere else would have to go up (likely landing fees) due to the ground rent the airport authority pays every year to the federal government, which was over $65 million last year. It's a no-win as far as 'competitiveness' goes.

The AIF and federal ground rent payments to me are symbolic of a greater structural problem with Canadian transportation. The Air Canada CEO alluded to this in his presentation at the Annual General Meeting in May. Combine that with higher gax taxes than in the US, security charges (all of which of course is reinvested by the feds into security infrastructure, naturally... )... well you get the picture. Someone on Airliners.net broke down the cost of a ticket on YYZ-YUL roundtrip ticket on AC a couple of years ago as follows:

YYZ-YUL sector (Q Class): CAD$109.00
YUL-YYZ sector (Q Class): CAD$179.00
Total Fare: CAD$288.00

Navcan and Surcharges: CAD$58.00
Canada Airport Improvement Fee: CAD$27.00
Canada Security Charge: CAD$13.08
Canada-Quebec Sales Tax: CAD$1.20
Canada Goods and Service Tax: CAD$27.03
Total Charges: CAD$126.31

Total Fare: CAD$414.31


Is it any wonder people go south to Seattle or Bellingham?

[trofirhen]

Although not in sync with the previous posts, what about kicking up a hurricane to the the freaking feds allow other airlines to Vancouver?

Don't like Emirates? Fine. OK. How about Qatar Airways? Major Gulf destination.

And what about service direct to India? Air India? Kingfisher? Jet Airways?

They ALL serve Toronto. What are we supposed to do for the rest of our lives? Fly to YYZ, and connect? That's what it seems. And few people on this forum seem to blink.

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by Gordon

JAL is an interesting they are in horrible financial trouble. i'm sort of surprised that they would be expanding seeing as they have 2 daily flights out of YVR.

What we need is is a balanced air policy in this country. One super hub may work in a European country that doesn't have the geographical footprint that Canada does.

Is the Federal government interfering with YVR's ability to get the China Southern Guangzhou & the Kingfisher Mumbai services going?

Good luck on that one! I'm behind you 100%, but you have to remember that in the Feds' eyes, Ontario IS Canada, and that's the way they like it!!
It's enough to make you chuck.

[nova9]

Originally Posted by trofirhen

Good luck on that one! I'm behind you 100%, but you have to remember that in the Feds' eyes, Ontario IS Canada, and that's the way they like it!!
It's enough to make you chuck.

apparently, having a PM from the West is not enough eh?

[Yume-sama]

Yuck. Not one who panders SO MUCH to the extreme, to pretend that he is a Leafs fan.

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by nova9

apparently, having a PM from the West is not enough eh?

I don't care where the PM is from. Ontario is STILL Canada in their view.

[Yume-sama]

Apparently Mexicana Airlines had three airplanes seized at Toronto, Calgary, and Vancouver. They were sub-leased by AC... who took them back forcefully

Well, now at least JAL may HAVE to fly NRT - YVR - MEX lol

Looks like Mexicana is about to collapse imminently...

[trofirhen]

Knowing now that the Transport Minister John Baird has nixed direct Emirates flights from Vancouver, as well as direct flights from Vancouver to India (... this is CANADA ... so change planes in Toronto...)
.... while looking at the Wikipedia site for Sea-Tac Airport, it seems that EMIRATES is planning, in the near future, direct Sea-Tac > < Dubai flights using the
good old BOEING 787.

Oh Toronto, capital of the world!! What blessings more may we bestow upon you?!?!

[Yume-sama]

Hmm. I'd be willing to cross border for that Even if going to America is an unholy PITA.

As for the Mexicana situation, they are flying to Canada using A320's now. After 4 of their A319's were unceremoniously stolen from them

Plane-jacking is serious business.

[AlexYVR]

Originally Posted by trofirhen

Knowing now that the Transport Minister John Baird has nixed direct Emirates flights from Vancouver, as well as direct flights from Vancouver to India (... this is CANADA ... so change planes in Toronto...)
.... while looking at the Wikipedia site for Sea-Tac Airport, it seems that EMIRATES is planning, in the near future, direct Sea-Tac > < Dubai flights using the
good old BOEING 787.

Oh Toronto, capital of the world!! What blessings more may we bestow upon you?!?!

Yeah Trof I don't quite get what you're trying to accomplish by bringing them to Vancouver as I, for one, will always go to Seattle to fly if it costs less $$. Which it inevitably will.